Author Topic: Oil Cooler Thread  (Read 157415 times)

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Offline Terry in Australia

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #850 on: April 04, 2011, 12:53:21 PM »
You want her breathing or not? A little food might be all it takes to lure her onto the plane  8) She likes dark rum with her diet coke. How much extra do I have to pay? At least the bypass valve could come in handy  ;D She might have a dowry too by the time the lawyers get done.

Ha ha, don't worry about that Jerry, she'll be bringing me a BIG Dowry, might even be a fugly arsed F1 and a sweeeet Harley being loaded into that airplane enreute to greener pastures once her lawyers get done with you, maybe you need to get on yer knees and beg her for forgiveness, for whatever you did to piss her off? That's the only reason I keep mine around now, because it's cheaper than divorce.............. ;D
I was feeling sorry for myself because I couldn't afford new bike boots, until I met a man with no legs.

So I said, "Hey mate, you haven't got any bike boots you don't need, do you?"

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Offline BobbyR

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #851 on: April 05, 2011, 08:36:00 AM »
You want her breathing or not? A little food might be all it takes to lure her onto the plane  8) She likes dark rum with her diet coke. How much extra do I have to pay? At least the bypass valve could come in handy  ;D She might have a dowry too by the time the lawyers get done.

Ha ha, don't worry about that Jerry, she'll be bringing me a BIG Dowry, might even be a fugly arsed F1 and a sweeeet Harley being loaded into that airplane enreute to greener pastures once her lawyers get done with you, maybe you need to get on yer knees and beg her for forgiveness, for whatever you did to piss her off? That's the only reason I keep mine around now, because it's cheaper than divorce.............. ;D
The Outback is a desolate place where few venture. Unfortunate souls have entered it never to return.
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Offline Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #852 on: April 05, 2011, 10:20:28 AM »
Hummm, Bobby makes a good point AND I have plenty of airline miles. Perhaps I should show her that horny kangaroo video. I did give her a chance to save my money er change her mind but those psychtropics and rum she is on plus her therapist have more control than I do. Looks like I'll at least have the house that HAD 22 payments left and ROOM IN THE GARAGE FOR MORE BIKES  ;D

Terry, You'd be so damn lucky to have a F0 and a 100th anniversary Fat Boy. Cash and #$%*es may leave but bikes never do  ;D Hell, it took 19 years of hard work to chase her off why beg forgiveness now  ;) As Larry The Cable Guy says - get her done!
As of today 3/13/2012 my original owner 75 CB750F has made it through 3 wives, er EX-wives. Free at last.  ;-)

Offline Terry in Australia

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #853 on: April 05, 2011, 09:34:03 PM »
You want her breathing or not? A little food might be all it takes to lure her onto the plane  8) She likes dark rum with her diet coke. How much extra do I have to pay? At least the bypass valve could come in handy  ;D She might have a dowry too by the time the lawyers get done.

Ha ha, don't worry about that Jerry, she'll be bringing me a BIG Dowry, might even be a fugly arsed F1 and a sweeeet Harley being loaded into that airplane enreute to greener pastures once her lawyers get done with you, maybe you need to get on yer knees and beg her for forgiveness, for whatever you did to piss her off? That's the only reason I keep mine around now, because it's cheaper than divorce.............. ;D
The Outback is a desolate place where few venture. Unfortunate souls have entered it never to return.

Ha ha, that's very true Bobby, it's hard to find a body in 700,000 square miles of desert, in heats of 120F, in the shade. Maybe Jerry should have one last crack at reconciliation and bring her out here for an "Outback Adventure"? I could even meet them at the airport, with a bottle of Aussie Rum, and my shovel? ;D
I was feeling sorry for myself because I couldn't afford new bike boots, until I met a man with no legs.

So I said, "Hey mate, you haven't got any bike boots you don't need, do you?"

