Author Topic: My PAMCO ignition experience  (Read 3198 times)

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Offline jorwesflow

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My PAMCO ignition experience
« on: August 07, 2018, 02:20:55 AM »
I had just finished installing my new PAMCO ignition and coils kit from 4into1 on my ‘77 CB550K earlier in the day at my brother’s garage down in Irvine. After dialing in the timing, i took a test run around the block and holy frick—this thing was like a new beast. Better idle and barely had to choke for long, where before i’d have to choke for at least 2mins to get up to temp for it to idle without dying. Now, it just idles basically cold (well it’s 97 deg in LA right now, so i’ve got a head start on temp). I felt more consistent power all through the acceleration range. All around it simply runs better. So i decided i’d make the 40 mile trek from Irvine back home to Pasadena.

While riding 80mph northbound on I-5 in Los Angeles, i had never felt more liberated and happy with this bike, regardless of being on one of the most annoying freeways in the country. It’s like it had been constipated for the 7 years i’ve had it, and the new ignition and coils was like salt water enema.

Then, about 10 miles from home, while cruising in the left lane at a 75/80mph clip... boom... the sucker lost all power to two cylinders, and i dropped to 50mph almost instantly. I cautiously froggered my way through some lane changes—still losing speed—across 5 lanes to barely make an off ramp. Still limping along on 2 cylinders, i pulled into the nearest gas station and shut it down, thinking i either installed something completely wrong, or something was a lemon.

My first thought was one of the new coils was garbage. So i swapped some spark plug cables around, kicked it back up, and realized that the same pipes were staying cold: 1/4. if i had thought it through completely before assuming the coils first, i would have known that a 1/4 or 2/3 issue is ignition—and a 1/2 or 3/4 issue is coils. so once i realized that, i knew i had to pop the ignition cover off and check it out. i had to hobble a couple miles up the road to the Downey Walmart, because i didn’t have the right allen keys to get the cover off. so once i finally got the tool i needed, i started loosening that points cover—i thought i had maybe forgot to tighten down the three screws on the plate, and the thing was just rattling loose in there. but no—once the cover was off, this is what i saw

 

Idiot me didn’t think to secure the wire away from moving parts: the rotor. so it was just rubbing for 30 miles before it finally reached its point of no more current.

So i went back into walmart and got a wire stripper, wire nuts, and extra wire in case i needed it. then i clipped em, and stripped em



Then twisted em together like a true wiring pro. I think this was about the point where a roaming walmart parking lot prostitute solicited a good time to me. despite its glaring serendipity—since this mishap was causing me to miss a date with a nice lady that evening—i declined. i will be keeping this particular “wire” away from that particular “moving part”.
plus, i had already thrown my cash at a (wire) stripper.



And finished it off nice with some wire nuts. Also threw a couple cable ties in some strategic spots to secure the wires down.



Good as new til i can rewire it proper.

And that concludes my PAMCO / Downey Walmart adventure. Always remember, kids: keep your wire away from moving parts.
1977 CB550K

Offline Erny

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Re: My PAMCO ignition experience
« Reply #1 on: August 07, 2018, 02:35:54 AM »
Nice story! With good end

I hope I did not mistake to decide going with Hondaman transistorized ignition instead of Pamco/Dyna S
Did not installed yet, but cannot wait it!
CB750K K7 USA model (1977)
CB550K1 USA model (1975)

Offline RAFster122s

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Re: My PAMCO ignition experience
« Reply #2 on: August 07, 2018, 02:48:21 AM »
Moral of the story, keep the parts and tools needed for impromptu repairs like this in the tool pack or behind a side cover and keep tools for anything you have been wrenching on with the bike if at all feasible.  Also, stay away from Downey Walmart ladies of the evening.

Glad you got it sorted and back on your way.  Your date can be pointed to those photos to see you did not intend to miss her company that evening. I hope you at least called her in the midst of all this.
David- back in the desert SW!

Offline dave500

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Re: My PAMCO ignition experience
« Reply #3 on: August 07, 2018, 03:02:04 AM »
good road side fix!allen bolts are fine so long as you have one or two tools on board for just such an occurance.

Offline ekpent

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Re: My PAMCO ignition experience
« Reply #4 on: August 07, 2018, 04:16:16 AM »
 Always love a happy ending and a good Macgyver fix !

Offline madmtnmotors

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Re: My PAMCO ignition experience
« Reply #5 on: August 07, 2018, 04:26:38 AM »
the same pipes were staying cold: 1/4. if i had thought it through completely before assuming the coils first, i would have known that a 1/4 or 2/3 issue is ignition—and a 1/2 or 3/4 issue is coils.

 ???  ???  ???

Are the 550's that much different than the 750's? On the 750 the 1/4 ignition trigger (whether points or electronic) fires the coil to cylinders 1 and 4 while the 2/3 trigger fires the coil to cylinders 2 and 3. How does the 1/4 trigger fire the coil to cylinders 1 and 2? With one coil connected to cylinders 1 and 4 with the other coil connected to cylinders 2 and 3 then I don't know how a bad coil would take down a cylinder it's not connected to...

