Author Topic: CB750F Supersport Build "No Replacement for Displacement"  (Read 10516 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline innovativems

  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,029
    • Innovative MotoSports
CB750F Supersport Build "No Replacement for Displacement"
« on: August 10, 2017, 11:33:13 AM »
Time to morph this thread into a build thread for my 1980 cb750f supersport build.  Got one as a basket case and plan to build a monster.  Found a cb1100 motor and working to try and ship it.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2017, 05:52:23 AM by innovativems »
2007 KTM 990 adv
2003 Honda RC51
2000 Yamaha YSR50
1978 Honda Express
1975 Honda CB400f
1974 Honda CB350f
1974 Kawi H2
1974 Honda CB550f
1971 Kawi h1
1973 Kawi h1
1974 gt 550
1974 gt550

Offline eigenvector

  • Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,949
  • Member of the despondent public
Re: What to look for on dohc cb750f supersport
« Reply #1 on: August 10, 2017, 04:38:25 PM »
The only thing that stands out are the carburators.

The bikes from that year/era(??) absolutely hate pods.  Unlike more modern carburators, they use an aluminum slide for the vacuum - and it's HEAVY, so any alteration in the air flow messes with the operation.  They also have anti-backfire valves which might also hinder any alterations to the stock jetting.

Beyond that, they're not much different than the SOHC bikes
Rob
--------------------------------
2018 HD Softail Heritage
1979 CB750K Limited Edition
1977 CB550K
1984 CB700SC Nighthawk
1983 VF750S Sabre

Offline Killer Canary

  • Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,805
  • Typical Bran Muffin
Re: What to look for on dohc cb750f supersport
« Reply #2 on: August 10, 2017, 05:11:33 PM »
You've already encountered shorted rotor syndrome?
If it's worth doing at all it's worth over-doing.
Honda MT250, CB400F, CB450K, CB550, GL500, CBR929
Kawi GPz900, H1

Offline ekpent

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 13,512
  • To many bikes-but lookin' for more
Re: What to look for on dohc cb750f supersport
« Reply #3 on: August 10, 2017, 07:20:46 PM »
 Think those have 2 cam chains rather then one. If it runs listen for problems.

Offline scottly

  • Global Moderator
  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *****
  • Posts: 16,274
  • Humboldt, AZ
Re: What to look for on dohc cb750f supersport
« Reply #4 on: August 10, 2017, 07:27:42 PM »
The '79s used plastic swing-arm bushings, while the '80s used a proper needle bearing.
Don't fix it if it ain't broke!
Helmets save brains. Always wear one and ride like everyone is trying to kill you....

Offline HondaMan

  • Someone took this pic of me before I became a
  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 13,840
  • ...not my choice, I was nicknamed...
    • Getting 'em Back on the Road
Re: What to look for on dohc cb750f supersport
« Reply #5 on: August 10, 2017, 07:38:07 PM »
The '79s used plastic swing-arm bushings, while the '80s used a proper needle bearing.

...and, they wobbled...
See SOHC4shop@gmail.com for info about the gadgets I make for these bikes.

The demons are repulsed when a man does good. Use that.
Blood is thicker than water, but motor oil is thicker yet...so, don't mess with my SOHC4, or I might have to hurt you.
Hondaman's creed: "Bikers are family. Treat them accordingly."

Link to Hondaman Ignition: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67543.0

Link to My CB750 Book: https://www.lulu.com/search?adult_audience_rating=00&page=1&pageSize=10&q=my+cb750+book

Link to website: www.SOHC4shop.com

Offline innovativems

  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,029
    • Innovative MotoSports
Re: What to look for on dohc cb750f supersport
« Reply #6 on: August 10, 2017, 08:13:42 PM »
Thanks everyone!   It's not currently running so I'm check what I can. 

Haha on the shorted rotors, fixed a cb650 and just finished a cb900 both with that problem


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
2007 KTM 990 adv
2003 Honda RC51
2000 Yamaha YSR50
1978 Honda Express
1975 Honda CB400f
1974 Honda CB350f
1974 Kawi H2
1974 Honda CB550f
1971 Kawi h1
1973 Kawi h1
1974 gt 550
1974 gt550

Offline nvr2old

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 484
Re: What to look for on dohc cb750f supersport
« Reply #7 on: August 11, 2017, 05:35:44 PM »
80-82'S are better bikes then the 79's..not that the 79 is bad..the later ones just fixed all the subtle problems with the valve train, swing arm bushings and such.
'76 CB550F-'72 XL250-'82 MB5-'82 CX500 Turbo-'77 naked Goldwing-'75 CB400F cafe'-'79 Suzuki GS1000S..hey, it's a Wes Cooley..

