Author Topic: First start after rebuild (Read 3710 times)

bambuhiphop · « **on:** May 15, 2018, 10:35:03 PM »

Hello All,

I am just about ready to attempt a start on the motor after the rebuild. I'm being a little overly cautious because of how long I've been at this. I know there are a slew of opinions and thoughts on this whole process but I'm mainly trying to focus on the first start. I've got everything torqued, timed, and set. I've got the hydraulic clutch bled and ready (just in case). Have a little over 3 quarts of oil in the motor. This was going to be my procedure...

- Disconnect coils and work the starter to get oil throughput the motor.
- Confirm oil is working its way up top.
- Reconnect coils.
- Check oil level.
- Go for first run
- Hold slightly elevated rpm (around 2k) for a few minutes.
- Let engine cool, check for leaks, check oil level.
- From there engine is ready to be broken in on additional runs...

Sound like a sound strategy??

my name is nobody · « **Reply #1 on:** May 15, 2018, 10:45:27 PM »

Looks like a plan.
I always crank mine with the plugs out when priming, short bursts, till oil is visible in the top end.
And make sure everything has been pre lubed with oil or assembly lube..fwiw

dave500 · « **Reply #2 on:** May 15, 2018, 10:56:30 PM »

just start it up.

DaveBarbier · « **Reply #3 on:** May 16, 2018, 04:43:32 AM »

For my 550 and 650 motor, just cranking didn’t get oil up to the top end. Maybe my oil pump wasn’t primed fully. I just started it up and opened a tappet cover.

Did you retorque the head after letting it sit overnight?

Aside from that, go fire it up.

Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er · « **Reply #4 on:** May 16, 2018, 10:37:25 AM »

Quote from: dave500 on May 15, 2018, 10:56:30 PM

just start it up.

+1 and watch for oil pressure in a few seconds

bambuhiphop · « **Reply #5 on:** May 16, 2018, 10:39:53 AM »

Quote from: calj737 on May 16, 2018, 03:39:00 AM

You don't need to unplug the coils, just don't move the KILL/RUN switch into the RUN position. IF you're going to let it run for a couple of minutes in the garage, a box fan is recommended to blow air across that motor.

No Kill/Run switch. Just 2 m.switch minis on the left. Thanks for the fan idea. I'll totally do that.

bambuhiphop · « **Reply #6 on:** May 16, 2018, 10:40:42 AM »

Quote from: DaveBarbier on May 16, 2018, 04:43:32 AM

Did you retorque the head after letting it sit overnight?

Yup!

bambuhiphop · « **Reply #7 on:** May 16, 2018, 10:41:22 AM »

Thanks for all the feedback guys!

bambuhiphop · « **Reply #8 on:** May 16, 2018, 11:14:15 PM »

How much cranking is to much cranking? I’ve hit the start button 12-15 times and I’m not seeing any oil when I remove the tappet covers...

dave500 · « **Reply #9 on:** May 17, 2018, 12:27:22 AM »

just start it up.

my name is nobody · « **Reply #10 on:** May 17, 2018, 03:22:30 AM »

Quote from: dave500 on May 17, 2018, 12:27:22 AM

just start it up.

+1 I got lucky with mine and oil got up top quickly, but if you've filled up the oil passages and primed the pump, it should supply oil quickly after start up. your assembly lube will do its job till oil gets where it needs to be.

DaveBarbier · « **Reply #11 on:** May 17, 2018, 04:46:21 AM »

Quote from: dave500 on May 17, 2018, 12:27:22 AM

just start it up.

+2

bambuhiphop · « **Reply #12 on:** May 17, 2018, 12:10:55 PM »

Quote from: dave500 on May 17, 2018, 12:27:22 AM

just start it up.

Thanks. I'll do that, hahaha! No, I know I just need to start it. I've just been rebuilding it for so long I'm just hyper nervous about something going wrong. I'd rather ask some dumb questions then break something because I didn't.

I need to swing by the gas station and get my 2 gallon can filled. I'll get some gas in it and attempt a start in the next few days.

bambuhiphop · « **Reply #13 on:** May 18, 2018, 10:28:27 AM »

So I tried to just start it. Didn't quite go...

