Topic: Jakal cb550 project

[Darren Jakal]

Hey Bill,

Glad you enjoy the build, I'm having a blast with it when I can get to it.

Both the engine stand and bike stand are made with left over materials from another project. The engine stand is, of course, an auto engine stand that I adapted using ideas I gathered here. When I make something I usually try to leave things long and then trim at the end in case I need a place to grab or something happens and I want to alter the design.

Anyway I don't plan on splitting the case, but I read enough posts on the potential to split the case with some stands so I decided the incorporate the two uprights that accept 1 inch solid aluminum round bar that can then be used to create a support for a case half.

Check out the picture. I always like to leave my options open and so far they haven't gotten in the way too much.

cheers Darren

[bill440cars]

Hey Bill,

Glad you enjoy the build, I'm having a blast with it when I can get to it.

Both the engine stand and bike stand are made with left over materials from another project. The engine stand is, of course, an auto engine stand that I adapted using ideas I gathered here. When I make something I usually try to leave things long and then trim at the end in case I need a place to grab or something happens and I want to alter the design.

Anyway I don't plan on splitting the case, but I read enough posts on the potential to split the case with some stands so I decided the incorporate the two uprights that accept 1 inch solid aluminum round bar that can then be used to create a support for a case half.

Check out the picture. I always like to leave my options open and so far they haven't gotten in the way too much.

cheers Darren

            Thank you, Darren. I appreciate your taking the time to talk about the engine stand. I have been looking at doing something, in the way of a stand, myself. So, anything I can come across, that might help me to do mine, will definitely help.   

[RAFster122s]

Godffery's Phenolic piston is the way to go...lots of positives, no negatives.  The pitting on your piston will allow weeping or seal wear which is not good.

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

Godffery's Phenolic piston is the way to go...lots of positives, no negatives.  The pitting on your piston will allow weeping or seal wear which is not good.

Yes! It's lighter and corrosion proof. No brainier!

[Darren Jakal]

Hey, thanks guys for your interest in my humble project. This place is a fantastic resource and motivator. Unfortunately I've had to move recently and work on the bike has been slow (it’s also been -20C for awhile and skiing is on, too). The bike is now housed in a 20 foot seacan I'm modifying to be a studio / workshop (an experiment I call CoHo for Container Home). So, the move has put me a ways away from my old neighbour and friend who happens to be among many things a top level mechanic, machinist, gunsmith etc, so I'm really going to be dependent on this place in the next few months to get me through this build.

Thanks for your help with the brake piston Godffery and anyone else that can offer information or advice on getting an old bike like this one back on the road safely.

What about rebuilding the master cylinder? What are the must-replace parts and what can you safely keep? I haven't tried taking it apart yet as I'm afraid of damaging the outer rubber seal (or is this a must-replace part as it's almost 40 years old, although I'm amazed at how good the rubber on this bike is) and I don't think I have the tools to get the various clips out.

Anyway, I’ll continue to do my own searches and when I’m ready to move on any of this I will post more specific questions in the main forum.

Thanks again everyone! Happy New Year!
Darren

[RAFster122s]

UI don't recall if it was 4 into 1 or cb750supply that carries the same generic repro master cylinder for less than most rebuild kits.  It is around $50 at DavidSilversSpares.com but far less at either of the two aforementioned places.  Just easier to bolt on a replacement than go through the trouble of a rebuild.

You can then disassembly yours without worry and if you find a replacement rebuild kit you can redo it if you want the original.  Once disassembled you can determine if the bore is good and just needs cleaning and new seals/rebuild kit.

[Godffery]

 If there was no brown Muck in your reservoir, then you may be able to just flush some fresh fluid threw it and off you go.  I do however recommend you replace your old rubber lines. Braided stainless is the best but not "necessary".
 If you intend on going with twin discs, then you will want to upgrade to a larger master anyway.

[Darren Jakal]

Thanks RAF for the information on the generic MC.