"Crazy is a very misunderstood term, it's a fine line that some of us can lean over and still keep our balance" (thanks RB550Four)

Offline BobbyR

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #854 on: April 06, 2011, 09:13:21 AM »
You want her breathing or not? A little food might be all it takes to lure her onto the plane  8) She likes dark rum with her diet coke. How much extra do I have to pay? At least the bypass valve could come in handy  ;D She might have a dowry too by the time the lawyers get done.

Ha ha, don't worry about that Jerry, she'll be bringing me a BIG Dowry, might even be a fugly arsed F1 and a sweeeet Harley being loaded into that airplane enreute to greener pastures once her lawyers get done with you, maybe you need to get on yer knees and beg her for forgiveness, for whatever you did to piss her off? That's the only reason I keep mine around now, because it's cheaper than divorce.............. ;D
The Outback is a desolate place where few venture. Unfortunate souls have entered it never to return.

Ha ha, that's very true Bobby, it's hard to find a body in 700,000 square miles of desert, in heats of 120F, in the shade. Maybe Jerry should have one last crack at reconciliation and bring her out here for an "Outback Adventure"? I could even meet them at the airport, with a bottle of Aussie Rum, and my shovel? ;D
Considering where I was raised in the Bronx and some of my Uncles, that does not seem an unusual plan. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Dedicated to Sgt. Howard Bruckner 1950 - 1969. KIA LONG KHANH.

But we were boys, and boys will be boys, and so they will. To us, everything was dangerous, but what of that? Had we not been made to live forever?

Offline CBNJ74

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #855 on: August 16, 2011, 06:58:28 PM »
Considering removing the one that came with my 73 CB750 I just picked up. One of the lines went this evening and it made one hell of mess. This bike will be a Sunday rider no touring or extreme hot weather for this guy. Any thoughts?
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Offline MCRider

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #856 on: August 16, 2011, 07:44:12 PM »
Considering removing the one that came with my 73 CB750 I just picked up. One of the lines went this evening and it made one hell of mess. This bike will be a Sunday rider no touring or extreme hot weather for this guy. Any thoughts?
My opinion, and I run/ran one: 50% looks and 50% (maybe) functional if you havea thermswitch and it works properly.

For your purposes I'd eliminate the added complexity (and obvious source of failure) and run it "neat".  I may, after thinking about it.
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Offline Terry in Australia

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #857 on: August 16, 2011, 08:13:00 PM »
Considering removing the one that came with my 73 CB750 I just picked up. One of the lines went this evening and it made one hell of mess. This bike will be a Sunday rider no touring or extreme hot weather for this guy. Any thoughts?

Why not just replace the oil lines mate? If it's an older cooler, the lines are probably buggered, but the adapter and radiator should be fine, so why not spend 10 bucks on a little additional insurance against an engine rebuild anytime in the near future? Cheers, Terry. ;D
I was feeling sorry for myself because I couldn't afford new bike boots, until I met a man with no legs.

So I said, "Hey mate, you haven't got any bike boots you don't need, do you?"

"Crazy is a very misunderstood term, it's a fine line that some of us can lean over and still keep our balance" (thanks RB550Four)

Offline CBNJ74

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #858 on: August 17, 2011, 06:45:41 AM »
Terry, I hear what you're saying and the lines are pretty old but I'm also not liking that radiator hanging up there near the horn. I'll probably put 1k miles a year on her at best. I bought this CB to tinker and try my hand at classic ownership.
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Offline TwoTired

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #859 on: August 17, 2011, 08:49:07 AM »
Considering removing the one that came with my 73 CB750 I just picked up. One of the lines went this evening and it made one hell of mess. This bike will be a Sunday rider no touring or extreme hot weather for this guy. Any thoughts?
In my opinion, the bike doesn't need an oil cooler for ordinary street use.
It is an air cooled motor, and the design doesn't provide for oil cooling of the motor.  (Oil is a rather poor heat conductor.)

