Author Topic: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.  (Read 4262 times)

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Offline TwoTired

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #25 on: August 19, 2017, 08:32:36 AM »
He may be able to get there under his own power.

Are you in contact with him?

Or, is this thread "it"?

Gonna be "in the field" without an alternate plan for the day.  I got a few acres to mow and irrigation to fix, and.....lebendy dozen other projects.... 
I don't mind a diversion, though.

Cheers,
Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
72 500, 74 550, 75 550K, 75 550F, 76 550F, 77 550F X2, 78 550K, 77 750F X2, 78 750F, 79CX500, 85 700SC, GL1100

Those that learn from history are doomed to repeat it by those that don't learn from history.

Offline scottly

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #26 on: August 19, 2017, 08:34:07 AM »
Yes, this is the thread. I told him to PM you.
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Offline TwoTired

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #27 on: August 19, 2017, 08:38:35 AM »
Yes, this is the thread. I told him to PM you.

Ok, I'll watch for it.

Cheers,
Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
72 500, 74 550, 75 550K, 75 550F, 76 550F, 77 550F X2, 78 550K, 77 750F X2, 78 750F, 79CX500, 85 700SC, GL1100

Those that learn from history are doomed to repeat it by those that don't learn from history.

Offline scottly

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #28 on: August 19, 2017, 09:39:57 AM »
Will a '77 400F petcock work on a 550?
Don't fix it if it ain't broke!
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Offline Bankerdanny

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #29 on: August 19, 2017, 02:13:31 PM »
Stopped for fuel and Taco Bell on my way to TT's. I got about 80 miles before it started acting up, didn't seem like it was going to be intermittent this time.

Soldiered along for a while then, inspired by the talk about overheating EI units decided to try an experiment. I pulled the points cover off to allow air to flow across the unit. Sure enough less than 1/2 mile back on the road the missing cylinders kicked in and it has run fine for over 120 miles since.

Still going to Lloyd's to get points, but if I had to I could probably get home running it like this. But if I don't have to that is worth the trip.
"The problem with quotes on the Internet is that you never know if they're true" - Abraham Lincoln

Current: '76 CB750F. Previous:  '75 CB550F, 2007 Yamaha Vino 125 Scooter, '75 Harley FXE Superglide, '77 GL1000, '77 CB550k, '68 Suzuki K10 80, '68 Yamaha YR2, '69 BMW R69S, '71 Honda SL175, '02 Royal Enfield Bullet 500, '89 Yamaha FJ1200

Offline scottly

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #30 on: August 19, 2017, 02:18:24 PM »
That would seem to confirm the Martek is the fault, rather a coil.
Don't fix it if it ain't broke!
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Offline BomberMann650

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #31 on: August 19, 2017, 06:03:48 PM »
Can the martek be serviced?

Offline scottly

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #32 on: August 19, 2017, 06:04:53 PM »
No.
Don't fix it if it ain't broke!
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Offline madmtnmotors

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #33 on: August 19, 2017, 06:48:05 PM »
Exactly why I throw a loaded points plate in the bag for a long haul.  Haven't needed it, but it's there if I do. 8)

Don't forget the point cam!  :o  ;)
TAMTF...


Wilbur



Projects:
"Evolution": http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=100352.0
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F2/F3 O-rings: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=113672.msg1300721#msg1300721
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Clean up that nasty harness: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=137351.msg1549191#msg1549191
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,148188.msg1688494.html#msg1688494
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,139544.msg1579364.html#msg1579364
                                          
Charging system diagnosis: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=1012.msg8345#msg8345
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Branden's leak free top end thread: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=107040.0
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                                      http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,100352.msg1675840.html#msg1675840
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                                    http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,110931.msg1248354.html#msg1248354
                                    http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,48858.msg515204.html#msg515204
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Shorten your forks: http://vintage-and-classic-honda-s.456789.n3.nabble.com/How-to-shorten-forks-td4042465.html DO NOT CUT THE SPRINGS!
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Offline scottly

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #34 on: August 19, 2017, 06:53:16 PM »
Both Matt and Danny needed it on this Reunion ride. :o
Don't fix it if it ain't broke!
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Offline seanbarney41

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #35 on: August 19, 2017, 07:41:52 PM »
disappointed that I have one of these ignitions waiting to be tried...maybe I shouldn't bother.  Danny, that ignition uses an optical trigger.  Maybe dust or oil is getting on the trigger?
If it works good, it looks good...