I am really happy to hear that this one may be re-used with a bit of clean-up as it looks pretty much brand new and the fluid looked fine (no sludge), so thanks for that tip Goddfery.

Hey Goddfery is it you that sells the stainless lines? My plan was to replace these, but I haven't gotten around to sourcing them yet, so if you can help with the piston and lines I would be grateful.

Cheers, Darren

[Godffery]

Hey Goddfery is it you that sells the stainless lines? My plan was to replace these, but I haven't gotten around to sourcing them yet, so if you can help with the piston and lines I would be grateful.

Cheers, Darren

I sell just about everything (Pistons, Seals, Calipers & Masters) EXCEPT the stainless lines. For that I go to Shawn (fellow SOHC4 member) you can contact him directly at http://www.slingshotcycles.com/

 Here is a link to my Parts & services page: http://www.vinmoto.org/gallery/v/VinMoto-Garage/album03/Godfferys-Garage-123/Parts+and+service/  To order, just email me directly at jstephens7@wi.rr.com

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

Jeff's phenolic pistons are pretty cool. Not only do they save some weight, they are nearly indestructible and do not corrode.

[Godffery]

Jeff's phenolic pistons are pretty cool. Not only do they save some weight, they are nearly indestructible and do not corrode.

Well, they can be chipped or scratched before they are installed if you're not careful.  But once they are in, yes, pretty much.

[Darren Jakal]

OK got it Goddfery, thanks for your help. Thanks Fan!

It was slow at work today so I was able to make a centring jig for the turntable and drilled the disc. It went surprisingly easy. Did a little work on the handlebar control switches. Coming along, slow and sure.

Cheers, Darren

[Darren Jakal]

Right. I remember reading about that here, so I did a very minimal de-burr.

Cheers, dj

[Darren Jakal]

Tapered Roller Bearings NOT ALL BALLS

Thanks to everyone that comments in these threads, it’s what makes this place so great. I generally like to do my research and then ask here before I start a project. So now I’m ready to take the bike down to the frame and I’m tackling the steering system next. I might also post specific questions in the main forum.

I have the triple tree out and will remove the races from the frame and steering tube soon. I have new roller bearings from TwoWheelsFrank (also known as Kenosha_kid on ebay) and I’m going through the steps to hopefully do this once and forever.

These bearings are labeled JMT (Hamburg, www.jmproducts.eu) and are called

Lenkkopf-Kegelrollenlager
Steering stem taper roller bearings

The back of the package also says:

Kegelrollenlagersatz SSH 750
Honda
CB 250/350/400/550/650/750
CBX 550 etc

The two bearings are different in diameter and are labeled:

N/H2G4815 (smaller) &
N/H305014 (bigger).

The kit came with a single large washer and no instructions.

I emailed TwoWheelsFrank and he told me that if he remembers right the washer goes beneath the lower bearing. By all the accounts I have seen (ALL BALLS anyway) this appears to be the norm and that is where I will put them unless anyone thinks different.

What the package does NOT contain are any dust seals and this is a question I have.

Should I try and save the old dust seal and reuse it?
Find a new one somewhere?
Make my own?
Don’t worry about it?

Anyway, I’ll take my time and hopefully do it right the first time. I will post updates as they occur and thanks for any help!

Cheers, Darren

[Darren Jakal]

I've been able to some work done on the bike and it is now down to the frame. The head stock races are removed and I will install the new races once the frame has been finished.

I have also removed the swingarm and the bushings are out. Unfortunately, even though there appears to be low milage on the bike, the swingarm "collar" (as it is known in the parts fiche or also referred to as the pivot) it out of tolerance.

Anyway, I'm looking for either a good used one (there are two used parts places near by and I can measure them in person as I don't like the idea of buying a used part like this online where the specs are pretty tight) or I will find a new one (I have seen some already). If it comes to it I may try to make or modify something to get things to spec, buy buying new old stock would be easiest and it seems possibly an upgrade.

