Topic: unintended project bike

[cb000019]

Honda CB 750, beautiful bike wrecked by truck. Mint classic condition with a rebuilt engine.

Before



Then the Accident where a Ford F350 clipped my front wheel @ 65 MPH



Aftermath, picked up from the towing company's yard



Pulled the engine and a "new" junk yard frame with a clean title



And it runs, after replacing the stator and cover. Registered in Washington, very easy and hassle free, no problems at all. #$%* California's DMV!!!!! Now starts the real work. As now it's road worthy and ugly as sin. The to do list is getting built now. more of a reminder to me and open to modification

1) gordon frame kit
2) motogadget.com wiring, switches, fuse box, analogue gauge w/ magnetic pick up
3) cognitomoto.com swap front end with gsx or cbr forks and triple tree
4) high rise clip ons
5) sandblast/remove paint on frame
6) get fenders and move foot pegs higher, they tend to hit the ground in sharp turns
7) replace starter
hondaman ignition http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,67543.0.html
9) ignitech http://www.ignitech.cz/en/vyrobky/tcip/tcip.htm
10) space reserved for future to do list

[calj737]

Numbers 8&9 seem at odds with each other? And #9 doesn’t seem to be compatible with our mechanical advance ignitions  Looks like a good system for full electronic and fuel injected bikes...

[FuZZie]

I hope you walked away ok from that, looks like you could have been hurt!

[cb000019]

Hi folks,

today i got my brand new Ignitech programmable Ignition "Sparker TCIP4". It's an electronic ignition useable for 2 to 6 cylinder bikes. It has some really nice functions and adjustments.

The manufacturer

Ignitech s.r.o
http://ignitech.cz/en/kontakt

They also have rectifiers, regulators, programmable injections controls and so on (check the link)


My reason for the purchase:

I wanted to get rid of the bouncy mechanical advancer and points.
Though my motor had been tuned and equipped with a primary chain tensioner, its idle is still not the best.
That's because the advancer is actually bouncing and advancing the ignition at idle revolutions.
Moreover, sometimes I got problems with a weak spark on cylinder 4, which is known as an issue with the stock ignitions Honda used in the 70s.

Since another electronic ignition was not an option because the most would keep the mechanical advancer, I am about to install the whole system with a fixed advancer and have the timing adjusted by software.

Some of the features of the Ignitech ignition are

-elimination of mechanical advancer
-programmable timing-charts
-programmable rev-limiter
-output for gear-switch indicator
-output for digital Tachometers
-output for fuel-pump control (relais-based)
-output for servo-controls

...and so on

Let's get to the real deal now.

The ignition arrived with everything needed to get it running on an old CB 550. The current software release is provided by a CD



For the pick-up system there is a laser-cutted pulse rotor out of steel (to be mounted on crankshaft)



The CDI's connectors are embedded in resin, so its totally waterproof and well fabricated



The new "contact-breakers" in disguise as magnetic pick-ups



So far, it is not a plug&play system, since you need to make a new layout for the ignition baseplate. Ignitech offers plug&play solutions for most modern bikes, which are already using a CDI.

I made a CAD template to transfer the marks for the different bores to a GRP plate. It's easy to handle, resists the temperatures and vibration and: I have no metal here to use right now




Since the 2 pickups always cover at least one of the mounting screws, I'll have to use some countersunk bolts.



That's the original ignition baseplate stripped on the template



More will follow....

[Stev-o]

Subscribed.  +1, hope you walked away.  Looked pretty bad.

[calj737]

I see now... But you still won’t need Hondamans ignition if you use the Ignitek. Was that an oversight or either/or?

The Ignitek looks much like the C5 some of us run.

[cb000019]

i was considering hondaman or ignitech, just throwing darts up there to see what sticks.

after all i ended up with a dyna 2000.

got the gordon frame kit on there. not sure how i like the allan bolts holding it in place, i think using pins held in by cotter pins might be better. the allan bolts are pretty hard to screw in, never want to line up straight all the time.

definitely easier putting the engine in with the exhaust studs removed and the gordon frame kit.

now the bike is getting shipped to florida i'll be there for 6 months and get the real work started.

a bunch of parts showed up too, this should get good!! waiting for Hondaman's book to show up from LuLu, FedEx taking their sweet ass time! ordered that book 2 weeks ago.








the parts!!!!

