Topic: CB400F project, where to start?

[Alaxy Galaxy]

Hello,

I finally got around to picking up a 400/4 project. And it's a big one. It's pretty much disassembled (except for the engine+gearbox, which has never been split) and it's missing some key components. What I really wanna know is, where do I start?

I was thinking of painting the frame and putting the motor back in and then assembling the chassis. But I'd need to purchase a few things to put the wheels on (front axle clamps, rear axle + spacer). So instead, I'm thinking of installing the wiring harness as a next step.

Here's what I'm missing, as far as I can tell so far:

-Tank
-Seat
-Exhaust
-Starter motor
-RH foot rest
-Rear brake pedal
-Front axle clamps
-Motor mounts
-Rear axle + spacers
-Harness strap
-Meter bracket

I have a 100$ a month budget, and I'm obviously not in a rush, so I want to buy parts strategically that I can assemble it in the right order.

How would you do it?

[Stev-o]

I recently completed a similar project except the motor received a full rebuild which I did first.

Yes, start with the frame and engine paint first. I prefer powdercoat for the frame, but paint is more budget friendly. Prep is key to good paintwork, so be sure to clean everything really good.

[Yamahawk]

+1 on Stev-o's reply! Always start with the frame, and if it does need painting, you are a step ahead as then engine is out, swing arm is off, so paint them both first. Then, put your swing arm on, get wheels installed to make it a rolling chassis. So, looks like eBay will be your friend, or call a cycle salvage!
Charlie

[Alaxy Galaxy]

I recently completed a similar project except the motor received a full rebuild which I did first.

Yes, start with the frame and engine paint first. I prefer powdercoat for the frame, but paint is more budget friendly. Prep is key to good paintwork, so be sure to clean everything really good.

I think the first thing I'm going to do is de-grease the frame and assess the situation. I may not even paint it completely and just do some touch-up work.

Regarding the engine, It's currently sitting with the covers off in my shed in a big plastic tub. What should I coat the moving parts with to avoid corrosion? I'm not too too sure that WD40 will mix well with engine oil when I finally get to deal with it (might be months, might be over a year). I'm in Montreal, so freezing weather is just around the corner. I may not even touch it for 3-4 months.

Thanks!

[Alaxy Galaxy]

+1 on Stev-o's reply! Always start with the frame, and if it does need painting, you are a step ahead as then engine is out, swing arm is off, so paint them both first. Then, put your swing arm on, get wheels installed to make it a rolling chassis. So, looks like eBay will be your friend, or call a cycle salvage!
Charlie

Yeah? That's what I was thinking too. The front axle clamps are easy to source, for sure. The rear wheel is a bit more involved, since the spacers and wheel adjusters all need to be sourced out. I'll see what I can find for my 100$ monthly allowance! 

[innovativems]

Good plan on your frame.  I second what others said, get the frame & swinger in order and assemble the roller.  I would suggest doing a compression & leak down on the motor and inspecting the cam chain tension-er functionality.  If all is in good order, I like fogging oil in a motor that is going to sit and can even spray the outside to protect it. 

[Yamahawk]

+1 on Stev-o's reply! Always start with the frame, and if it does need painting, you are a step ahead as then engine is out, swing arm is off, so paint them both first. Then, put your swing arm on, get wheels installed to make it a rolling chassis. So, looks like eBay will be your friend, or call a cycle salvage!
Charlie

Yeah? That's what I was thinking too. The front axle clamps are easy to source, for sure. The rear wheel is a bit more involved, since the spacers and wheel adjusters all need to be sourced out. I'll see what I can find for my 100$ monthly allowance! 

My friend pat has an axle room too lol... Tomorrow, I am stopping in to work a little bit on the BSA chopper, so I will look and see if he has your front axle clamps, and rear axle with spacers, as he usually keeps them all on the axle bolt, held on by the nut. Just for corroboration, what year is your CB400F? It may not make a difference, but then again, you never know. I am amazed what I find in there, he has three floors of motorcycle parts!
Charlie

[Alaxy Galaxy]

My friend pat has an axle room too lol... Tomorrow, I am stopping in to work a little bit on the BSA chopper, so I will look and see if he has your front axle clamps, and rear axle with spacers, as he usually keeps them all on the axle bolt, held on by the nut. Just for corroboration, what year is your CB400F? It may not make a difference, but then again, you never know. I am amazed what I find in there, he has three floors of motorcycle parts!
Charlie

Hey, thanks!

