Topic: 1975 550 Bearing replacement - wheels and steering

[Gene]

I started this in the http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/board,2.0.html section and it was suggested I move it to the projects forum.

I'll start from the beginning, but some parts may be edited.

[Gene]

m about to do a bunch of stuff to my 550 which I have never attempted before.  There are plenty of threads with details about these undertakings, and I think I have them all bookmarked, plus I have the FSM.  I'm starting this for 2 reasons:
1) I will probably come up with some questions and
2) It will help me keep track. 

The plan is:

* Replace wheel bearings front and rear
* Replace steering bearings if worn w/tapered (or repack existing if not worn)
* Replace Rocker cover because of the ubiquitous "egging" of intake valve #1
* New Chain (no problem)
* Various little things (new crush exhaust gaskets, carb boots, wheel/spoke scrubbing, front caliper housing paint, etc.)  Hopefully the little stuff won't be difficult but something always happens.
* Whatever else I come across that needs doing while I have everything apart.

This isn't a build, just maintenance, but - again - I'm opening this thread to keep track and archive problems/questions/solutions.  I've been meaning to do these things (with the exception of the chain . . . that just came up in the last month) for a little over a year. I want it to be in the same category as the fabulous 750 I just bought from Johnie, the having of which allows me the luxury of shutting down the 550 while I get this done.

I know this is nothing compared to the work most of you do on your bikes but it's a lot for me, especially if I have to pull the forks all way to install the tapered bearings.

I'll try to update as things go along with pics and such.

Thank you in advance for your patience and for all of the information stored on this site.

[Gene]

The bike has 45K + miles and I can pretty much guarantee the wheel bearings have never been replaced I can feel they're draggy.

Suspension is good but I will probably drain and replace the fork oil - I'm already going to be there. I don't know that they need rebuilding - but I may end up pulling them apart anyway to check.

[Gene]

rear bearing retainer.  I've seen some makeshift tools - even tried a couple myself just now.  Question is, do these need drilling?  The manual doesn't address it.  I'm aware of the lefty threading. (please ignore the grime). Can you tell from the pic?  I'm soaking it in PB right now and thinking about my next attempted tool. I could try to punch it.

I think I answered my own question - http://blacksquaremotorcycle.com/how-to-drill-out-stakes/

That's what mine looks like. 

p.s. Working back-to-front (one end at a time)

*gotta come back to this in a few days - please forgive 9/14/16 21:23*

p.p.s. - the banged-up metal isn't my doing, someone has been in here before.



 

[Mace]

The picture hasn't come through for me, try re submitting it.

I had an absolute pig of a time getting the front and rear retainers out of my 500. One thing for sure is you need the specific tools. I had to drill the holes on my rear retainer to match the position of the retainer removal tool. Only a little, then gently hit it on with a soft  hammer. You definitely need some strong arms to get them off, they were an absolute pig on mine.

Sent from my E2303 using Tapatalk

[Gene]

The picture hasn't come through for me, try re submitting it.

I had an absolute pig of a time getting the front and rear retainers out of my 500. One thing for sure is you need the specific tools. I had to drill the holes on my rear retainer to match the position of the retainer removal tool. Only a little, then gently hit it on with a soft  hammer. You definitely need some strong arms to get them off, they were an absolute pig on mine.

Sent from my E2303 using Tapatalk

I need to resubmit all the pictures - I was moving this from one thread to the project thread - in the meantime you can go here (this is taking a little longer than I thought)
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,160290.msg1844077.html#msg1844077

The pics are uploaded there.  I ended up drilling out the stakes and tapping with a drift to get it started - then I used this little strap-hanger thing as a "wrench".  When I re-installed I put some thread-locker on it but didn't restake.