Scottly was thinking it is the starter clutch slipping. Going to attempt a kick start tonight.

DaveBarbier · « **Reply #14 on:** May 18, 2018, 12:17:44 PM »

Hmm, could be, but short video so it’s hard to tell. If it happens to be the starter clutch, that can be remived with the motor in the frame.

bambuhiphop · « **Reply #15 on:** May 18, 2018, 12:46:38 PM »

This one is a little longer...

DaveBarbier · « **Reply #16 on:** May 18, 2018, 01:13:42 PM »

Could be the starter too. You can pull the starter, hold it against a chassis ground and and see if it spins without making that noise. That’s what I’d try. Also you can stick your finger or a clean screw driver in the hole it comes from and see if you can spin the gear in both directions. It should only spin in one.

bambuhiphop · « **Reply #17 on:** May 18, 2018, 01:19:39 PM »

When I had the coils disconnected and was working the starter I didn’t here that sound. I will try both things you suggested. Thanks for the troubleshooting ideas!

RAFster122s · « **Reply #18 on:** May 18, 2018, 04:25:44 PM »

hydrolocked cylinder would be overcoming your starter clutch. Stuck float open can fill a cylinder and it won't compress.
Pull plugs if you have resistance to kicking it over by hand. Doing it by hand you can better judge the force you are dealing with unless you have a calibrated leg "

"
Just a shot in the dark at the issue for what might cause a starter clutch to slip badly.
You do not want to kick over a cylinder full of gas, it will not compress very easily and something might get broken/bent

Likelihood of it being this issue, 2%

Good luck sorting it...lots of smarter people than me here providing advice on things to look at.

bambuhiphop · « **Reply #19 on:** May 18, 2018, 06:11:09 PM »

Made some noise on 2nd kick. Still obviously have an issue and the idle is way high but noise none the less!!

scottly · « **Reply #20 on:** May 18, 2018, 06:42:42 PM »

Quote from: bambuhiphop on May 18, 2018, 01:19:39 PM

When I had the coils disconnected and was working the starter I didn’t here that sound.

Your ignition timing may be a bit advanced, which would place more load on the starter clutch.

bambuhiphop · « **Reply #21 on:** May 18, 2018, 06:59:39 PM »

Quote from: scottly on May 18, 2018, 06:42:42 PM

Quote from: bambuhiphop on May 18, 2018, 01:19:39 PM
When I had the coils disconnected and was working the starter I didn’t here that sound.
Your ignition timing may be a bit advanced, which would place more load on the starter clutch.

Hhhhmmmmm... that’s makes me wonder if the rotary switch for the C5 is in the wrong position...

scottly · « **Reply #22 on:** May 18, 2018, 07:06:51 PM »

With the C5, it's more likely that the static setting is off; there is no way to verify the timing with a strobe on those ignitions. You need to reinstall the stock advancer, set the crank to TDC, then switch to the C5 and hope you get it right. Better yet, if you still have all the stock parts, run the stock ignition while you dial the new motor in, then switch to the C5.

DaveBarbier · « **Reply #23 on:** May 19, 2018, 04:25:14 AM »

When you find TDC with the points ignition installed, remove the stator cover and make a punch mark on the case and rotor to show TDC.

—-

Off the subject, is there a part number on those coils? I have a C5 and am curious about doing some testing. I want to know if we have the same coils. I have a 650, but they might use the same exact system.

I’m trying to find someone with a C5 that lives in a hot climate that I can send my coils to to use them for a bit to see if they shut off after an hour or so in the heat. I’m in CT and it’s not hot enough to do any testing yet.

RAFster122s · « **Reply #24 on:** May 19, 2018, 08:30:58 AM »

Is the C5 modified for the CDI coils of a 650? Or, is it a 550 C5 system modified to fit? The characteristics and resistance of the stock 650 coils is different than the roughly 5 ohm coil of the points system coil.
Or, did they build a C5 system specific to the 650?
Not like it isn't needed with ignitors (?) and other stuff of the CDI failing on the 650.

David, a heat gun could help "overheat" or run your coils in a high heat situation but you can't carry around a heat gun and operate it while riding...

David

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Author Topic: First start after rebuild (Read 3710 times)