[cb000019]

forgot how to embed the photos. fixed!

[calj737]

The trick to welding that frame kit and preventing distortion, is to install the lugs in both sections, screw it down TIGHT. Then, tack it up on all the tubes. Then weld as much of the kit while it's installed and screwed down or you will see the lugs "clock" out of position just enough to misalign the holes.

Realize that when you weld those lugs in, you're sealing that tube up. The accumulated pressure from the welding has nowhere to escape. This exacerbates the distortion. You certainly don't want to quick quench them either. So I always drill a small hole in the underside of the tube (the removable section) and weld up the ends. Then after everything cools, I remove the kit, and spot weld up that hole. That has helped me prevent the issue you're describing. Its harder to do it this way, but its more accurate when you're done.

[cb000019]

arrived in my new home, didn't come with a garage so i bought one. :p

the project continues to be a money pit! i need to hire people for work cause i don't own the tools! pressing the stems out, new cognito in. i should go buy a dremel so i can at least cut and grind the tabs off my frame.

to do list; hire a soda blasting company to do my frame and gas tank, then powder coat, get the electrical mocked up with the new triple and clip on handle bars.
figure out a way to mount my truck lite on the gsxr forks,
rebuild front calipers from k1 gixxer, the fluid turned to a solid in them!!
hire a machinist to fabricate a oil tank that will slide into the spot where the plastic tool bucket was under the f model seat. also fabricate a 1" tall electronics tray for my 4 cell gravity.

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

Google the diameter in mm and fork bracket and you will get a variety of options to mount your headlight bucket with the truck lite LED housing.  Speigler sells higher end brackets (LSL I think), but you can find cheaper options.

[MetroRedneck]

I found a nice set of aluminum brackets on eBay and bent them to fit my bucket. The Gixxer forks are too wide to use straight brackets.  Brackets are good quality.  My gixxer fork tubes are 54mm but they do step so you need to figure out how high your brackets will mount. I think the LSLs offer the 2 bracket sizes if you need those.

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F322996605096

[cb000019]

I found a nice set of aluminum brackets on eBay and bent them to fit my bucket. The Gixxer forks are too wide to use straight brackets.  Brackets are good quality.  My gixxer fork tubes are 54mm but they do step so you need to figure out how high your brackets will mount. I think the LSLs offer the 2 bracket sizes if you need those.

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F322996605096

Ah those look good. At this point anything less than 200 bucks sounds reasonably priced to me!

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

[Terry in Australia]

Well done with the Dyna 2000 mate, they're a great ignition, if the 30 year old Dyna III on my bike ever fails I might buy one. I installed one on a friend's K1 a few years ago, and it ran magnificently. I'll be interested to see your new oil tank. Cheers, Terry.

[PeWe]

I hope you'll get it back in same shape as before! One of the best looking F2's I have ever seen! Look like mostly stock with the Honda spirit still intact.

[cb000019]

I took the engine down to the cylinder block, inspected and clenaed; then when putting it back together I followed Hondamans manual and hackaweek's videos. Weird thing though that I wasn't sure about was the camshaft timing; I did it like I was told, looks like _ | _ 12 o'clock when I put it in. Then I rotated it a few times, and noticed that when it was at 6'oclock perfectly lined up; - , - but at 12oclock on the T it was off about 4-5 degrees.

Research led me to two posts:

http://vintage-and-classic-honda-s.456789.n3.nabble.com/A-tale-of-two-teeth-td4047160.html


pretty much looks exactly like what mine

and

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=107248.0

any ideas?

[cb000019]

hondamans manual says up to 10 degrees advance is better for low end torque. great, cause right now the F mark is lining up perfect when the horizontal marks are dead on 90 degrees.

[cb000019]

got the frame back powder coated. beautifully!!

i put the races in, using the all balls racing tapered bearings. for this 1977 cb 750k frame i used the thick spacer with a gsxr 2001 bottom triple. It didn't quite line up when i used both spacers so I had to take it apart and redo it. frustrating!

it's coming togeher. hope it all runs afterwards





supposed to be 1/4 inch above the clamp, but this was the best it could line up before i took off both spacers and had a press put the bearing on!



i redid it, and wallah!

