Author Topic: Auto-X on a bike?  (Read 1009 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline GroovieGhoulie

  • Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,753
  • I have to return some videotapes.
Auto-X on a bike?
« on: January 23, 2007, 05:10:59 AM »
I saw a thread on another board that referenced a Ferrari 550 race car going up against a stock Aprilia and whipping it, hard.  I couldn't see the video, but it was something like 11 seconds difference.  Huge.  Here's the link:


That started a discussion about car v. bike and speeds.  They said that a bike might be able to out-accelerate a car in a straight line, and brake harder, (power to weight and all that), but that a car would kill a bike in corners because the car has more of a contact patch and can hold more lateral acceleration and it has to slow down less than a bike in corners, carrying more speed.  Their verdict was that bikes are at a HUGE disadvantage in corners compared to cars.

Now I know bikes are "slow-in, fast-out", (which is familiar ground to me, cutting my teeth on 356s and 911s), but this got my brain thinking: how much of a disadvantage would a bike be on your "average" autocross course?

I'm a member of the local Porsche club and they have autocrosses at least once a month.  I was thinking of popping down there some time on my bike and see what kinda time I would turn.  Just for kicks, you know?  But I'm wondering how the old Honda will stack up against the four-wheeled competition, assuming I got my sh*t together.  I would imagine the bike's power-to-weight would be a sight better than most of the cars, but autocross courses are usually short and all about cornering, which is fine, but if cars have an easier time of it, then what kind of disadvantage would the bike be at?

For reference, they posted the fastest times at the Laguna Seca track.  The fastest cars whip the fastest bike:

2006 Lap Times


750hp F1 Toyota _ 1:06.309

650hp ALMS P1 Zytek 06S _ 1:13.731

500hp ALMS P2 Porsche RS Spyder _ 1:14.030

600hp ALMS GT1 Aston Martin DBR9 _ 1:21.012

250hp Honda MotoGP Bike _ 1:22.843

480hp ALMS GT2 Ferrari F430 GT _ 1:23.611

500hp Grand-Am DP Crawford-Porsche _ 1:23.712




Offline SteveD CB500F

  • Global Moderator
  • Old Timer
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,553
  • Ride on the Steel Breeze...
    • TVAM
Re: Auto-X on a bike?
« Reply #1 on: January 23, 2007, 08:22:01 AM »
On BBC's "Top Gear" a while back, they had a MotoGP vs F1 race for a standing 1/4

The car was faster off the line (the bike was on one wheel which was bad)
The bike took over and won.

Over a standing 1/2 the car won easily as once past 100+mph the power and aerodynamics of the bike suck...
SOHC4 Member #2393
2015 Tiger 800 XRT
1971 CB500K0 (US Model)

Offline ieism

  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 832
Re: Auto-X on a bike?
« Reply #2 on: January 23, 2007, 08:29:59 AM »
Beautiful bike that MV Augusta!!! Too bad it lost.  But like the video said, it's very hard to beat a car on a track with lots of corners. From stoplight to stoplight is another matter.
If I compare the times I drive on my Playstation (cars:GT4 and bikes: TT, same tracks and made by the same company) I'm faster on all tracks in a car. Laguna Seca is almost impossible to go fast without hitting the curbs a lot, so that will never be a fast track for a bike.
---cb550---

Offline nickjtc

  • I was numero dieci
  • Old Timer
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,210
  • Yamaha XT500 'Gromit'
Re: Auto-X on a bike?
« Reply #3 on: January 23, 2007, 08:52:35 AM »
All good info. But put it into perspective. How many people can afford the kind of money needed to buy that kind of four wheeled performance?

In terms of grins per mile/kilometre per $ motorcycling has car driving whipped!
Nick J. Member #3247

2008 Triumph Tiger 1050
1977 Suzuki GS750

"That which does not kill us reminds us to wear proper motorcycle clothing...."

Offline tramp

  • Old Timer
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,142
Re: Auto-X on a bike?
« Reply #4 on: January 23, 2007, 03:40:18 PM »
way to fast
way to cool
have to admit i'd rather drive the car on that track
better chance of not falling down
1974 750k

Rocking-M

  • Guest
Re: Auto-X on a bike?
« Reply #5 on: January 23, 2007, 04:24:47 PM »
All good info. But put it into perspective. How many people can afford the kind of money needed to buy that kind of four wheeled performance?

In terms of grins per mile/kilometre per $ motorcycling has car driving whipped!

I agree Nick, but a well set up low hp car even out performs a Superbike.

On the Tail of the Dragon a fellow Fiat-er in a DSP x 1/9 regularly runs down
and passes superbikers. (but he's a National Autocross Champ several times over)
 A DSP or any SP classed car in the SCCA is a stock engine,
but, all the suspension upgrades you can throw under the car without changing
the suspension pickup points. The 1500cc fiat engine in the X might be making 90hp
on an extremely good day. The car weights about a ton.
But, can pull close to 1.4 g's in a corner and that's the ticket. Doesn't have
to lose much speed in the corner, in fact the best way to drive a Fiat is never
touch the brake :)

So I would suspect GG that you would find yourself real slow on an autocross course.

Offline SteveD CB500F

  • Global Moderator
  • Old Timer
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,553
  • Ride on the Steel Breeze...
    • TVAM
Re: Auto-X on a bike?
« Reply #6 on: January 24, 2007, 12:46:24 AM »
the best way to drive a Fiat is never touch the brake :)

You got Italian ancestors?
SOHC4 Member #2393
2015 Tiger 800 XRT
1971 CB500K0 (US Model)

Offline sparty

  • I just play one on TV
  • Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,788
  • My engine is 100% stock... wink.
    • Gallery
Re: Auto-X on a bike?
« Reply #7 on: January 24, 2007, 04:46:18 AM »
Funny... I find that my bike easily out runs the police cars...  ;D


Sparty
1972 CB750 K2 Cafe' Style




GO AWAY SNOW AND COLD!  Can you see the Hot Rod wants to run...
“That's thirty minutes away. I'll be there in ten.”

Rocking-M

  • Guest
Re: Auto-X on a bike?
« Reply #8 on: January 24, 2007, 02:21:50 PM »
the best way to drive a Fiat is never touch the brake :)

You got Italian ancestors?

Might be one in the wood pile somewhere :) Just bought a Fiat when I was young and have liked them since,
the wife's aunt even had one when we got married, a Fiat 124 sedan, one of the ugliest cars going but still fun :)
That was our favorite Aunt too! The only one that ever asked for and got a ride on the 71 750 :)

Hey Sparty, cops can't drive so that isn't a fair comparison :)