Offline Killer Canary

  • Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,805
  • Typical Bran Muffin
Re: What to look for on dohc cb750f supersport
« Reply #8 on: August 11, 2017, 06:38:02 PM »
Check that the exhaust valves in 2 and 3 aren't burnt.
The ignition modules have been known to fail.
If it's worth doing at all it's worth over-doing.
Honda MT250, CB400F, CB450K, CB550, GL500, CBR929
Kawi GPz900, H1

Offline MikeSimon

  • MotoManiac
  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 770
  • Motorcycle Addict
Re: What to look for on dohc cb750f supersport
« Reply #9 on: August 13, 2017, 06:28:52 AM »
Primary shaft can be really noisy on all DOHCs.
1973 CB350F -sold
1974 CB350F -218 orig miles, sold
1976 CB750K - in restoration

Other Hondas:
3 x CBX
CB1100R
GB500
Plus Kawasakis, BMws & Ducatis

Offline innovativems

  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,029
    • Innovative MotoSports
Re: What to look for on dohc cb750f supersport
« Reply #10 on: August 13, 2017, 04:03:22 PM »
Thanks everyone.  Found my starting point.  A 80 model that's complete and titled for a steal.  Going to have some fun with this one


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
2007 KTM 990 adv
2003 Honda RC51
2000 Yamaha YSR50
1978 Honda Express
1975 Honda CB400f
1974 Honda CB350f
1974 Kawi H2
1974 Honda CB550f
1971 Kawi h1
1973 Kawi h1
1974 gt 550
1974 gt550

Offline MRieck

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 10,564
  • Big ideas....
Re: What to look for on dohc cb750f supersport
« Reply #11 on: August 16, 2017, 02:10:43 PM »
Check that the exhaust valves in 2 and 3 aren't burnt.
The ignition modules have been known to fail.
+1 on both points
Owner of the "Million Dollar CB"

Offline innovativems

  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,029
    • Innovative MotoSports
Re: What to look for on dohc cb750f supersport
« Reply #12 on: August 16, 2017, 02:15:48 PM »
Check that the exhaust valves in 2 and 3 aren't burnt.
The ignition modules have been known to fail.
+1 on both points
Will do.  Hey mrieck, much to be gained with a port job on these?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
2007 KTM 990 adv
2003 Honda RC51
2000 Yamaha YSR50
1978 Honda Express
1975 Honda CB400f
1974 Honda CB350f
1974 Kawi H2
1974 Honda CB550f
1971 Kawi h1
1973 Kawi h1
1974 gt 550
1974 gt550

Offline innovativems

  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,029
    • Innovative MotoSports
Re: What to look for on dohc cb750f supersport
« Reply #13 on: August 21, 2017, 05:12:50 AM »
Got my starting point.  Complete and dirt cheap. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
2007 KTM 990 adv
2003 Honda RC51
2000 Yamaha YSR50
1978 Honda Express
1975 Honda CB400f
1974 Honda CB350f
1974 Kawi H2
1974 Honda CB550f
1971 Kawi h1
1973 Kawi h1
1974 gt 550
1974 gt550

Offline ekpent

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 13,512
  • To many bikes-but lookin' for more
Re: What to look for on dohc cb750f supersport
« Reply #14 on: August 21, 2017, 05:41:58 AM »
Why did it get totally disassembled ? Was it going to be restored or was somebody going to build a cafe racer.  Looks like a challenge or maybe they saved you some time  ;)

Offline Geeto67

  • A grumpy
  • Old Timer
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,823
Re: What to look for on dohc cb750f supersport
« Reply #15 on: August 21, 2017, 06:43:21 AM »
this is my old 1979, now owned by my brother:
IMG_0029

Here is the laundry list of things to check:

- Starter Clutch. It isn't a matter of if it fails, but when. most are already on their last leg. If the bike is already apart replacing this is a no brainer. There is a mod to use a more modern R6 starter clutch because it uses the same splines and is the same size, it just requires some re-drilling. Research it on CB1100F.net

- Cam chains. If left unattended or un adjusted these will eventually saw the block in half. If you are taking apart the engine then might as well replace all the followers and adjusters and inspect the block for wear. I'm not kidding about it sawing the block in half, the metal is thin there and it will literally wear it away until it cracks in half. Seen it happen on more than a few.