IF ... you are operating the motor at consistently high power levels AND in a very hot environment, an oil cooler might extend the oil life or improve an early oil change interval.

Certainly don't look for it to do significant engine cooling in this motor.  They only help the oil to survive extreme abuse.  Just keep the oil fresh, perhaps use an oil that can withstand a high heat excursion, and that will allow the engine to reach it's planned service life.

Contrary to what many believe, Honda really did know how to design a motorcycle, with out add-ons and other geegaws.

Cheers,
Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
72 500, 74 550, 75 550K, 75 550F, 76 550F, 77 550F X2, 78 550K, 77 750F X2, 78 750F, 79CX500, 85 700SC, GL1100

Those that learn from history are doomed to repeat it by those that don't learn from history.

Offline CBNJ74

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #860 on: August 17, 2011, 09:16:57 AM »
Off she goes! now were any special parts used to make this mod work? or is just a matter of removing the adaptor plate where the lines enter and putting everything back the way it was.
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Offline MCRider

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #861 on: August 17, 2011, 09:44:14 AM »
Off she goes! now were any special parts used to make this mod work? or is just a matter of removing the adaptor plate where the lines enter and putting everything back the way it was.
All the ones I've seen are all inclusive, no parts added or detracted. Just remove the related parts, and the filter housing should just go right back to the crankcase.
Ride Safe:
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1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

Offline Pinhead

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #862 on: August 17, 2011, 11:00:29 AM »
Do you want to get rid of the adapter you just removed? Does anyone know if it'll fit a '79 CB650?
Doug

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Offline RustyJC

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Re: Oil Temp Cooler
« Reply #863 on: August 17, 2011, 11:09:48 AM »
I ended up putting on an after-market oil cooler. This unit has a small radiator-type component that gets strapped to the front of the frame just below the steering neck. The other key piece is a plate that gets mounted behind the oil filter. This plate has two hose fittings that allow you to connect to the aforementioned radiator unit. A very simple installation and an amazing difference after the job was completed! No more tick-tick-tick!

Mine has been running such an oil cooler since back in the early 70s.  The one I installed as added insurance against the Texas heat displaces the horn to a mounting position behind the left side cover and mounts on the horn mounts at the upper front of the frame.  The cooler and oil filter adapter came from Lockhart Industries.  I have no idea if it's still in their catalog, or even if the company is still in business.  It's visible in the attached photo.

If the following link works, here is a vintage ad for the Lockhart HO-300 kit.

http://books.google.com/books?id=TvkDAAAAMBAJ&pg=PT26&lpg=PT26&dq=lockhart+industries+oil+cooler&source=bl&ots=jMh0J8ruuE&sig=hbaZaKQTJz6q5RVGnMSpu-KbcIY&hl=en#v=onepage&q=lockhart%20industries%20oil%20cooler&f=false

Rusty
« Last Edit: August 17, 2011, 01:19:23 PM by RustyJC »
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Offline Terry in Australia

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #864 on: August 17, 2011, 07:58:17 PM »
Contrary to what many believe, Honda really did know how to design a motorcycle, with out add-ons and other geegaws.

Cheers,

If that's right Lloyd, then why did Honda offer a factory oil cooler kit for the SOHC CB750's as an optional extra, along with steering dampers, dual disc conversions, etc, and why did all of the (aircooled) DOHC 750's, 900's and 1100's built after the first SOHC4's all come with oil coolers as standard?

Hmmmnnn, come to think of it, why does my modern water cooled bike have an oil cooler fitted as standard? Please explain? Cheers, Terry. ;D   
I was feeling sorry for myself because I couldn't afford new bike boots, until I met a man with no legs.

So I said, "Hey mate, you haven't got any bike boots you don't need, do you?"