[NobleHops]

Hey-o

You absolutely should drill those. You don't need to drill much, use a 1/8 drill bit and just go down 1/8 inch. Blast out the swarf, you don't want debris left behind, that defeats the purpose of drilling them. They are, as noted, reverse thread. This tool is eleventy billion times better than those POS tools you find being peddled at Dime City and elsewhere:

https://www.amazon.com/OTC-6613-Variable-Spanner-Wrench/dp/B000F5JMEA

Has multiple size tips, infinitely adjustable.

Drill it, blast it out, heat it up with a propane torch for 30 seconds if you like, spray a wee bit of PB Blaster into the threads after you heat it and let it wick in. Get your buddy to hold the wheel and give 'er hell (in REVERSE :-) ). If you do it right it will break loose and unscrew cleanly and you can reuse the retainer. They aren't that cheap.

When you reinstall tighten it till it grounds pretty solidly on the new bearing, take your smallest pin punch, lay it in the threads at least a half inch away from the old ones for good measure and give it one good whack for each spot (x4). You're just trying to crush a few threads together, just like Honda did, don't murder it.

Good luck and report back!

N.

[Gene]

Nice tool - I should have gotten one of those.  As it is I'm all done, just trying to find time to update everything and add the pics.  It rolls like a dream now - so much so I need to do some brake adjustments to make sure it stops.

[Gene]

OK, to keep with the thread (transfer) moving some replies.

this should be in the projects section.
i agree, replace the steering bearings while you're in there. also swing arm bushings while you're at it.
how is your suspension, is this a good time to go over the forks?

How many miles on the bike, Gene?

If relitively low miles and in good condition, why not just check the wheel bearings and then decide if new ones are necessary?

+1 on the tapered bearings in the steering head.  It's really not difficult once you figure out how to get the front end off the ground.  I installed a piece of angle iron to my ceiling joists and use a ratchet strap to hoist up the front end, works great.

Thanks for the replies.  I do already have the tapered bearings.  Since I don't have ceiling joists I'm going to make a "table", attach a couple of eye screws and use tie-down straps to hold the front end up.

The bike has 45K + miles and I can pretty much guarantee the wheel bearings have never been replaced I can feel they're draggy.

Suspension is good but I will probably drain and replace the fork oil - I'm already going to be there. I don't know that they need rebuilding - but I may end up pulling them apart anyway to check.

off to the races.

At 45K, prolly a good idea to replace wheel bearings.  When I redid the front end of my K4, I changed the springs, fork seals and of course oil.   Progressive Springs are about $80 bucks, may as well change em too. 

No joists, you sure? What is the sheetrock screwed to??

Everything can be done off the center stand also if you have one with a little support like a jack or 2X4 for insurance. Best one end at a time.

My own p.s. - ended up working back to front.

[Gene]

Pics from the first go-round.  BTW, using a BFH and brute force is not the way to remove bearings.  Learned, and moving on.  Lost 2 good tools from my Father but I will hang the pic of my F-up on the wall of my garage to remind me.

Pics from round one. (p.s. - got the race out)

[Gene]

Aug 20 2016

Update day 1.  Pipes off, gaskets out, rear wheel off, sprocket off, looking at the retainer as described above.  Since the pipes were off I gave 'em a scrub and will work a little harder to get the rust off where it's settling.  No holes, that's good. Wiped up the hub (not pictured) so as to be a little less embarrassed.

The stakes need to be drilled and I have the bit to do it.  Also need to fab up a METAL tool for a retainer remover.  Had one for my Makita grinder/saw (used it for ceramic tile cutting), but I gave it away three years ago - wrong size anyway. Damnable.

Have 2 "rust welded" exhaust posts, will refresh or replace - cheap fix.  Need to pick up a small Metal Rescue for a couple of things.

She ain't the prettiest girl at the dance but she rolls with the best of them, once the new bearings are all in she'll be even more of a runner.

BTW - I have a couple of weeks to get this all done, and I intend to take it.  I've rushed things before with minor but stupid consequences.  To iterate, I am not a great mechanic, and this thread is for those of us who are not that talented but still want to do our own work.