- Electricals: they are generally poor for this era bike. Clean contacts are key. My bike in 10 years of ownership in the same family has been through 3 regulator/rectifiers, 1 set of coils, 1 stator and rotor, and 1 set of pulse controllers. It is common for these bikes to just stop charging for no reason.

- Previous owners: every one I have owned (1 cb750F, 2 900Fs, and 2 1100Fs) weeps or leaks oil from somewhere. And usually that is stemmed by some dude using a fist full of silicone sealant to stop the weep. These bikes run hot so warpage is common - if you can run an oil cooler setup on your 750 from the 900F. Also people love to hack the stock harness for aftermarket stuff so....be mindful of that.

upgrades:
You already mentioned a freddie replica so I will just mention later interceptor VF750F wheels as a good option. they are the correct 18" rear, 16" front and they look like replica dymags if you file the castings off and paint them black or gold. I am talking about the second gen interceptor which was from the late 1980's through the early 90's. Rear is a bolt on, front requires a different front end (most use a first year hurricane CBR1000 because it is a bolt on and only 1" shorter than stock). I will however advocate for the cbr600f2 wheel/fork upgrade which puts 17" wheels at both ends. I've ridden a 900F setup like this and it is much nicer and the access to sportbike rubber is better.

If you are keeping the stock forks, the 1981-82 dual piston caliper is worth it's weight in gold. esp with braided lines. I just did this to bro's 1979 bike and it stops. Also it's cheaper to service and easier to get pads for since they used these calipers on a ton of other bikes.

hondaman already mentioned the swingarm bushings so I will just mention that a cb1100F steel box arm is stronger and better looking than the stock piece. I think Calfab also makes alloy arms for these bikes.

Ohlins sells shocks for them and cb1100f does a group buy sometimes. totally worth it if you can do it. the cb900F and 1100F used remote res shocks that are ok if not worn out but most are. Stock shocks were dual damping with a switch on the bottom to change from soft to hard - most got thrown out but if you have a set and they still work - try them, they are kind of neat. I run 14" vipex shocks on mine that were setup a long time ago. They look like cheap chinese shocks because they are, but they were spec'ed by a cb1100F member who worked in china so they are better than the garbage being sold on ebay that looks like them. They are out of the box setup for a 200lbs+ rider so the number 1 complaint is that they are too stiff.

Lots of parts sharing with other bikes and there is a lot of cool bolt on stuff. Honda sold factory rearsets on all the foreign models called a sport kit. Sport kits for the cb1100F are the most coveted because they are a lattice design and not a sold stock foot plate. Otherwise it's an easy upgrade, I just paid $140 for mine shipped from england - try getting aftermarket rearsets for that. Also foreign models used 18" front wheels instead of 19", and many used the boomerang comstar in gold or silver anodizing. We only got the boomerang comstar on the cx500 turbo so we can only use the front off that bike (cx500 turbos are shaft drive), but even mexican interceptors used boomerang comstars. They are a similar design to PM chicanes and Astralight wheels so they have the race look to them more so than a stock comstar.

A little known fact is foreign cbF's had an option for a glove box/stash box in the tail section. They come up on ebay from time to time but are kind of rare. It's a nice little touch since we never got them in the states.



Maintenance Matters Most

Offline Geeto67

  • A grumpy
  • Old Timer
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,823
Re: What to look for on dohc cb750f supersport
« Reply #16 on: August 21, 2017, 06:48:39 AM »
BTW, it looks like you have a supertrap 4-1 in that pile. That's a solid performance exhaust for these bikes. The best pipes are bassani but rare as hens teeth. I had one and I foolishly sold it. Supertrap and kerkers are solid pipes. I think there is a german company making a stainless pipe and motogpwerks might have a pipe for these as well. Vance and Hines pipes are drag pipes and have clearance issues under hard cornering, and mac pipes are...well...mac pipes. There was a guy who used to sell some funky X pipe for these bikes - cool looking, dubious performance claims.
Maintenance Matters Most

Offline innovativems

  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,029
    • Innovative MotoSports
Re: What to look for on dohc cb750f supersport
« Reply #17 on: August 21, 2017, 07:27:36 AM »
Why did it get totally disassembled ? Was it going to be restored or was somebody going to build a cafe racer.  Looks like a challenge or maybe they saved you some time  ;)
Guy was going to build it into something and just lost interest.  I'm going to throw it together and mock it all up then take it down for paint.  Going to build it as a Freddie Spencer ama replica.  With a few changes