The frame is a '77, but I'm going to change the bars, pegs and foot controls to the earlier style. So far I've had a red '75 and a maroon '77 that I eventually converted with a blue '75 tank and sidecovers. So now I want a yellow one. I don't have a tank for it yet, so whatever I find is going to determine if I go with the '76 or the '77 (with low bars) style.

[Alaxy Galaxy]

Good plan on your frame.  I second what others said, get the frame & swinger in order and assemble the roller.  I would suggest doing a compression & leak down on the motor and inspecting the cam chain tension-er functionality.  If all is in good order, I like fogging oil in a motor that is going to sit and can even spray the outside to protect it.

Great, thanks! My local auto parts store has a spray can for 10$. I'll get on that over the weekend.

[FuZZie]

You should work your extra bits too...

Put a add in the wanted forum with what your looking for and offer your spars up as barter. Same time you can offer them up for sale too. Couple of extra bucks or some horse trading could help you stretch that budget.      

[MoMo]

I have quite a few 400 spare parts but I am in USA.  good luck...Larry

[strynboen]

thek the can thain tensioner bolts..if they are broken off..there is a komplet engine splitt job to be done...and the Money must be safed to the engine..and not use the vhole on frame and paint..and funny stuff...the veak poinmt on 400 fours is the engine..live a hard life those small engines..as yoy need to hammer them to follov the other riders...

[Alaxy Galaxy]

thek the can thain tensioner bolts..if they are broken off..there is a komplet engine splitt job to be done...and the Money must be safed to the engine..and not use the vhole on frame and paint..and funny stuff...the veak poinmt on 400 fours is the engine..live a hard life those small engines..as yoy need to hammer them to follov the other riders...

That depends; I'm a small man, so my two previous CB400Fs didn't have to work very hard at lugging my 55kg around! But thank you. I am going to inspect the cam chain bolts and tensioners when I get to looking at the engine.

[Alaxy Galaxy]

I have quite a few 400 spare parts but I am in USA.  good luck...Larry

I'm not very far from the USA at all! It's about a 40-mile trip to the border from where I live. I often use a parcel holding service called Freeport Forwarding in upper state NY to save on eBay shipping fees.

I'm actually going to inventory everything I have over the weekend. I decided that printing out the parts diagrams and highlighting every part I find was the easiest way to do it I just have to figure out a non-destructive way to then indicate on the parts that they have been catalogued. I'll probably put some stuff up in the for sale/wanted section after that.

Things I know I have too many of:

Air filter box, air snorkel, some wiring, '77-style brake pedal, rear inner fender, complete frame, passenger foot pegs... I'll have a more complete picture next week.

[przjohn]

I always like to get to a rolling chassis first. It makes it much easier as your build progresses to work on the bike. Get the frame, suspension, wheels, etc. all set and you have a great work platform to move forward on. I have included a shameless link to one of my BOTM builds.  for reference. Best of luck on your build.

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,143694.0.html

[Yamahawk]

OK! My friend Pat has a 1975 CB400f rear axle with spacers, but I found one from another friend of mine in Huron, Ohio. He has an eBay listing for it, certainly cheap enough, and here's the link!
https://www.ebay.com/itm/75-Honda-CB-400-CB400-F-four-Super-Sport-rear-back-axle-shaft-bolt/311621351719?hash=item488e147927:g:pg0AAMXQDnpTYU~J&vxp=mtr

Hope you get this one, Mike is a nice guy, and he sells a lot of parts on eBay!!

Charlie

[Bodi]

I am wondering just what you have and what you don't. I see 8 shocks, 3 side covers, 3 air filters,  no wheels, no carbs. So this isn't a "normal" basket job with the parts for one bike (minus whatever was misplaced, sold, or given away of course... basket jobs are never really complete).
Checking off from a parts diagram ... maybe? Doing a trial assembly of the chassis is probably better if you have room. Without wheels the chassis is not terribly heavy or large.
The big question is "why is this in pieces?". Taking one apart like that is a lot of work. Most owners don't break down a running bike out of boredom. I have most of a bike in boxes, I got it solely for parts - and quite a few of its parts nave been used. If you laid the remaining stuff out as you have, the picture would be very similar.

[FuZZie]

Wheels are in the first pic Bodi and he had another tread on the carbs so I know he has them.
That said I don't see down pipes or exhaust and you know what a nice set of oem pipes can go for.

[Alaxy Galaxy]

Thanks so much for all your help, guys.

I do have the wheels and carbs.