The research I have done (thanks Hondaman) tells me that I have the inferior later style collar with no grease groves and only one grese fitting in the centre of the swing arm.  It looks like any of the older style collars that have grease grooves and use a bolt with grease fittings on either end will work in this bike. The bushing I have bought from TwoWheelsFrank should work on any of the collar styles (looks like 4 different ones in total). This makes me want to find one of the older style ones.

If anyone knows a place with decent prices that ship to Canada I would appreciate hearing about it.

cheers, Darren

Hondaman picture from this thread:

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,46432.0.html

[firebane]

Making good progress and I feel you on the cold. Even with a portable heater my shop doesn't warm up.

Would you be interested in drilling another brake disc?

[Darren Jakal]

Hey firebane

I could do some drilling. You supply the drill bits and hopefully don't want some swiss cheese disc (I did 9X3 or 27 holes and it wasn't too bad) and we could work something out.

Later, dj

[Stev-o]

looking good, I just caught up on your project...

[Darren Jakal]

Thanks Stev-o

Coming along, slow but steady.

cheers, dj

[Darren Jakal]

Well I was able to find a good used collar (pivot) at my local motorcycle shop. I was surprised to see that it is within specs and for $30 CDN pesos it was a no-brainer.

It is the newer style without the grease grooves, however. Not sure if I will modify it with grooves or go with it as-is with the new bronze bushings. Still time to decide before the bike is on the road.

Later, dj

[Darren Jakal]

The bike is down to the frame, the headstock races are out and I'm waiting until after painting to install the new ones. The swing arm is also off and I have new bronze bushings and a good used collar. I'll install the bushings once the swing arm is finished. I wanted to be able to work on the body parts and well as the front end, so I made a quick front end stand that can be clamped or bolted to a number of objects (bench, saw horse, etc).

I'm also starting to mock-up the seat/rear cowl and I've just started on making a wooden form to build a seat pan on. I'm still working out the basics of the geometry and determining the final body position (seat height, handle bar type using the stock pegs). The form still needs more work, but you can kind of see where it's going. Like Stev-o named his project a "Park Racer" as he isn't racing to cafes, I refer to this build as a "cafe commuter" as I'll use some cafe styling but I don't plan on going too fast.

I've been looking into different types of bars and ergonomics and found some interesting reads. Check this one out:

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,116649.0.html

I'll probably mock-up body positions and build some more working models until I find out what works.

Later, dj

[calj737]

I like the seat choice. The one thing I hate about our 550s, is the damn seat rails droop under the seat. It always makes the rails visible without either cutting them out and replacing them, or extending the cowl to cover them. That isn't always an issue, but that would disrupt the bottom lines of the tank you've chosen and ruin the seat.

That seat would lend itself well to some superbike bars and mild position rear set for a hooligan-type posture.

[Darren Jakal]

Hi Cal, Thanks for your comments.

So, that's just a wooden form for making a seat pan. The final seat shape will be built on top. I'm building this so that I can make the patterns for cutting the sheet metal and to then use it to form the bends and hold it for tack welding. I'll then pad and upholster it with leather. I like to experiment so I'll try different ways to make a seat and evaluate.

Making the transitions between the the rear cowl, seat and tank in relation to the frame rails is where I will spend some time (I've been shaping the frame a bit in the rear as I like it exposed). These kinds of details makes or breaks a build in my opinion.

Before I go much further I want to get the handlebars so I can get a feeling for the body position(s) and adjust seat height and length (closer to tank or farther away?) as needed (not looking for a hooligan-type posture, but a second position to get low when at speed I think could work with some bending of the elbow).

Right now I'm drawn to the Norman Hyde M Bar, but finding them locally is not easy (I like to see before I buy). There is place in Nova Scotia that has them on their website that I might try.

Anyway, thanks again, Darren

[Stev-o]

I have the M bars on my 550F, like them very much

[Darren Jakal]

Good to know you like them Stev-o. I've read a few members comments on them and I can't remember any disappointments.

I'd like to see a pic of the 550F. Love the Park Racer, too.