Topic: Misc. Maintenance Questions (probably weird. . . lol)

[MoTo-BunnY]

Portland here is in the midst of our monsoon season - LOTS of rain, so the bike went into temporary drydock for the week and I'm doing some routine maintenance. . . first up, has been the oil pan remove / clean / replace (with new gasket and bolts.  . oh, and oil *duh*)  KIDS! clean those oil pans!!! lol  Honda says how often in the owners manual, I think, but just do it! I found all sorts of gunk and sludge off the bottom of the pan and some stuff stuck to the pick up screen (fortunately, no metal bits or anything).

But some questions before I bolt the pan back up. . .  .

1. OK, what's the final verdict on gasket goop on the oil pan o-ring gasket - a bit of oill, like an auto oil filter gasket and that's it?  not even a really thin-n-careful bit of permatex stuff on the rubber gasket or anything?  I read all the other posts on this. . .  but I just really really want it to be sealed all nice...  must  .  .use . .  . ..gasket. . stuff . . . . .can't .   .stop. . . .    lol

2. With said oil pan - Honda used 'flange bolts' stock. I can just use my snazzy new stainless allen head bolts with washers, right? I mean, the flange bolts don't actually seal anything. . . .    ?correct?

3. I picked up a pair of new clutch and brake levers and they have this plastic dip stuff on the 'ball-ends' (is that a word?) like some tool handles have. .  . .why? I think Honda did this stock, too, I think, but why? to prevent your fingers from slipping off? to prevent you from scraping against someones paint job? to help reflect the laser beams that the sharks are shooting at you from their heads?

I've had a couple glasses of wine and I'm probably totally over-analyzing here. . .  .but just thought I would check the mightly collective wisdom o' the SOHC4 forum, though. .  . lol    

[SteveD CB500F]

Surely it's about 7am in Oregon?  Drinking early? Drinking late??

Anyway.  The lever ends were covered in black plastic originally and if you buy new levers from somehere like David Silver, he will sell you the little plastic bit separately. Not sure what it was for originally. Nowadays I guess it's more a question of originality.

[Bob Wessner]

My levers, believed to be original, also have the black ball ends, but what use to be clear plastic coating extending up the levers a bit. They are yellowing some now. I can only assume it was intended for better control? Burnished aluminum might be kind of slippery with gloves on. Not sure. When I dropped my oil pan, on replacing with a new gasket, I used no additional sealer. It's fine, no leaks. Can't offer an opinion on the bolts though, I used the originals with some anti-sleaze.

[oldfart]

Sealer on gaskets?  Except for the head gasket, unecessary.  This is what happens when you use silicone sealer on gasket surfaces.  The "blue worms" are sticking to the oil pump pickup screen, left over from what squeezed into the crankcase on the inside of the glued covers and fell into the oil supply.  Not a good thing.

[Dave K]

The clear coating on the levers were to keep you from getting aluminum black on your hands or gloves from using them. I always wondered what they used to dip them him so I could repolish my yellowed ones and recoat them.

[kghost]

Those Flange bolts just increase the surface area under the bolt head.

My opinion is that using allen head's with washers would be equivalent.

Course why you would use them on the bottom where they can't be seen is another question.....

A Light application of three bond prolly wouldn't kill anything ...

Its not really needed but if it makes you feel better have at it.

I'd stay away from the silicon.







But I'll bet that by this time you've already slapped it back together.

[ofreen]

2. With said oil pan - Honda used 'flange bolts' stock. I can just use my snazzy new stainless allen head bolts with washers, right? I mean, the flange bolts don't actually seal anything. . . .    ?correct?

The purpose of the flange is to distribute the clamping force of the bolt over a wider area and also to provide a locking function.  I think I'd be inclined to stay with the stock bolts.

[kghost]

2. With said oil pan - Honda used 'flange bolts' stock. I can just use my snazzy new stainless allen head bolts with washers, right? I mean, the flange bolts don't actually seal anything. . . .    ?correct?

The purpose of the flange is to distribute the clamping force of the bolt over a wider area and also to provide a locking function.  I think I'd be inclined to stay with the stock bolts.