Offline scottly

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #36 on: August 19, 2017, 07:58:54 PM »
Seems to be heat related, Sean. If it was something optical, removing the point cover shouldn't have made any difference.
Where are Danny and Lloyd?? WE NEED UPDATES! ;D
Don't fix it if it ain't broke!
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Offline TwoTired

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #37 on: August 19, 2017, 11:08:49 PM »
Danny arrived durring a rain storm with the bike running on all four.  Robbed an advancer unit off one of my parts bikes, added a loaded tec points plate to his spares.

I'm not too familiar with the martek unit.  I don't know how sensitive the optical trigger is the dust and grime.  But, it was working well with the cover removed and added cooling air.   Number one spark plug was sooty.  He is using champion plugs.  A brand I abandoned for the 550 years ago.  Danny said he couldn't find a store that stocked NGK.  But, they are sparking and he has a spare set.  Cleaned off the soot, regapped them, and put them back in..
Carb one was dripping.  Put a new oring on the drain plug.  Drained the bowl into clean pan and found black bits.  Far more than I'd like to see.  Checked the tank and there is some rust scale at the bottom. But the sock filter looks good from the gas filler angle.
Dropped number one carb bowl.  More sediment.  #38 pilots. Blew them out clean just for giggles.  Checked the float needle.  Looks okay, spring pin not too stiff.  But, it is fatter than I remember for a stock Kehin.  Found a sharp, deep divot on the float tang pressing on the valve spring pin.  Looked to be about the size of a stock kehin spring pin diameter.  Hmmm.  Anyway, ground away the sharpness, and polished the float tab.  Didn't quite make it perfectly flat though.  But, it is smooth. Took out the valve seat.  Came out too easy.  So found a new oring for the seat. Reset the float height.

Danny looked over my neglected bikes, and spotted an F seat.  Not perfect, but far better for touring than the seat he had.  I reluctantly sold him the seat so his trip would be more pleasant, and I probably have enough 550 F seats for my remaining projects.
 
Rather than spend the night here, Danny decided to ride off in the dark toward Flagstaff for his foray into New Mexico.  Bike sounded good as it rode off down the long driveway.

It was a pleasent visit.  But, it sure showed that I am just not set up to work on bikes here in AZ yet.  I have 4 or 5 10mm sockets... All in CA with the rest of my metric tools.  Erg.  And all my spares are still packed away in boxes on shelving for storage, rather than accessibility.

It was a good day.  Danny did most of the work, really.  I gave a few directions.
Hope the rest of his trip goes well.

Cheers,
Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
72 500, 74 550, 75 550K, 75 550F, 76 550F, 77 550F X2, 78 550K, 77 750F X2, 78 750F, 79CX500, 85 700SC, GL1100

Those that learn from history are doomed to repeat it by those that don't learn from history.

Offline Bankerdanny

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #38 on: August 20, 2017, 10:57:12 AM »
Fresh drama. Started running off again, not as bad as before,  but not right.

Short story is that the #1 intake adjuster backed off and bent the adjuster screw. So I am stuck at a rest stop. Lloyd is being a super hero and brining me a replacement, 2 actually since I also discovered significant pitting on the #1 exhaust adjuster too. It's about a 2 hour 1 way drive for Lloyd to do this for me. Simple thanks just isn't enough.
"The problem with quotes on the Internet is that you never know if they're true" - Abraham Lincoln

Current: '76 CB750F. Previous:  '75 CB550F, 2007 Yamaha Vino 125 Scooter, '75 Harley FXE Superglide, '77 GL1000, '77 CB550k, '68 Suzuki K10 80, '68 Yamaha YR2, '69 BMW R69S, '71 Honda SL175, '02 Royal Enfield Bullet 500, '89 Yamaha FJ1200

Offline CycleRanger

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #39 on: August 20, 2017, 11:07:44 AM »
Fresh drama. Started running off again, not as bad as before,  but not right.