These are, as the title of this forum implies, simple machines.  The fact that they can go very fast implies that we should be sure when we do work that it is complete and done well.

Anyway, enough for one day.  I am, by nature, a lazy man and it's time for a Tom Collins.

Updates tomorrow . . . probably

p.s. - pics come up correctly if opened.  friggin Mac . . .

[Gene]

Got an offer from Alacrity for a lifter, found a gentleman closer - friend of the family with a stupid collection . . . I mean that in a good way, of motorcycles - all Ducati (racing) or Harley (collector - cool old 1958 bike!).  Decided not to use a front stand and a jack instead.  Alacrity - still owe you whiskey.  I'm Irish and never forget.

Anyway - next section:

What I wanted to get done: Retainer off, rear bearings replaced, new chain, move on.

What I got done: Retainer off, most of the old bearings out.

Not optimal but tickled all the same.  Drilled out the stakes which were deeper than I originally thought. Got the retainer off - NOTE: I hit it with a rat-a-tat-tat with a punch a little harder than I wanted to, but that got it started without damage - used a rubber mallet.  Also, if anyone has a strap hanger around, it's actually the perfect size - and pre-drilled - for use as a retainer-remover with a couple of bolts in it. (I'm cleaning my spokes, please ignore - in the pic).

Banged the snot out of the bearings with a 3 lb. maul and ended up trashing them, also leaving a race on one side.  Any suggestions re:removal? Heat? As well as sticking two tools together inside the spacer which will need to be filed down or replaced (the spacer).  I got a little over-zealous. Again, if anyone has a plan as to how to separate these - please let me know.  In the meantime I'll keep plodding along.

As messed up as this is I'm learning a helluva lot.  Did a dry fit of the bearings on the one side I could and things look good there.  Slow going tho, and I've got a full week with no bike time except riding to and from work. I'll pick up again next weekend.

Those who have reached out I will be in contact this week.  What the hell happened to the weekend?"

Edit: As noted later, get a bearing puller.  I lost two tools, a ridiculous amount of time and 50 bucks more than I had to because I was an idiot.

[Gene]

BTW - this is where I was before figuring this s&*t out.

:"Gents, right now I'm fcuked.  I can't move forward without getting that rear wheel race out, and I don't know what else to do . I've tried to weaken it by cutting a portion with a dremel (avoiding the hub itself). Soaked in PB, "froze" with that canned air you use for cleaning keyboards etc. Banged the snot out of it.  Where do I go from here? Should it be this hard? I trashed the bearing knocking it out, but the race stuck.  Have I destroyed my hub?

Just curious.

Thanks.

Edit - Fcuk it.  I'm breaking out the drill.

Edit 2: Sh!t, that's not working either.  Back to hammering."

[Gene]

Best advice ever

Use an internal bearing puller. Using the proper tool makes an average mechanic a great mechanic.

[Gene]

Adding thuds in to push the point.

"Good news: Got the race out, hub is fine.  Bad news - need part 42620-323-030, that distance collar.  I destroyed mine and it's NLA.  I saw a thread from years ago that brought it up but I didn't see a conclusion.  I can't seem to find a replacement on the market.  I know it's essentially a piece of steel pipe approx. 1" OD and 2-7/16 long.

Anyone have a suggestion?  I am not putting this back together without it because I also read that it would have dire consequences.  I'll stick a requested in the WTB section as well.

NOTE TO OTHERS: Remove the bearings properly, with the proper tools.  I turned a 3 hour job into a 3 day job and now I have to wait on parts."

[Gene]

8/28/2016

"Good day overall. Got that pesky race out.  It was nice to know that I was at least on the right track - sad to realize had I taken the bearings out properly I wouldn't have wasted this much time.

Got the rocker cover off.  Damned shame I have to replace it.  Once I took my current one off I saw how much shinier all the bits are.  I'll replace the rusty tappets and lock nuts on the replacement with my existing ones, I don't have the expertise to pull the rocker arms and replace the whole damned thing.  Besides, in taking off the existing cover I broke a chunk off on the #4 exhaust area. 

moving on, waiting on a rear wheel sleeve . . . will update this week.