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
2007 KTM 990 adv
2003 Honda RC51
2000 Yamaha YSR50
1978 Honda Express
1975 Honda CB400f
1974 Honda CB350f
1974 Kawi H2
1974 Honda CB550f
1971 Kawi h1
1973 Kawi h1
1974 gt 550
1974 gt550

Offline innovativems

  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,029
    • Innovative MotoSports
Re: What to look for on dohc cb750f supersport
« Reply #18 on: August 21, 2017, 11:21:31 AM »
Geeto, that is a huge help!  Thank you sir!  Also great looking supersport!!!
2007 KTM 990 adv
2003 Honda RC51
2000 Yamaha YSR50
1978 Honda Express
1975 Honda CB400f
1974 Honda CB350f
1974 Kawi H2
1974 Honda CB550f
1971 Kawi h1
1973 Kawi h1
1974 gt 550
1974 gt550

Offline innovativems

  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,029
    • Innovative MotoSports
Re: CB750F Supersport Build
« Reply #19 on: August 28, 2017, 01:46:48 PM »
Thanks, i thought it was a oem junker for a moment, good eye! 
2007 KTM 990 adv
2003 Honda RC51
2000 Yamaha YSR50
1978 Honda Express
1975 Honda CB400f
1974 Honda CB350f
1974 Kawi H2
1974 Honda CB550f
1971 Kawi h1
1973 Kawi h1
1974 gt 550
1974 gt550

Offline ekpent

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 13,512
  • To many bikes-but lookin' for more
Re: CB750F Supersport Build
« Reply #20 on: August 28, 2017, 05:25:30 PM »
this is my old 1979, now owned by my brother:
IMG_0029

Here is the laundry list of things to check:

- Starter Clutch. It isn't a matter of if it fails, but when. most are already on their last leg. If the bike is already apart replacing this is a no brainer. There is a mod to use a more modern R6 starter clutch because it uses the same splines and is the same size, it just requires some re-drilling. Research it on CB1100F.net

- Cam chains. If left unattended or un adjusted these will eventually saw the block in half. If you are taking apart the engine then might as well replace all the followers and adjusters and inspect the block for wear. I'm not kidding about it sawing the block in half, the metal is thin there and it will literally wear it away until it cracks in half. Seen it happen on more than a few.

- Electricals: they are generally poor for this era bike. Clean contacts are key. My bike in 10 years of ownership in the same family has been through 3 regulator/rectifiers, 1 set of coils, 1 stator and rotor, and 1 set of pulse controllers. It is common for these bikes to just stop charging for no reason.

- Previous owners: every one I have owned (1 cb750F, 2 900Fs, and 2 1100Fs) weeps or leaks oil from somewhere. And usually that is stemmed by some dude using a fist full of silicone sealant to stop the weep. These bikes run hot so warpage is common - if you can run an oil cooler setup on your 750 from the 900F. Also people love to hack the stock harness for aftermarket stuff so....be mindful of that.

upgrades:
You already mentioned a freddie replica so I will just mention later interceptor VF750F wheels as a good option. they are the correct 18" rear, 16" front and they look like replica dymags if you file the castings off and paint them black or gold. I am talking about the second gen interceptor which was from the late 1980's through the early 90's. Rear is a bolt on, front requires a different front end (most use a first year hurricane CBR1000 because it is a bolt on and only 1" shorter than stock). I will however advocate for the cbr600f2 wheel/fork upgrade which puts 17" wheels at both ends. I've ridden a 900F setup like this and it is much nicer and the access to sportbike rubber is better.

If you are keeping the stock forks, the 1981-82 dual piston caliper is worth it's weight in gold. esp with braided lines. I just did this to bro's 1979 bike and it stops. Also it's cheaper to service and easier to get pads for since they used these calipers on a ton of other bikes.

hondaman already mentioned the swingarm bushings so I will just mention that a cb1100F steel box arm is stronger and better looking than the stock piece. I think Calfab also makes alloy arms for these bikes.

Ohlins sells shocks for them and cb1100f does a group buy sometimes. totally worth it if you can do it. the cb900F and 1100F used remote res shocks that are ok if not worn out but most are. Stock shocks were dual damping with a switch on the bottom to change from soft to hard - most got thrown out but if you have a set and they still work - try them, they are kind of neat. I run 14" vipex shocks on mine that were setup a long time ago. They look like cheap chinese shocks because they are, but they were spec'ed by a cb1100F member who worked in china so they are better than the garbage being sold on ebay that looks like them. They are out of the box setup for a 200lbs+ rider so the number 1 complaint is that they are too stiff.

