Topic: Guitarists: question about necks and frets

[GroovieGhoulie]

Is there a difference in fret size when comparing a short-scale neck to a standard neck? Are the frets smaller? Is the tone or sound different?

I'm asking because I'm thinking of getting a new guitar when I get back, but I have smallish hands and would prefer shorter frets so I'm not having to stretch my fingers around as much, but I'll just deal with it if the tone is different.

Given the same guitar, but one has a standard-scale 25.5" neck and one has a short-scale "Gibson" 24.75" neck, would they sound different?

[ElCheapo]

There are on some of them, short scale can be a 1/2 or 3/4 scale. On the 3/4 scale most are same as thier full sized rockers.

Now there is a claim that solid nickle frets have a better sound over all. Believe it our not some frets are hollow. These are used on the cheaper guitars. I know there are about 6 sizes. I think this link will help you out.

http://www.richbeckguitars.com/FretGuide.htm

[GroovieGhoulie]

Hmm...Great info, but I think I used the wrong term.

I am wanting "closer" frets, not "shorter" top to bottom, even though I am considering that since it seems to make the action faster.

Would a short-scale neck do this?  I pretty much only play power-chords (punk, ya know), and with my smallish hands (actually average-ish hands with short fingers), the reach gets unbearable at the end of the neck for any length of time and forget doing a Chuck Berry-style "bounce" on anything below the 7th fret.  Too far to reach my short fingers.

[prsman23@hotmail.c]

I've got the same problem, normal hands, short fingers! You can make it work on "standard" guitars, just takes patience. I try to do dexterity exercises such as this one : http://guitar.about.com/c/ht/00/07/How_Increase_Finger_Dexterity0962934246.htm

[Rocking-M]

Believe it or not GG i've built guitars. Still have my molds for a large body (like a D martin)
I'll hunt up my fret rule for you and give you some dimensions.  But, really the sound is
produced by the box primarily. Mostly, a good box being one with a spruce top. Generally the
bigger the body the more mellow the sound.

I have small hands also, and my guitar playing pretty well bit the dust when I lost the tip
of my "finger"  finger on my chord hand.  A small neck would probably help more than
the smaller fret scale.

[Raul CB750K1]

The shorter the neck, the shorter the frets -I mean the space between the metal frets, that is, the places where you put the fingers on.


Think about this: with the strings on air they have a given frequency and thus a given note. When you push the 12th fret you are playing the same note than the string at air, but one octave higher. One octave higher means double the frequency, and for doubling the frequency you need to reduce the string lenght exactly by half. That is, the twelfth fret must be exactly at half the string lenght. If the neck is shorter, the string lenght if shorter and you will have to put twelve frets in less distance, therefore they will be narrower.

If you look at a 24 fret fretboard, for the same reasoning, the 24th fret must be at half distance between the bridge and the 12th fret because it has to double the frequency of the note at 12th fret. I don't know if I have explained myself.


If only I would have played much more than I had...



Vinnie Moore rules!!!!!

[ElCheapo]

Something you must look at is scale length. Sometimes they goof this up.

Meaning it should be the same from the 12th fret to the string nut and from the 12th fret to the bridge. If not, it will never intonate correctly.

[DammitDan]

I think Raul explained it pretty well...  A string of a certain mass under a certain amount of tension will vibrate at different frequencies depending on its' length.  There are certain frequencies that we consider "musical", such as A above middle C on a piano is 440 Hz.  So, as long as the ratio is the same in distance between fret bars vs. length of neck, you will get the same frequencies with a shorter guitar neck (and therefore a shorter fret distance).

[Jv550]

GG, I'm no expert but I've played both regular and smaller scale guitars and basses and have never noticed a difference tone-wise. Usually the shorter neck just means fewer frets past the 12th. So yeah, a small scale neck should make it easier for you to play. My wife has a 1/2 scale bass that sounds pretty good and is WAY easier to play than a standard...

[Rocking-M]

By smaller neck I mean the width of the neck, not the length.
But this only works if you have small fingers since the strings will be closer together.

[hondachopproject]

By no means am I an expert, but I like and play Ibanez guitars just because I like the way the necks feel, smaller, I am not found of wide or thick necks.

[Jinxracing]

A shorter-scale neck will definitely be easier to play, and not just because the frets are a little closer together. The strings also end up having slightly less tension due to the reduced difference between nut and bridge. Pick up a Fender Strat (longer scale length), then a Les Paul or Rickenbacker which have shorter scale lengths and you'll feel a difference. This of course is assuming that they have equal weight strings and are tuned to standard. Lots of players argue that the longer scale length adds just a bit of sustain, and I'd tend to agree with them. But it's a pretty fine point.

General rule that seems to hold true for me is that the harder it is to play (heavy strings, long scale length, heavy wood body, etc.) the better it sounds. I don't make a living playing music any more though, so now the guitars get set up to be a little easier to play. 

Scale length shouldn't be that much of an issue if you're just going to be goofing around and having fun though. Just play every guitar you see and buy the one that "sings" to you. Then if your fingers hurt, get lighter strings until you can handle the heavies. 

Jinx

[eldar]

one thing to remember is that pitch is pitch if things are set up correctly. tone however will usually be different. A C is a C no matter the length of the next or anything else, as long as everythign is made correctly.

Tone however changes with any change you make.  You say punk and power chords. So you play electric and there are 2 main types of wood used on fret boards. I cant think of the names but one is dark and one is a light color. The dark one is more forgiving of mistakes as it is not as sensitive. This seems to be the choice of most rock and  metal such for rithym players lead too if the person is not the best player. The second type of neck makes a much clearer sound, more pure if you will. It is more sensitive and has greater sustain usually, however will usually show any playing error you make.

so really neck length does not matter much as long as you tune the correct pitch and the mathmatical setup for fret distance is correct.

Raul, I am surprised someone besides me know about Vinnie Moore!  He is the greatest! And now he plays with UFO.

[Raul CB750K1]

Raul, I am surprised someone besides me know about Vinnie Moore!  He is the greatest! And now he plays with UFO.

I have been a big fan of him since the late 80's - early 90's. First time I saw him live was in 2004 touring with UFO. Last November I followed the band during the spanish leg of the tour - he gave me a backstage pass. He is not only a killer guitar player and composer; he is definitely a great person too.

[eldar]

That would have been too cool! I am just wondering if he is going to have another solo album soon.

[Raul CB750K1]

You can bet it was cool...


According to his website and forum, the recording is finished. It would be out in a few months.

[eldar]

sure hope so. Would be cool if he did a song in the same spirit as vinmans brew.

[Raul CB750K1]

If you like that song check "World cruise" from the latest UFO's release "The monkey puzzle". It's even better....


Well, enough hijacking the thread. Send me a PM and I will tell you how to "buy" the song....