Actually, it all started with a frame. I have been looking for a good CB400F project for about a year and a half. None of the three good projects I saw had papers and the DMV regs for registering paperless vehicles have really gotten tight here in Quebec. It is in fact impossible to register a bike/car if the last known owner doesn't sign it over to you. That goes for all cars, whether it be a 1999 Civic or a barn-find 1963 Ferrari GTO. And it's your job to find that owner, not the DMV's. (Ask me how angry I got when talking to the rep on the phone).

Anyway, I found a '77 frame with papers for 20$ a few months ago (guy had a "rebuilt" carb pack for 40$ too!) and I started looking for a decent project. The one I found was cheap and was in great shape. Sadly for me, the frame without papers I got is in much greater shape than my frame with papers. The 3 biggest things I'm missing are a tank, seat and complete exhaust. I know a repop seat can be had for not much money, but the tank and exhaust will surely set me back several hundred dollars.

As far as I can tell from the PO, he bought two bikes in order to make one good bobber show bike and kept the better bits for himself. So far, all the brightwork is really shiny, the clocks work great (with my drill, mind you) and I have two harnesses so I can surely make one good one out of the two if I need to. My biggest concern is the motor. It turns over really easily with the kickstarter and I was told the compression was good, but I have not tested it myself. I have no real reason for concern, however.

And the reason for the six rear shocks is that I got a crusty set with my frame, and two sets with my parts lot because the seller will surely go for some upgrades for his bobber project.

I'll go with the rolling chassis suggestion for now. It seems like a good way to start. In any event, these bikes are pretty easy to assemble - if you have all the parts. I tore down my 2nd CB400F twice and it wasn't too bad... Although I'm sure I'm remembering that wrong!

[Alaxy Galaxy]

OK! My friend Pat has a 1975 CB400f rear axle with spacers, but I found one from another friend of mine in Huron, Ohio. He has an eBay listing for it, certainly cheap enough, and here's the link!
https://www.ebay.com/itm/75-Honda-CB-400-CB400-F-four-Super-Sport-rear-back-axle-shaft-bolt/311621351719?hash=item488e147927:g:pg0AAMXQDnpTYU~J&vxp=mtr

Hope you get this one, Mike is a nice guy, and he sells a lot of parts on eBay!!

Charlie

That's a great price. Thank you; I'll look into that over the weekend as well.

[FuZZie]

None of the three good projects I saw had papers and the DMV regs for registering paperless vehicles have really gotten tight here in Quebec. It is in fact impossible to register a bike/car if the last known owner doesn't sign it over to you. That goes for all cars, whether it be a 1999 Civic or a barn-find 1963 Ferrari GTO. And it's your job to find that owner, not the DMV's. (Ask me how angry I got when talking to the rep on the phone).

Been there done that in a few provinces, and then all that feel-good-privacy-bull#$%* really helps.....

[MoMo]

On the frame, what about filling in the numbers on the good frame and restamping the titled numbers?  I've done that and don't see anything wrong even though it most likely is technically illegal...Larry

[Alaxy Galaxy]

On the frame, what about filling in the numbers on the good frame and restamping the titled numbers?  I've done that and don't see anything wrong even though it most likely is technically illegal...Larry

It's not only technically illegal, it's the exact definition of VIN swapping.  I don't really see a reason to go down that road. (Mind you, a rider friend had a Kawasaki 650 with a swapped frame and he just riveted the metal ID plate over the stamped numbers)

The crusty frame is just that: crusty. It's not really bad, just more work to get it looking nice. Hell, I'm so impatient to get this bike going that I'll probably just clean it up and start slapping stuff on there right away!

[Yamahawk]

Take your time... it's winter now, and you have time to clean up the crusty frame and paint it with some nice epoxy black and let it cure. Sounds like the engine could be gone through while that cleaned and painted frame was curing, and being made into a rolling chassis for your engine.
Again, get that rolling chassis done. Now, about your front forks... you say you need the lower axle caps, are they caps on each leg, or is there a solid leg with a hole and pinch bolt, and the other leg with the cap, or do they both have caps? If they are both half caps with studs in the lowers, can you measure the c-c on the studs, and the width of the caps, and I will see if the CB350k or CB550k models are the same. Couldn't find ANY CB400f forks upstairs, so he must have sold them already. But, pretty sure he has CB400f SuperSport tanks  up there... 1975 I believe. Will look more later today if I get the chance.
Charlie

[Killer Canary]

Strynboen is correct about the cam chain tensioner; mine was seized at the pivot point in the upper case from sitting.
You should be able to confirm it's movement by removing the blade from the block and reaching forward through the oil pan opening.