Just curious.  :)

There is no true "firing order" with the wasted spark system. Cylinders 1 and 4 fire at the same time and cylinders 2 and 3 fire at the same time. One of the spark events is on the exhaust stroke and is considered "wasted spark", although it may promote scavenging of unburned fuel on its way out. Without a distributor to "distribute" a sequential (single) spark event, the designers decided to just throw an extra spark at it and call it a day. It works pretty well, unless you try to apply the principles of a distributed ignition to a distributorless ignition.  ;)

Glad you got it sorted. I had a similar issue in that I lost all spark 5 miles into a 500 mile road trip after having just completed my trip check. I knew before I had coasted to a complete stop that I had not final torqued the ignition plate screws after adjusting the timing. Couple twists of the screwdriver and I was back on my way without any further drama. The hard lessons are the easiest to remember!  8)

« Last Edit: August 07, 2018, 09:25:36 AM by madmtnmotors »
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"P.O. Debacle": http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,126692.msg1441661.html#msg1441661
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http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,148188.msg1688494.html#msg1688494
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,139544.msg1579364.html#msg1579364
                                          
Charging system diagnosis: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=1012.msg8345#msg8345
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Engine Lifting Made Easy: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,58210.msg1684742.html#msg1684742
                                      http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,100352.msg1675840.html#msg1675840
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Offline PeWe

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Re: My PAMCO ignition experience
« Reply #6 on: August 07, 2018, 08:32:32 AM »
I like happy ending too!
Ask for it can end up in a strange situation. The happy ending must come to you or included  ;)
CB750 K6-76  970cc (Earlier 1005cc JMR Billet block on the shelf waiting for a comeback)
CB750 K2-75 Parts assembled to a stock K2

Updates of the CB750 K6 -1976
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180468.msg2092136.html#msg2092136
The billet block build thread
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,49438.msg1863571.html#msg1863571
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http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,168243.msg1948381.html#msg1948381
K2 engine build thread. For a complete CB750 -75
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180088.msg2088008.html#msg2088008
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Offline jorwesflow

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Re: My PAMCO ignition experience
« Reply #7 on: August 07, 2018, 10:22:58 AM »

 ???  ???  ???

Are the 550's that much different than the 750's? On the 750 the 1/4 ignition trigger (whether points or electronic) fires the coil to cylinders 1 and 4 while the 2/3 trigger fires the coil to cylinders 2 and 3. How does the 1/4 trigger fire the coil to cylinders 1 and 2? With one coil connected to cylinders 1 and 4 with the other coil connected to cylinders 2 and 3 then I don't know how a bad coil would take down a cylinder it's not connected to...

Just curious.  :)

Oh you’re right. I was writing this from my fried memory. Coils are set up the same in a 750. What i had done was swapped the 1/4 and 2/3 spark cables to see if the cold pipes “moved”. but they stayed the same. and that’s how i knew it was an ignition issue still.
1977 CB550K

Offline jorwesflow

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Re: My PAMCO ignition experience
« Reply #8 on: August 07, 2018, 02:40:33 PM »
I hope I did not mistake to decide going with Hondaman transistorized ignition instead of Pamco/Dyna S
Did not installed yet, but cannot wait it!

I hear great things about the Hondaman. I almost went that direction. But I already had a big cart going on 4into1 and they don't sell Hondamans, but do have the pamco.
1977 CB550K

Offline jorwesflow

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Re: My PAMCO ignition experience
« Reply #9 on: August 07, 2018, 02:44:56 PM »
Forgot to mention as well, that the reason I switched away from points ignition is because I had reached the end of the adjustment on the plate, and could not get the timing dialed in. After looking through a bunch of threads discussing ways to mitigate this issue, I just waved the white flag and went with electronic. Keeping my fingers crossed for no EMP anytime soon.
1977 CB550K

Offline BobbyR

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Re: My PAMCO ignition experience
« Reply #10 on: August 07, 2018, 03:20:17 PM »
I replaced a two year old failed Dyna with a PAMCO five years ago. It is great. Now I better go look at the wires.
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Offline Pan1cReaper

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Re: My PAMCO ignition experience
« Reply #11 on: August 07, 2018, 03:25:27 PM »
 8) I love my pamco

Offline redtractor

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Re: My PAMCO ignition experience
« Reply #12 on: August 08, 2018, 03:31:34 AM »
Have Pamco on both my 750 Hondas, it's brilliant.

Offline Scott S

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Re: My PAMCO ignition experience
« Reply #13 on: August 08, 2018, 03:49:45 AM »
 Pamco has never let me down.
 In fact, I limped home on an XS650 with a dead battery once. Turned off the lights, tail gated my GF and got home with a battery showing less than 6 volts! The Pamco takes very little energy to make it work. Turned out the brushes on the alternator were worn out and I wasn't charging. The Pamco got me home that night!
'71 CB500 K0
'17 Triumph Street Scrambler
'81 Yamaha XS650

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Re: My PAMCO ignition experience
« Reply #14 on: August 08, 2018, 05:22:56 AM »
Any time I do work on a bike and then take it out for a test ride, I bring the tools I hope I won't need that I used when I did the job.

Offline Holubs

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Re: My PAMCO ignition experience
« Reply #15 on: August 08, 2018, 10:35:14 AM »
I've had my Pamco installed on my F1 for 6-7 years, no issues at all. The best $100 I ever spent on my bike.
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Offline Don R

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Re: My PAMCO ignition experience
« Reply #16 on: August 08, 2018, 10:53:42 AM »
 I took one off of a bike I resold and put it on my K0. So far so good, the other bike had av gas in it and would start on almost no battery.  I never touched the carbs although it sat in a hangar for years.
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Offline pamcopete

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Re: My PAMCO ignition experience
« Reply #17 on: August 09, 2018, 02:00:16 PM »
jorwesflow,
Your warranty replacement unit is on its way.
Ride. Enjoy. Life is simple

Offline jorwesflow

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Re: My PAMCO ignition experience
« Reply #18 on: August 09, 2018, 05:02:07 PM »
jorwesflow,
Your warranty replacement unit is on its way.
Ride. Enjoy. Life is simple

Pete you're awesome
1977 CB550K