Topic: Starter not working

[northern]

1975 CB550.

It was running and starting fine when I parked it last fall. It was parked inside the garage all winter. No heat for the first month but then heat for the remainder of the winter.

I went to start it this spring and nothing happens when I press the electric start button?   No click, nothing. 

Key is in the first on position and the neutral light is on. Headlight is on.

I was in the middle of a move when I parked the bike last fall and I did not pull the battery out. Fully charged the battery was showing less than 12.4 volts and with the headlight on it dropped to 11.5. So I bought a new battery, which fully charged is showing 12.9 volts. Still nothing when I press the start button.

The on/off switch on the right bar did not seem to matter what position it was in last year. But I have tried moving it around and nothing.

Any suggestions?

It acts like a wiring issue as there is nothing. I checked the 3 glass fuses under the left side panel, are there more fuses elsewhere?

[ekpent]

 Try rapping the solenoid with a screwdriver handle. It may be lightly seized up from sitting all winter. Just for fun put the blade of the screwdriver between the two terminals on the solenoid also to see if your starter spins. Warning it will spark so no gas around. If the solenoid and starter motor are good it could be something in the start button. Always fun stuff.

[northern]

Cranks over great with a screwdriver across the selinoid! 

I guess I should check the starter button? 

[northern]

Found the 2 hard wired wires going to the starter relay.

Black and yellow/red stripe. 

I don’t have 12 volts at the black wire.   

[northern]

Reread your instructions.  I didn’t have the key on. With the key on the black wire has power. 

DOH! 

[northern]

The wire going to the starter button on the right handle bar is green/red stripe?   

[northern]

I have continuity on the yellow/red stripe from the starter relay to behind the headlight. Then the yellow/red stripe wire goes into the indicator light pod on the center of the handle bars. But does not come out of the indicator pod, or at least as yellow/red stripe. 

Inside the headlight it looks like there was a ground wire attached to each of the mounting headlight mounting bolts.  Neither have a wire attracted anymore.  Should there be ground wires attached inside the headlight pod?

[northern]

The wire coming from the handle bar starter push button is G/R. I have continuity from the switch to the G/R in the headlight pod. 

I have not changed any wiring and it was starting last fall this way.  Or maybe I was inside the pod and saw G/R going to Y/R and switched them?   If I switched them inside the headlight pod I should have a continuous wire from the button to the relay. 



So does the push button switch simply ground to the bike to establish ground?   

[northern]

Bike has different signal lights so it makes sense that the gro d wires are home.

I really appreciate your help. 

[scottly]

Cal, can you please post a color schematic for this year 550? Thanks.

[ekpent]

 A very simple test I did recently on a 750 that found a dead/non-working solenoid and proved the starter button was working was I took a cheapie 12 volt probe tester with a light and I clipped the ground to an engine fin and put the end of the probe into the yellow stripe wire at the harness. When I pressed the starter button on with ignition on the test light lit up and when I released the button the light went off proving it was getting power there. The old solenoid had seized up from sitting since the last time I had started it which was a couple of years.

[Don R]

 Did we check the neutral light and does it have a clutch safety switch? I don't think my 75 400  does but it's worth checking.

[northern]

Cal, can you please post a color schematic for this year 550? Thanks.

My black and white wiring diagram shows Y/R from the starter relay to to the starter button.

Not sure what has happened to this bike in the past 40+ years that the switch now has different wiring.

[northern]

Did we check the neutral light and does it have a clutch safety switch? I don't think my 75 400  does but it's worth checking.
[/quote

Neutral light is on.

When I disconnected the Y/R going into the indicator panel the neutral light still worked. 

Not sure about a clutch safety switch, habit, I pull the clutch lever! 

[northern]

So I connected the Y/R wire going from the headlight pod to the starter relay to the G/R wire coming from the starter button into the headlight pod.  I now have a connection from the starter relay to the starter button. 

I turned on the key and tried it. The engine turned over a couple of times and stopped.  The battery is reading 12.4 volts.  I left the key on today doing tests and I bet the headlight killed the battery. 

It’s hooked to the charger for the night......