Thank you for your patience and for this forum."

[Gene]

Got this from a member

What I had to do was find a salvage yard with a rear hub.  They may take it out for you or send you the entire hub.

-MD

[Gene]

Update - MD, you were absolutely right.  Found a place that would open the hub for me and the parts are on their way.  Ignore my PM btw . . .

See?  Even idiots get lucky once in a while.

[Gene]

Got the spacer(s) in for inside the hub, new rear bearings in - new chain on - all good things.  And I got a gig in this afternoon.  The new rocker cover is on - having swapped all of the tappets since the ones I got with the new cover were rusty beyond help.  Thought about pulling the rods, etc.  Changed my mind.  Moving along - pics when available.  I have a couple of days to get this to a point where I get it out of the garage, so no pic time.

All that said, front wheel and forks come off tomorrow.  I actually feel like I may have started to accomplish something.  Still feel like a dolt, but, live and learn.

I don't have pics of the rear bearing going in, but they fit well.  I used a bit of pine as a "level" to knock them in cleanly and it worked.  A 1 x 2 if it matters .

The sleeve/spacer was perfect and if I can remember who it was I bought it from I'll post a link.  It was a bike salvage joint up in N CA. They were incredible, frankly.

[Gene]

Pics - forks off etc.

Just pics

[Gene]

Front wheel done - blind hole puller from auto-zone - thanks Bomber. And Cal  These guys loan 'em for a deposit. Had no idea.

Me: "I want to buy this tool do you have it?"
AZ: "Oh - that's a loaner."
"But I want to buy it."
"Then don't bring it back."
"How long do I have?"
"90 days"
"And how much do I get back?"
"All of it"
"You're fcuking kidding me . . . "
"Nope"

This is new to me fellas - freaked me out a little.  Anyway . . .

Most of the front end is apart, just dealing with a sticky neck bolt.  I had recently gone through all the electrics so it was relatively easy to disassemble that part- we'll see about reassembly tomorrow once I have the steering bearings in. Finally had a chance to install a new brake-light switch as well for the front.  Had the part for millenia.

I'm passing on the forks break down and the swing-arm bushings for now.  I'm confident in the suspension and swing.  Come back to it this winter when I get another break.  Pics forthcoming = when I get a chance.  If I can get back to work I'll have some time to load stuff

[Gene]

And that's where I left off on the other thread.

I don't have any additional pics, but, will say this as far as bearing replacements:

Use the right tools.  Otherwise you're wasting your time.  I got all the bearing replaced: front and rear wheel as well as the steering bearings.  I do wish I had taken pics of the steering replacements, but I was moving kind of quickly to get it done.

I will relay a couple things I did:  The old steering races came out easily with a decent punch that was long enough.  The new ones - I didn't freeze them, but, did a "quick freeze" with a keyboard cleaner can from Staples.  Turn it upside down until the really cold stuff comes out in a spray/liquid form and it freezes it quick.  Went in very easily with a little nudging from a rubber mallet and another piece of wood.

Put the lower bearing on with a slow manipulation from a flat pouch - round and round - after greasing them up.  Greased the uppers and hauled the whole damned forks and all up into the neck.  I hadn't removed the forks because of time/energy constraints.

Everything fit wonderfully. Tightened it up and played with it to see if it need more tightening, but I got lucky. 

P.S. - if you're wondering what my steps were at this point, consult your manual.

Front end back on, steering stoopid smooth.  Wheels rolling like they should.

Adjust front brake, rear brake, reinstall handlebars, electrics in the rat's nest that is the headlight bucket (take pics BEFORE and after just to have 'em.)

That's it.  Let me know if there are any questions, I'm sure I missed something - aside from more pics.  As I said, I was moving kind of quickly so I didn't stop.  My apologies for that.