"Crazy is a very misunderstood term, it's a fine line that some of us can lean over and still keep our balance" (thanks RB550Four)

Offline mrbreeze

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #865 on: August 17, 2011, 09:53:10 PM »
I would like to pull up a chair with my beer and bag of chili cheese fritos and hear the answer to that question also Lloyd.............dude...........you are like against everything that a guy wants to do with these bikes that didn't come from the factory. I know you hate pod filters ,aftermarket exhaust and now you are knocking Terry's oil coolers (or any oil coolers). I'll bet those Denver Choppers REALLY pi$$ ya off............Will you ever play nice TT????
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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #866 on: August 17, 2011, 10:02:28 PM »
Off she goes! now were any special parts used to make this mod work? or is just a matter of removing the adaptor plate where the lines enter and putting everything back the way it was.
All the ones I've seen are all inclusive, no parts added or detracted. Just remove the related parts, and the filter housing should just go right back to the crankcase.

Don't they use a longer bolt because of the extra length in the oil cooler housing.?

I would really like a lockhart cooler like that, anyone got one for sale. It must be in immaculate condition...

Mick
« Last Edit: August 17, 2011, 10:04:24 PM by Retro Rocket »
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Offline TwoTired

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #867 on: August 17, 2011, 10:48:46 PM »
If that's right Lloyd, then why did Honda offer a factory oil cooler kit for the SOHC CB750's as an optional extra, along with steering dampers, dual disc conversions, etc, and why did all of the (aircooled) DOHC 750's, 900's and 1100's built after the first SOHC4's all come with oil coolers as standard?
Maybe the same reason why some auto manufacturers offer a police option as well as many other options not included with the base model.
And to placate those who get it in their tiny brains that things found on special purpose race machines also belong on ordinary street machines.
Many of the auto manufacturers made options available, in order to run cars competitively in a production class.  These options aren't required to drive across country or around town.  They were for winning races, and available as bragging rights for wanna be racers with more money than practical sense.
Weren't the CB750's in a factory race class during those days?  As I said, if you run at peak power and in hot weather all the time taxing the air cooling system, oil coolers can help the oil live longer.  Do you think an oil cooler would be of primary benefit in an arctic setting?

Regarding the DOHC4 diversional rathole BS.  The extra geegaws were a sales device.  It's called marketing toward competitor offerings or what the consumer demands, rather than what they actually need.  Joe Cool see a Yamaha with an oil cooler on it.  Gee, Yamaha's must be SO powerful that they need an oil cooler just like the race bikes have.  What? Honda does have one?  Well, it must be inferior or underpowered, then.
Can you explain why SUVs become so popular?  Or, bikes capable of 200MPH driven off the showroom floor?  Was there a crying need for that on the urban highways?  As for modern bikes, if I were an engineer and the marketing guys told me I had to include an oil cooler, I'd make use of it the best way I could.  What you fail to realize is that whatever production machine you choose, it was made as a total package, and not some piecemeal parts assemblage that was contrived in some backwater garage.  A part or subsystem necessary for a modern machine can easily be superfluous on and older one.  Imagine fuel injection and a turbocharger in a model T Ford.  If the engine survived the hop up, would the rest of the drive train?

Ya know, I've seen weight lifters who can lift 500 lbs wearing those cool weight belts.  If I put on a cool belt like that, I can lift 500lbs, too?  ;D

Anyway, you've presented no real information about why oil coolers should be included other than:
- "why not, if it is possible put one on,
- because somebody else did it in a different application,
- or some other orthogonal rationale."
It's kinda like bucket seats, ape hangers, oversize tires, pod filters, drag pipes, clubman bars, solo seat, or anything else that fits the "style" image foisted upon the subject bike.  What real data do you have that shows adding an oil cooler to a stock SOHC4, in any way extends its longevity?
We have example bikes without oil coolers that have lasted beyond 100K miles.  Do you have evidence showing benefit with an oil cooler in an A/B comparison with the only variable being an oil cooler?  Or, are you just selling a dream, wish, or hope, as so much of today's marketing does?