Placing a washer of the same relative size as the flange under the head of the allen bolt would accomplish the same thing 

With the surface of the flange bolt being smooth where it contacts the surface...it serves no locking function.

[ofreen]

With the surface of the flange bolt being smooth where it contacts the surface...it serves no locking function.

Well, typically flanged bolts are designed with a little bit of relief under the flange toward the shank so that the flange is loaded when the bolt is torqued.  That provides a locking function.

[kghost]

With the surface of the flange bolt being smooth where it contacts the surface...it serves no locking function.

Well, I'm not going to argue about it, but flanged bolts are designed with a little bit of relief under the flange toward the shank so that the flange is loaded when the bolt is torqued.

Bout the same as the relief provided by sticking an allen bolt thru a washer? 

[ofreen]

Bout the same as the relief provided by sticking an allen bolt thru a washer? 

No, not the same at all.  On a flanged bolt or nut, the outside of the flange is pressed against the surface.  A flat washer is pressed down in the middle.

[kghost]

Bout the same as the relief provided by sticking an allen bolt thru a washer? 

No, not the same at all.  On a flanged bolt or nut, the outside of the flange is pressed against the surface.  A flat washer is pressed down in the middle.

A more apt discription would be the total area of the flange is pressed down.

As for the center of the washer?....would depend on the thickness of the washer. Don't count on alot of deformation, the aluminum threads will distort before that happens.

[MoTo-BunnY]

very interesting. . . you guys have some Honda wisdom, fo' sure. . . .lol.

I don't want 'worms' in my oil pan so just the gasket, it is . ..      I am using the ss allen heads all over the whole bike because they are pretty, won't do that electrolysis stuff with the aluminum, and it makes my bikes tool kit really simple (don't have the stock one so I had to assemble my own kit).

The rubbery coating stuff is only on the very tips of the new levers I bought - it looks just like that 'plasti-dip' stuff. Like, you dip the plier handles into so they get coated and rubberized? I think they have that in clear (I know there's several different colors) so you all that want to get rid of the yellowed coating could probably just strip it all off and dip the whole lever into clear plasti-dip? (whatever the actual brand name is. . .just recalling my brother-in-law using that stuff on tools. . thought it was pretty neat)

anyways. . .. .thanks for the help!   I was just sipping some wine after an evening of bike maintenance and pondering the wonders of the old Honda universe. .  . .. 

[kghost]

What Kind of wine?

[medic09]

I'd recommend the Cordova Rioja.  Yellow or White label.  They're both good.  Eminently suitable for such pursuits.

 

[kghost]

I'd recommend the Cordova Rioja.  Yellow or White label.  They're both good.  Eminently suitable for such pursuits.

 

From spain? Spain?

The horror...the horror...........

[Bob Wessner]

MoTo,

Thanks for the tip on Plasti-dip, it does come in clear as well as you said. Now I can get rid of the yellow.

http://www.caswellplating.com/aids/plastidip.html

[medic09]

I'd recommend the Cordova Rioja.  Yellow or White label.  They're both good.  Eminently suitable for such pursuits.

 

From spain? Spain?

The horror...the horror...........

You were expecting maybe from Japan?  Sake?   

[gar]

I'm so very glad MoToBunny brough this up... I've got the Honda 10w40 and the oil filter in my garage right now, and planned to clean the oil screen filter and pan too.... but anticipating using using form-a-gasket before I put the pan back on.

So what you are saying is that there is a gasket I should buy from the Honda dealership before I drop the pan and do not use auto-style form-a-gasket?  I just read the service manual and I didn't note any reference to the gasket   

Regards, Gary

[MoTo-BunnY]

MoTo,

Thanks for the tip on Plasti-dip, it does come in clear as well as you said. Now I can get rid of the yellow.

http://www.caswellplating.com/aids/plastidip.html

yay! that is soooo kewl that I could actually help with a tip, as newbie as I am to motorcycles     My local Ace hardware (where I also get a lot of my stainless steel hardware odds-n-ends I don't purchase from McMaster Carr) actually carries Plasti-Dip. Most of the tools I use the most have it on their handles. .. much easier on the hands 



I do love sake - and that would seemingly be very appropriate! But it was actually a Pinot Noir (my fave) from Macedonia - Avia brand. Cheap, effective, and pretty good, actually . . .I would also recommend Walnut Crest merlot (another fave) from Chile as far as 'cost effective' wines. Now if someone else were buying (lol), I would have to go with Châteauneuf-du-Pape
. . .man-o-man is that stuff SOOoooooo good. . . .but its also like $50+ a bottle 

[MoTo-BunnY]

I'm so very glad MoToBunny brough this up... I've got the Honda 10w40 and the oil filter in my garage right now, and planned to clean the oil screen filter and pan too.... but anticipating using using form-a-gasket before I put the pan back on.