Lots of parts sharing with other bikes and there is a lot of cool bolt on stuff. Honda sold factory rearsets on all the foreign models called a sport kit. Sport kits for the cb1100F are the most coveted because they are a lattice design and not a sold stock foot plate. Otherwise it's an easy upgrade, I just paid $140 for mine shipped from england - try getting aftermarket rearsets for that. Also foreign models used 18" front wheels instead of 19", and many used the boomerang comstar in gold or silver anodizing. We only got the boomerang comstar on the cx500 turbo so we can only use the front off that bike (cx500 turbos are shaft drive), but even mexican interceptors used boomerang comstars. They are a similar design to PM chicanes and Astralight wheels so they have the race look to them more so than a stock comstar.

A little known fact is foreign cbF's had an option for a glove box/stash box in the tail section. They come up on ebay from time to time but are kind of rare. It's a nice little touch since we never got them in the states.




I am doing the R6 starter clutch conversion on my 900F while I have it apart doing carbs etc. The stocker is in sad shape by the sound of it. Hate hitting the starter button. 
« Last Edit: August 29, 2017, 07:20:10 AM by ekpent »

Offline MRieck

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 10,564
  • Big ideas....
Re: What to look for on dohc cb750f supersport
« Reply #21 on: August 29, 2017, 07:08:59 AM »
Check that the exhaust valves in 2 and 3 aren't burnt.
The ignition modules have been known to fail.
+1 on both points
Will do.  Hey mrieck, much to be gained with a port job on these?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
They sure can benefit. Those ports leave a lot to be desired
Owner of the "Million Dollar CB"

Offline SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan

  • Speak up, Whipper-Snapper! I'm a
  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 15,731
  • SOHC/4 Member #1235
Re: CB750F Supersport Build
« Reply #22 on: August 29, 2017, 11:34:45 AM »
Are the ports as rough as the SOHC castings?
1975 CB550K1 "Blue" Stockish Restomod (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=135005.0)
1975 CB550F1 frame/CB650 engine hybrid "The Hot Mess" (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,150220.0.html)
2008 Triumph Thruxton (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,190956.0.html)
2014 MV Agusta Brutale Dragster 800
2015 Yamaha FZ-09 (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,186861.0.html)

"There are some things nobody needs in this world, and a bright-red, hunch-back, warp-speed 900cc cafe racer is one of them — but I want one anyway, and on some days I actually believe I need one.... Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles, Bubba." Hunter S. Thompson, Song of the Sausage Creature, Cycle World, March 1995.  (http://www.latexnet.org/~csmith/sausage.html and https://magazine.cycleworld.com/article/1995/3/1/song-of-the-sausage-creature)

Sold/Emeritus
1973 CB750K2 "Bionic Mongrel" (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=132734.0) - Sold
1977 CB750K7 "Nine Lives" Restomod (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=50490.0) - Sold
2005 RVT1000RR RC51-SP2 "El Diablo" - Sold
2016+ Triumph Thruxton 1200 R (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,170198.0.html) - Sold

Offline innovativems

  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,029
    • Innovative MotoSports
Re: CB750F Supersport Build
« Reply #23 on: August 30, 2017, 05:41:32 AM »
Looks like i may have a 1100 motor locked down for this bike.  This is going to be the "no replacement for displacement" bike.  Reached out to JES built for some suggestions and seeing about his parts.  This is going to be a fun one. 

I may be more excited about building this bike then my 74 h2 track/street bike.
2007 KTM 990 adv
2003 Honda RC51
2000 Yamaha YSR50
1978 Honda Express
1975 Honda CB400f
1974 Honda CB350f
1974 Kawi H2
1974 Honda CB550f
1971 Kawi h1
1973 Kawi h1
1974 gt 550
1974 gt550

Offline Geeto67

  • A grumpy
  • Old Timer
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,823
Re: CB750F Supersport Build "No Replacement for Displacement"
« Reply #24 on: August 30, 2017, 08:12:48 AM »
don't forget to get the dogbone mounts for the cb1100F engine. The 750F uses a different front engine mount than the 1100F if you are planning on just swapping engines.

It's part number 14 and 19 in this pic:
http://www.partsfish.com/oemparts/a/hon/506c7cd4f870023420a3c42a/frame-oil-cooler
Maintenance Matters Most