So now do I hook the Y/R wire coming from the indicator light pod into the G/R harness in the head light pod?   

[scottly]

Cal, can you please post a color schematic for this year 550? Thanks.

My black and white wiring diagram shows Y/R from the starter relay to to the starter button.

Not sure what has happened to this bike in the past 40+ years that the switch now has different wiring.

Was it re-wired over the winter? You shouldn't have to re-wire it now. Not sure about the colors, but your bike might have a Starter Motor Safety Unit (SMSU), which isolates the clutch switch and nuetral switch, so continuity tests from the starter button to the solenoid may be invalid. The SMSU should be located on the side of the bike near the battery and regulator; unplug it and check the condition of the connectors. They may have corroded over the frozen winter months up there.

[northern]

Cal, can you please post a color schematic for this year 550? Thanks.

My black and white wiring diagram shows Y/R from the starter relay to to the starter button.

Not sure what has happened to this bike in the past 40+ years that the switch now has different wiring.

Was it re-wired over the winter? You shouldn't have to re-wire it now. Not sure about the colors, but your bike might have a Starter Motor Safety Unit (SMSU), which isolates the clutch switch and nuetral switch, so continuity tests from the starter button to the solenoid may be invalid. The SMSU should be located on the side of the bike near the battery and regulator; unplug it and check the condition of the connectors. They may have corroded over the frozen winter months up there.

I did not rewire it over the winter.

Last September I replaced a the throttle cables as one had broken.

I have only owned the bike for 18 months. I had it running and driving last summer. It came with Clubman bars. So maybe a PO used a different right handle assembly with the G/R wire?  I am wondering if when I was in the headlight pod if I saw the mismatched wires and flipped them back?  Just guessing here.......

[northern]

Cal, can you please post a color schematic for this year 550? Thanks.

This version of the diagram does indeed show an SSM. Bodi has poo-poo'ed this diagram for "other" inaccuracies, but I find it has been pretty helpful.

Thanks, that is a little easier to follow.

[northern]

So before leaving for working this morning I tried it again with a charged battery, and back to nothing when I press the starter button.

[northern]

The more I read the more confused I am.....   

When I touch a screwdriver across the starter relay the bikes starts!  Runs nicely. 

I can only find one wire going to my starter button, G/R. 

Last night when I hooked the one G/R wire from the starter button. To the Y/R wire coming from starter relay it cranked over briefly and stopped. I did this because I thought the Y/R needed to be grounded to activate the starter relay.  Not the case as the Y/R wire coming out of the starter relay has power when I use a 12V test light.  Could I have fried or burned something out by doing this? 

Is there a way to test the Safety Unit starting motor?   

Clutch switch is moving but is there a way to test it? 

Does the bike require both neutral and clutch in to start? 

I have the headlight out, but is it needed to complete any circuits?   

[northern]

The headlight does not shut off when I hit the starter switch.....

[northern]

I just tore the starter switch open again. I found the Y/R wire inside the bats.  I was broken off!   

Any idea where the Y/R wire attached to the starter button switch? 

[northern]

Thank you to everyone for your input and help.  Y/R is soldered onto the switch again and all is good! 


I am betting I broke that off changing throttle cables last fall.

[scottly]

I did this because I thought the Y/R needed to be grounded to activate the starter relay.  Not the case as the Y/R wire coming out of the starter relay has power when I use a 12V test light. 

The Y/R wire coming out of the starter relay/solenoid is one end of a coil, with the other end being the black wire, which has 12V when the ignition switch is on. When the starter button is pressed, the Y/R wire is indeed grounded, and the voltage drops to zero. The resistance of the coil limits the current so nothing gets burned up. The same thing with ignition coils and points; when the points are open, you will read 12V, or a test lamp will light, and when the points are closed, you will read zero volts, or the light will go out.
Thanks for sharing your fix!

[scottly]

Cal, can you please post a color schematic for this year 550? Thanks.

This version of the diagram does indeed show an SSM. Bodi has poo-poo'ed this diagram for "other" inaccuracies, but I find it has been pretty helpful.

Thanks Cal! I've added it to my library.