[cb000019]

i need help?

got my wire going from + battery -->> 30 amp fuse, -->> + terminal of the motogadget which also has the red wire of the rectifier and the motoLock (just think of that as the key switch) connected all to the + terminal.

does it matter where the 30amp fuse is in the line up? between + battery and + motogadget? between motogadget and reg/rec? i do not use a starter so i do not use a starter solenoid.

when the key switch is turned on, the Auxiliary comes on, -->> through the black wire on the rectifier[/i]right? and to both black/white wires on the coils. and coming out of the reg/rec is black, green, white. i'm guessing that green is ground, black is to the auxiliary output motogadget(only gets powered when the key switch is on) and white goes to the battery(which is red in my drawing)

that made sense in my mind!! one more time to get it as simple as possible:

i'll highlight this part cause it's probably the best way i explained it.

3 yellow, green, and white coming out of my stator. --->> connect to 3 yellow, green, and red of the regulator rectifier female plug. yellow to yellow, green to green, white to red. -->> white, green, black coming out of reg/rec -->> green to ground, black to keyswitch, white to battery.

is this what i want?

the regulator and rectifier wires: i will make an educated guess the 3 yellow go the the 3 yellow. then i'll continue guessing and say that green goes to green, and is also the ground. ifthey stay with hondas original color scheme. and i'm going way off of that, so don't assume that anything else on the bike will follow. that only leaves white and red, so i guess i put them together.

[cb000019]

theory expanded after further research: white is the power to the field; if i connect white directly to battery it will drain my battery. so that one needs to go to the keyswitch toggle. black is always hot, except when it's not. bad joke. black goes to battery, it is my charging wire. green is ground, because green is always ground!! except when its been hooked up to power.

[calj737]

when the key switch is turned on, the Auxiliary comes on, -->> through the black wire on the rectifier[/i]right?

Wrong. The M Unit is energized by the Brown Wire from the M Lock into the LOCK port. If you have the BLACK RR wire in the AUX port, it is providing input to the RR for voltage status of the charging system, back to the battery.

and to both black/white wires on the coils. and coming out of the reg/rec is black, green, white. i'm guessing that green is ground, black is to the auxiliary output motogadget(only gets powered when the key switch is on) and white goes to the battery(which is red in my drawing)

The 3 wires are correctly connecte, but correctly described. (See above)

that made sense in my mind!! one more time to get it as simple as possible:

i'll highlight this part cause it's probably the best way i explained it.

3 yellow, green, and white coming out of my stator. --->> connect to 3 yellow, green, and red of the regulator rectifier female plug. yellow to yellow, green to green, white to red. -->> white, green, black coming out of reg/rec -->> green to ground, black to keyswitchAUX, white to battery.

is this what i want?

Make that change, and you’re fine.

[calj737]

Try this diagram for help:

[cb000019]

ok i am on the right track, thank you!

[calj737]

You’ll notice in that diagram, the RR wiring is swapped. Remove the RED and place the loose WHITE into the plug. Then run the now loose RED to battery +.

I prefer to keep the RR charging wire (RED) away from the M Unit, and run directly to battery. Same for M Lock RED.

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

Cal, you are a regular Stefan Hertel.

[calj737]

Cal, you are a regular Stefan Hertel.

Without the beard 

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

Cal, you are a regular Stefan Hertel.

Without the beard 

He shave it off a couple of months ago.

I met him on Friday night, and the beard is back, although not in full force.

[cb000019]

right so got in touch with 4into1 they sent me a drawing almost as professional as mine

they confirmed your advice! thank you. the red goes to positive battery and the white goes to the white from my stator/field coil. i've got two greens and doubt it matters how green meets ground the electrons will find a way, i'll hook one up to the field coil and one up to the frame, right?

and i thought that this would be a side project hah, doing school at the same time and the bike is like two going from one school to another school. <3 em both though

[cb000019]

yea the revival cycles guy is great, used that video he made about wiring the bike to do my very professional crayon job.