Short story is that the #1 intake adjuster backed off and bent the adjuster screw. So I am stuck at a rest stop. Lloyd is being a super hero and bringing me a replacement, 2 actually since I also discovered significant pitting on the #1 exhaust adjuster too. It's about a 2 hour 1 way drive for Lloyd to do this for me. Simple thanks just isn't enough.

I'll chip in for Lloyd's gas! Just to keep this adventure going! :D
Do you have a copy of the Honda Shop Manual or Parts List for your bike? Get one here:
https://www.honda4fun.com/materiale/documentazione-tecnica
CB750K5        '79 XL250s     CL350K3
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Offline PeWe

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #40 on: August 20, 2017, 01:37:20 PM »
This adventure makes me more convinced to continue with points, improved by the Hondaman ign module  :)
Race bikes used on a circuit do not have long way home when ignition fails, to the trailer.
CB750 K6-76  970cc (Earlier 1005cc JMR Billet block on the shelf waiting for a comeback)
CB750 K2-75 Parts assembled to a stock K2

Updates of the CB750 K6 -1976
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180468.msg2092136.html#msg2092136
The billet block build thread
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,49438.msg1863571.html#msg1863571
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http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,168243.msg1948381.html#msg1948381
K2 engine build thread. For a complete CB750 -75
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180088.msg2088008.html#msg2088008
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Offline scottly

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #41 on: August 20, 2017, 03:14:27 PM »

Short story is that the #1 intake adjuster backed off and bent the adjuster screw. So I am stuck at a rest stop. Lloyd is being a super hero and brining me a replacement, 2 actually since I also discovered significant pitting on the #1 exhaust adjuster too. It's about a 2 hour 1 way drive for Lloyd to do this for me. Simple thanks just isn't enough.
Three cheers for Lloyd! Hip-hip hurray! 8) 8)
Don't fix it if it ain't broke!
Helmets save brains. Always wear one and ride like everyone is trying to kill you....

Offline TwoTired

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #42 on: August 20, 2017, 08:14:42 PM »
Will a '77 400F petcock work on a 550?
Yes if 77 or 78 models.

Cheers,
Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
72 500, 74 550, 75 550K, 75 550F, 76 550F, 77 550F X2, 78 550K, 77 750F X2, 78 750F, 79CX500, 85 700SC, GL1100

Those that learn from history are doomed to repeat it by those that don't learn from history.

Offline scottly

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #43 on: August 20, 2017, 08:18:35 PM »
Well come on man; how did today's rescue go?? The anticipation is killing me! ;D
Don't fix it if it ain't broke!
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Offline TwoTired

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #44 on: August 20, 2017, 10:23:32 PM »
"Rescue" went well, I think.
I was worried that a bent adjuster screw meant a bent valve stem.  I thought they were tougher than the stem.  But, personal inspection didn't seem to be the case.
So, we put on the used adjusters I brought with me.  And then set the lash.  The engine wasn't cold exactly, but had been sitting for three hours-ish.  I decided to check the rest of the tappets.  Good thing. The lash was all over. And all but one was not tight enough to be trusted.  Moved on to set up gap and timing on the points.  Took me way more time than usual.  I really missed my simple light bulb.  The volt meter gives the right information.  But, you need chameleon articulating eyes to see both the meter and the timing marks while rotating the crank.  Eventually got that done, and it was time for start up.  It was a struggle and sounded bad when it finally sputtered to life.  Number one pipe was cold.  Same one that had adjuster issues.  Then Dan, standing on number one side, found the number one spark lead was not on.  So, it was really running pretty good on two cylinders.  I don't know why it was ever removed.  With the ignition system whole, the bike fired right up, and sounded good. He took it for a little ride, and it was a bit burbly under load.  I tried a ride and it was pretty doggy.  Turns out rhe choke was left partially on.  With the choke off it was certainly better.  But, still pretty anemic for a 550.  Handled like a truck, too. (More later)
The bike has pods and a kerker and 069a carbs, so I asked about jetting. 38 pilots, 100 mains, and the original needles in an unknown position.