As and oil cooler manufacturer//provider, I would expect you would have done laboratory testing to prove the benefits of your offered device.  Will you share that data/evidence with us please?

Cheers, Lloyd  ;D
Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
72 500, 74 550, 75 550K, 75 550F, 76 550F, 77 550F X2, 78 550K, 77 750F X2, 78 750F, 79CX500, 85 700SC, GL1100

Those that learn from history are doomed to repeat it by those that don't learn from history.

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #868 on: August 17, 2011, 11:05:45 PM »
If that's right Lloyd, then why did Honda offer a factory oil cooler kit for the SOHC CB750's as an optional extra, along with steering dampers, dual disc conversions, etc, and why did all of the (aircooled) DOHC 750's, 900's and 1100's built after the first SOHC4's all come with oil coolers as standard?
Maybe the same reason why some auto manufacturers offer a police option as well as many other options not included with the base model.
And to placate those who get it in their tiny brains that things found on special purpose race machines also belong on ordinary street machines.
Many of the auto manufacturers made options available, in order to run cars competitively in a production class.  These options aren't required to drive across country or around town.  They were for winning races, and available as bragging rights for wanna be racers with more money than practical sense.
Weren't the CB750's in a factory race class during those days?  As I said, if you run at peak power and in hot weather all the time taxing the air cooling system, oil coolers can help the oil live longer.  Do you think an oil cooler would be of primary benefit in an arctic setting?

Regarding the DOHC4 diversional rathole BS.  The extra geegaws were a sales device.  It's called marketing toward competitor offerings or what the consumer demands, rather than what they actually need.  Joe Cool see a Yamaha with an oil cooler on it.  Gee, Yamaha's must be SO powerful that they need an oil cooler just like the race bikes have.  What? Honda does have one?  Well, it must be inferior or underpowered, then.
Can you explain why SUVs become so popular?  Or, bikes capable of 200MPH driven off the showroom floor?  Was there a crying need for that on the urban highways?  As for modern bikes, if I were an engineer and the marketing guys told me I had to include an oil cooler, I'd make use of it the best way I could.  What you fail to realize is that whatever production machine you choose, it was made as a total package, and not some piecemeal parts assemblage that was contrived in some backwater garage.  A part or subsystem necessary for a modern machine can easily be superfluous on and older one.  Imagine fuel injection and a turbocharger in a model T Ford.  If the engine survived the hop up, would the rest of the drive train?

Ya know, I've seen weight lifters who can lift 500 lbs wearing those cool weight belts.  If I put on a cool belt like that, I can lift 500lbs, too?  ;D

Anyway, you've presented no real information about why oil coolers should be included other than:
- "why not, if it is possible put one on,
- because somebody else did it in a different application,
- or some other orthogonal rationale."
It's kinda like bucket seats, ape hangers, oversize tires, pod filters, drag pipes, clubman bars, solo seat, or anything else that fits the "style" image foisted upon the subject bike.  What real data do you have that shows adding an oil cooler to a stock SOHC4, in any way extends its longevity?
We have example bikes without oil coolers that have lasted beyond 100K miles.  Do you have evidence showing benefit with an oil cooler in an A/B comparison with the only variable being an oil cooler?  Or, are you just selling a dream, wish, or hope, as so much of today's marketing does?

As and oil cooler manufacturer//provider, I would expect you would have done laboratory testing to prove the benefits of your offered device.  Will you share that data/evidence with us please?

Cheers, Lloyd  ;D

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Offline Retro Rocket

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #869 on: August 17, 2011, 11:12:41 PM »
Spot on Scottly. I just love the way TT belittles anyone that disagrees with his opinion with condescending bull#$%* and constant IQ references. Makes him look totally closed minded and arrogant..... Like i have said before, intelligence doesn't make you smart.....
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Offline TwoTired

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #870 on: August 17, 2011, 11:24:00 PM »
I would like to pull up a chair with my beer and bag of chili cheese fritos and hear the answer to that question also Lloyd.............dude...........you are like against everything that a guy wants to do with these bikes that didn't come from the factory. I know you hate pod filters ,aftermarket exhaust and now you are knocking Terry's oil coolers (or any oil coolers). I'll bet those Denver Choppers REALLY pi$$ ya off............Will you ever play nice TT????

