Author Topic: This looks a bit too lean?  (Read 1660 times)

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Offline Johnny5

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This looks a bit too lean?
« on: November 04, 2016, 10:35:07 AM »
Would you agree? Bike is running well with no surging through the powerband, but I like to see the insulator a little more tan.

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2006 Harley Springer Classic

Offline lrutt

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Re: This looks a bit too lean?
« Reply #1 on: November 04, 2016, 10:44:20 AM »
Unfortunately with ethanol fuel these days you don't get nice tan plugs like you used to. looking down the plug, is the insulator white all the way down or does it darken up somewhere down inside there.
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Offline Johnny5

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Re: This looks a bit too lean?
« Reply #2 on: November 04, 2016, 11:29:30 AM »
I shined a light down the plug and it looks like it's pretty much the same color all the way down.

Unfortunately with ethanol fuel these days you don't get nice tan plugs like you used to. looking down the plug, is the insulator white all the way down or does it darken up somewhere down inside there.
www.kerosenecycles.com
1971 CB350
1973 CB350F
2006 Harley Springer Classic

Offline bomorr

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Re: This looks a bit too lean?
« Reply #3 on: November 04, 2016, 12:40:11 PM »
is that a new plug or one you have had in there a while? wondering because you have the same kind of buildup I am getting around the top edge that I was assuming was oil blow-by

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Offline flybox1

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Re: This looks a bit too lean?
« Reply #4 on: November 04, 2016, 01:35:53 PM »
Inaccurate/inconclusive test.
You cannot determine WHERE you are lean if those plugs are from general riding through different throttle ranges.
Start over, and do (Part 1) an accurate idle plug chop.
If all plug are white like that one, reuse them.   No blipping of the throttle.  4-5 minutes under a fan.  Check plug color.
Adjust IMS till you get adequate color.  If still lean at end of IMS range(seated to 3 turns out), bigger pilots are needed. 
Start over with idle plug chop/IMS adjsutments till you dial in all carbs.
(Part 2) New plugs.  1/3-1/2 throttle position plug chop.
Adjust needle clip if needed to get desired plug color.
(Part 3) 2/3-3/4 plug chop. 
Adjust main jet to get desired plug color.
Done
'78 750K (F3 engine) PD42b's, Modified airbox w/K&N  filter, 40/110 jets, 1 needle shim, IMS@ 1 turn out. Kerker + Cone 18" QuietCore

Past Bikes
1974 550K0 (stock), 1973 CB350F (stock), 1983 Yamaha XS400K (POS)
77/78 cool 2 member #3
"Knowledge without mileage equals bullsh!t" - Henry Rollins

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Offline Johnny5

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Re: This looks a bit too lean?
« Reply #5 on: November 05, 2016, 06:03:51 AM »
Sorry, I wasn't more specific. This was a plug chop from WOT. And actually my plug chop from 1/8 to 1/4 throttle was very similar, if not the same. I was starting to work from the mains to the idle, but you're suggesting the opposite, which I'll try. Thanks!


Inaccurate/inconclusive test.
You cannot determine WHERE you are lean if those plugs are from general riding through different throttle ranges.
Start over, and do (Part 1) an accurate idle plug chop.
If all plug are white like that one, reuse them.   No blipping of the throttle.  4-5 minutes under a fan.  Check plug color.
Adjust IMS till you get adequate color.  If still lean at end of IMS range(seated to 3 turns out), bigger pilots are needed. 
Start over with idle plug chop/IMS adjsutments till you dial in all carbs.
(Part 2) New plugs.  1/3-1/2 throttle position plug chop.
Adjust needle clip if needed to get desired plug color.
(Part 3) 2/3-3/4 plug chop. 
Adjust main jet to get desired plug color.
Done
www.kerosenecycles.com
1971 CB350
1973 CB350F
2006 Harley Springer Classic

Offline seanbarney41

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Re: This looks a bit too lean?
« Reply #6 on: November 05, 2016, 07:42:06 AM »
Would you agree? Bike is running well with no surging through the powerband, but I like to see the insulator a little more tan.


I would try one size bigger main jet and decide based on performance....so if you got 110'`s now, try 115's, do another chop, see how it runs, etc.   Best place to do this is the drag strip on test and tune night
« Last Edit: November 05, 2016, 07:45:11 AM by seanbarney41 »
If it works good, it looks good...

Offline flybox1

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Re: This looks a bit too lean?
« Reply #7 on: November 05, 2016, 02:13:08 PM »
Idle plug chop first as fuel supply is cumulative
'78 750K (F3 engine) PD42b's, Modified airbox w/K&N  filter, 40/110 jets, 1 needle shim, IMS@ 1 turn out. Kerker + Cone 18" QuietCore

Past Bikes
1974 550K0 (stock), 1973 CB350F (stock), 1983 Yamaha XS400K (POS)
77/78 cool 2 member #3
"Knowledge without mileage equals bullsh!t" - Henry Rollins

"This is my CB. There are many like it, but this one is mine…"

Offline PeWe

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Re: This looks a bit too lean?
« Reply #8 on: November 06, 2016, 04:04:02 AM »
Dyno with air/fuel meter nearby? Measure at idle and step wise up to fully open. I had measured at WOT only with OK values. The way too lean at low throttle was not seen.

I have a Wego III A/F meter to be useed next year, pipe by pipe when I have 4-4. Cyl 2-3 runs leaner than the other. Maybe in need of individual jetting. Carbs were too lean on all, 2-3 got even leaner close to permanent problems. I think that 2-3 always runs leaner due to warmer run due to less cooling than outer cyl 1-4. Easy to make mistake when checking plugs on a hot engine when eaither cyl 1 or 4 is checked, not the wrist/hand burning 2-3.

Wego III has logging to be checked afterwards. A more visual way is to have the gauge beside speedo-tacho meter. An action cam to film the test run that can be viewed afterwards comparing all runs.

Partsforspeed is a good and friendly supplier. I bought the version with longer harness to reach the end of 4-4 pipe where a sniffer pipe is to be placed.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Daytona-Sensors-WEGO-III-Wideband-Oxygen-Sensor-Air-Fuel-Ratio-Gauge-Motorcycle-/231491968098?vxp=mtr&hash=item35e5ff1c62
CB750 K6-76  970cc (Earlier 1005cc JMR Billet block on the shelf waiting for a comeback)
CB750 K2-75 Parts assembled to a stock K2

Updates of the CB750 K6 -1976
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180468.msg2092136.html#msg2092136
The billet block build thread
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,49438.msg1863571.html#msg1863571
CB750 K2 -1975  build thread
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,168243.msg1948381.html#msg1948381
K2 engine build thread. For a complete CB750 -75
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180088.msg2088008.html#msg2088008
Carb jetting, a long story Mikuni TMR32
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,179479.msg2104967.html#msg2104967