So what you are saying is that there is a gasket I should buy from the Honda dealership before I drop the pan and do not use auto-style form-a-gasket?  I just read the service manual and I didn't note any reference to the gasket   

Regards, Gary

That's why I have been in search of the highest resolution quality parts manual I can find (still haven't gotten one any better than whats off of Honda4Fun which are usable but not detailed enough with the really small stuff). Its such a handy accompaniment to the service manual which doesn't always have the most comprehensive description of things. My parts manual has this about the gasket "Part # 11398-323-000   Gasket, Oil Pan" (for CB500 - my manual only covers up to the K2 but its probably the same?). A bunch of sellers on eBay sell the gasket by itself, but I got mine in a complete gasket set. Its like a giant 'O-ring' that is formed into square (with one slanted corner) and fits into the groove (which is sharp as hell - my bike bit me, there!)

[kghost]

I like the way you posted the Chateauneuf link 

Seriously you were close with chile...just hop over the border to argentina for the good stuff.

[MoTo-BunnY]

I like the way you posted the Chateauneuf link    ((((I had to check spelling . . lol. . . and then found the read really interesting and linked to it. . . gotta love wikipedia    ))))

Seriously you were close with chile...just hop over the border to argentina for the good stuff.

any specific recommendations on Argentinian wine? the Walnut Crest from Chile really is good stuff - it was tops in some fancy wine magazine a few years ago, as far as inexpensive but really good wine goes.

I will say Argentina beef is the shizit. . I love beef that is grass fed 'free range' or whatever.  .  not all fatty like most Americans like. . . ick. I guess Australian beef is supposed to be like that too. .  .  so, yeah, count me in on some good Argentina steak-n-wine, anytime.. .  .

[kghost]

Tell me about it I was born there....still miss it 

Wasn't too impressed with the Ozzie beef while I was there (As I prepare for flaming PM's from terry)

I went right thru that region in france in march btw.

[MoTo-BunnY]

wow  .. . .very kewl. I need to travel outside the US more. I have been to Canada a bunch, but that's it. I've been all over the US though, all but like 5 or 6 states?

I declined the opportunity to go to Argentina in 2000 on a college class trip 'cause I am still afraid to fly.. .lol.  (I had a REALLY bad flight in 1994 where I was sure we were going to crash in bad turbulance - I've never felt that helpless and scared in my life!)

Have any good familia recipes for that sauce stuff they use on steaks, down there? It had to have chilli in it, I know that much, it was real spicy and I LOVE spicy (lived in New Mexico for 3 years. .. .got real used to chilli there. . hopelessly addicted to it, now. .  he he) I love beef too. .  ..I don't eat a whole lot of meat but when I do, its beef med-rare . .  .yummy

[USN20]

The black rubber ball end tips that fit on the clutch and brake levers can be purchased from Honda for around $2.85 each and the part number is: 95010-16001

I picked up a set to put on my '70 H-D    

(they help keep your fingers from sliding off the lever ends)

[Bob Wessner]

I'm so very glad MoToBunny brough this up... I've got the Honda 10w40 and the oil filter in my garage right now, and planned to clean the oil screen filter and pan too.... but anticipating using using form-a-gasket before I put the pan back on.

So what you are saying is that there is a gasket I should buy from the Honda dealership before I drop the pan and do not use auto-style form-a-gasket?  I just read the service manual and I didn't note any reference to the gasket   

Regards, Gary

Gar, yes, there should be a gasket. Try your local Honda dealer, or go to one of the on-line parts sites that has the parts fische for look-up. I recently had to pick one up for my 750 and was lucky enough that they actually had one on the shelf so I didn't have to wait for them to order it.