Fred,
You and anyone else are free to spend/waste/donate your money on anything you wish (I certainly do).  Fact is, Honda made a better total machine than 90% (or more) of the customizers out there.  You want to make your bike different, fine.  You want to throw money at your bike the same way your role model did, fine.  You want to emulate your favorite racer's "look" on your personal machine, fine.  But, if you are forwarding a required "upgrade" based on technical merit rather than a style paradigm, then it ought to have some real data to support the upgrade in a practical application.

You can purchase and use a space pen which will write upside down.  Clearly that is a superior instrument.  But, that doesn't mean everyone needs to replace all their pens with more costly space pens, particularly if they rarely, if ever, need to write upside down.  Gravity still works pretty good here on earth.  But, if we ever lose all our gravity, you'll be able to write all about it, if you've got that space pen!!

The point is, no one has demonstrated a real NEED for an oil cooler on a stock SOHC4, particularly in all applications of the machine.  But, the popular assumption has still been made they have some sort of benefit for any and all, and known pitfalls of having an oil cooler are conveniently overlooked, downplayed, ignored.

Someone asked if an aftermarket oil cooler, clearly demonstrating one of the pitfalls (extra points from which to leak), could reasonably be removed without detriment.  The answer is, of course.  He didn't need it for style points or harsh operating conditions under severe power.
So why, Fred, are you so against someone doing what they want with their bike?  Why don't you play nice?  ;D

Cheers,
Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
72 500, 74 550, 75 550K, 75 550F, 76 550F, 77 550F X2, 78 550K, 77 750F X2, 78 750F, 79CX500, 85 700SC, GL1100

Those that learn from history are doomed to repeat it by those that don't learn from history.

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #871 on: August 17, 2011, 11:31:45 PM »
Just to be fair to Lloyd: where he lives, oil coolers aren't needed. I lived in the same part of CA in 80-82. 85 F there was warm; in this part of the country (world?) 85 F would seem cool right now. ;) 
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Offline Retro Rocket

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #872 on: August 17, 2011, 11:37:50 PM »
Quote
The point is, no one has demonstrated a real NEED for an oil cooler on a stock SOHC4, particularly in all applications of the machine.  But, the popular assumption has still been made they have some sort of benefit for any and all, and known pitfalls of having an oil cooler are conveniently overlooked, downplayed, ignored.

We get temps up to 120F in summer as do our Texan brothers, this has also been mentioned in oil cooler threads in the past, that demonstrates a need, also the guys that over bore and hot up their bikes have a legitimate reason to use one as well.... Never seen a bike fail here simply because it had a cooler.
750 K2 1000cc
750 F1 970cc
750 Bitsa 900cc
If You can't fix it with a hammer, You've got an electrical problem.

Online scottly

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #873 on: August 17, 2011, 11:46:47 PM »

Don't they use a longer bolt because of the extra length in the oil cooler housing.?

I would really like a lockhart cooler like that, anyone got one for sale. It must be in immaculate condition...

Mick
Yeah, the bolt was longer, at least on the Lockhart cooler I sold to shenanigans last year for his 836. I figured he needed it more than I did, since he is down in the inferno known as Phoenix... ;)
Don't fix it if it ain't broke!
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Offline ofreen

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Re: Oil Cooler Thread
« Reply #874 on: August 18, 2011, 02:18:04 AM »
This thread is reassuring in that it demonstrates that apparently there is such a thing as resurrection and eternal life.

Greg
'75 CB750F

"I would rather have questions I cannot answer than answers I cannot question." - Dr. Wei-Hock Soon