Pity I didn't drive it when at my house.  Probably could have corrected the jetting there.  I think the needles need to be raised, and would prefer the needle profile of the 022a carbs, for the pods and pipe change done to this F model.  Dan said it had about the same power as before the tappet incident, and would ride on with it the way it is.  I brought the trailer for no good use.  Oh well.

I had drooled a bit over the Lester mags on the bike.  But, the 110 metrics on the front makies turning a chore.  The 550 is naturally very responsive.  Even a serious head lean will begin a gentle turn.  Not this bike.  Even a body lean and this bike will go straight until you wrench the bars for turning.
I suppose the head bearings could be too tight.  Wasn't time to investigate to conclusion and affect a cure.  Now it is up to Danny to apply attention to his bike when he choses.
Had I known, he could have ridden one of my 550s, to feel 5-10 more horsepower, and a neutral responsive, agile bike in stock configuration.  On the otherhand, he might have kept riding off toward the east! 🙂

Got a msg from Danny a few minures ago saying he'd stopped for the night in Springerville, and the bike was running great.

cheers,
Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
72 500, 74 550, 75 550K, 75 550F, 76 550F, 77 550F X2, 78 550K, 77 750F X2, 78 750F, 79CX500, 85 700SC, GL1100

Those that learn from history are doomed to repeat it by those that don't learn from history.

Offline TwoTired

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #45 on: August 21, 2017, 12:03:42 AM »
I just remembered.  When I got to the rest stop, Dan had the bike unloaded and was wiring in his phone charger to the bike.  Gotta admire his faith in things working out for the better.

Cheers,
Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
72 500, 74 550, 75 550K, 75 550F, 76 550F, 77 550F X2, 78 550K, 77 750F X2, 78 750F, 79CX500, 85 700SC, GL1100

Those that learn from history are doomed to repeat it by those that don't learn from history.

Offline Franky

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #46 on: August 21, 2017, 03:39:16 AM »
I love this! Great story! Helping eachother out like that is wonderful :-)
1974 Honda CB360T Stock
1974 Honda CB550 K0 Stock
1977 Honda CB550 K3 Cafe - never ending build :)
1988 Honda Dax ST50 Cafe
1997 Honda Benly 50S Stock

Check out my "Yamaha R6 fork on a CB550 made easy" thread:
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Offline Bankerdanny

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #47 on: August 21, 2017, 07:24:49 AM »
The bike is running well, at least as well as when I started. I will have to see about tuning the carbs when I get back. Today I am riding the Coronado Trail Scenic Parkway (I-191) which pre-Eisenhower was apparently Hwy 666, so the locals call it the Devil's Highway. Stayed at a really cool old Motel last night. A Western themed single story in the classic U shape. I'll post a couple pictures after breakfast.
"The problem with quotes on the Internet is that you never know if they're true" - Abraham Lincoln

Current: '76 CB750F. Previous:  '75 CB550F, 2007 Yamaha Vino 125 Scooter, '75 Harley FXE Superglide, '77 GL1000, '77 CB550k, '68 Suzuki K10 80, '68 Yamaha YR2, '69 BMW R69S, '71 Honda SL175, '02 Royal Enfield Bullet 500, '89 Yamaha FJ1200

Offline Bankerdanny

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #48 on: August 21, 2017, 08:58:50 AM »
I definitely missed a huge opportunity to have Lloyd tune my carbs for me. Oh well, it just means I get a chance to expand my own skill set.
"The problem with quotes on the Internet is that you never know if they're true" - Abraham Lincoln

Current: '76 CB750F. Previous:  '75 CB550F, 2007 Yamaha Vino 125 Scooter, '75 Harley FXE Superglide, '77 GL1000, '77 CB550k, '68 Suzuki K10 80, '68 Yamaha YR2, '69 BMW R69S, '71 Honda SL175, '02 Royal Enfield Bullet 500, '89 Yamaha FJ1200

Offline evinrude7

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Re: Intermittent cylinders kicking out.
« Reply #49 on: August 21, 2017, 10:17:40 AM »
Safe travels and kudos to Scottly and Lloyd.

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