Author Topic: CB550 or CB500 Aluminum Side Cover Castings (build?) (Read 13461 times)

wolf550 · « **Reply #75 on:** June 06, 2020, 08:01:18 PM »

It has been raining the past couple of days so no casting for me.
Since I don't own a super duper Polishing kit or the money to buy one I went down to the local store and bought some different grit sandpaper to see what I could accomplish.
I'm sure a polishing center could do miles better with what they have but for now it matches pretty good with my tank.

Shtonecb500 · « **Reply #76 on:** June 10, 2020, 01:33:58 AM »

dude, good #$%*ing job.
how much for a set?

wolf550 · « **Reply #77 on:** June 10, 2020, 01:56:47 PM »

LOL! These are all the Progress Fails so far.
I haven't yet made an actual complete set.

the last side covers on the bottom are missing the back and bottom side lip.
Im currently at the stage where the more pieces of the side covers I add, the less complete they turn out.

Still doing alot of trial and error to find out where the honey spot is to just sit down, melt some aluminum and pour an actual set without something going wrong.

RAFster122s · « **Reply #78 on:** June 10, 2020, 04:26:49 PM »

Do you need to increase the number of pour sprues to ensure a complete side cover?

wolf550 · « **Reply #79 on:** June 11, 2020, 09:34:47 AM »

I don't think so. I have tried it both ways so far and the better option that has been going well is one runner and one riser.
I tried it with one in each corner and then two on each side, then all the way around but it was always missing a chunk somewhere.
so I was told to go back to one and one. also on the sand mold itself I wasnt able to get a solid top and bottom mold due to that outer lip always causing the mold to crumble when I split the top and bottom molds so I used the last castings to remake a good mold and then make the area that was curved (the area that would break the mold) and make it flat.
I need to see if when I grind down the excess aluminum if it is flat and if it makes a mold that wont crumble that lip area.

wolf550 · « **Reply #80 on:** June 11, 2020, 08:15:27 PM »

since pictures are best here is the next step.
After making the sand mold with the last incomplete side cover I split the cases and eyeing the line where I cut the lip off, I gently cut away a new lip that went outward and as straight as possible.
It may look like it is the same lip but this one looks like when I remake the mold to make a new one it will stay true and not crumble.
also on this new one when pouring the added gate on top separated from the mold and the aluminum that was supposed to fill the last of the top corner escaped through the opening leaving that dimple.
Slowly but surely they are coming together little by little and just enough to not make me go mad!

We will see

Godffery · « **Reply #81 on:** June 14, 2020, 09:50:44 PM »

It's really nifty seeing this project progress threw the stages of development. Thanks for keeping up updated!

wolf550 · « **Reply #82 on:** June 15, 2020, 12:18:35 PM »

Thanks so much Godffery. Those tabs look the beez neez on them side covers.
it seems to be two steps forward on step back most of the time. and now with having two jobs to eat up my time its trying to carve some time to be able to make the mistakes to keep chugging along.
this last one was a doozie!
with the 3 tier sand mold I went into making the other side yesterday. while pouring the aluminum I had a blow out in the corner that Ive been trying to add the flat lip to. before I could cool the aluminum to keep it from escaping the whole side was charred.
Lesson learned.
Next step is remaking a bigger box that will allow more area to be filled with sand and to not allow the aluminum to push out the seam.
This one already uses 50lbs of green sand. Ill have to see how much more will be needed after adding an inch all the way around.

Godffery · « **Reply #83 on:** June 15, 2020, 06:12:08 PM »

I suspect you are well on your way to becoming the Zen Master of Alloy Casting!

wolf550 · « **Reply #84 on:** June 15, 2020, 09:38:38 PM »

as is, after a long time I should get pretty good. and then if the bug hits me to buy the proper equipment to do a proper casting setup, my pretty good would probably be on its way to zen master.
But when these failures keep happening like in the pics I remind myself of the Edison quote " Our greatest weakness lies in giving up. The most certain way to succeed is to try one more time".
The first pic is the one from the blowout on the lip.
The second is where aluminum just didn't get there.
you can see where Im going with the third pic.
I have a complete cover in there so I don't have to try and reuse the old mold now just cut and paste HA! if it was that easy!

wolf550 · « **Reply #85 on:** June 17, 2020, 07:10:49 PM »

I guess it was that simple...Not!
I cut the two side covers and started to grind down until they fit and measured right and then hit with the hvac tape
I didn't have the new box molds set up yet so I threw it in the charred messed and filled with extra sand along the outside.
once everything was setup I sat down with some genkai sake and waited to pour.
Not bad for two failed covers taped up!
As you can see I have a nice couple of templates to work off for the final drive home to this project.
After that I'm going to source a local shop to address the polishing and installing the tab inserts because I did not do so well on the other set drilling them in straight and you only get one change to do this wrong.
Moving on

wolf550 · « **Reply #86 on:** June 20, 2020, 07:11:30 PM »

finished up rebuilding the left side cover where the aluminum didn't fill it in all the way.
re-poured the mold and came out good. Now I have the full lip cast to where it doesn't break the mold.
unfortunately I forgot to add that little piece on the top. It looks like something is supposed to snake through there.

might be a little surprise on the next covers to see if something will actually work.
Keep checking in.

wolf550 · « **Reply #87 on:** June 24, 2020, 08:10:52 PM »

So I figured after finish casting a complete set of aluminum covers, I would see exactly where I was to where this whole project was leading towards.
In the end I do not have what it takes to complete the finned covers I was looking to make.
I do not have a big enough everything.
I would have to build a bigger forge, use a bigger crucible, bigger sand mold along with getting help lifting in place for the setup.

when I made this cover I discovered on the mold that the fins had to be straight up, meaning I would have to redo the tab turrets due to them being at more of an angle. when I separated the mold when lifting it up the inner turrets pulled up with it.
with the fins themselves, I used 3/16 frog tape adding layer after layer after layer building up the fins to a good height.
I would have to start with about 1/3 of the height, cast and keep adding more layers. how it is now the fins do not mold all the way.

until I find more better resources and abilities to try this one again I am happy to just stick with the smooth side covers...for now.

Ill get a list together of what is spent and where I bought all the materials for those who want to give this a go and just like the rebuild of these beautiful machines it definitely hits the wallet, at least for me it did.

well that's about it the only thing left is to get the side covers drilled and polished and that should be it for me.

RAFster122s · « **Reply #88 on:** June 24, 2020, 08:56:54 PM »

Congratulations on your journey of discovery and learning. Nice job on the covers!

Hasenkopf · « **Reply #89 on:** June 24, 2020, 09:23:29 PM »

It's nice to see that someone else fell down the rabbit hole of casting their own parts. A thin cross section like this is almost impossible to cast as the metal cools faster the thinner it gets. A passage all around the pattern with plenty of gating and pouring from both sides at once should work pretty good. ( That means you need a helper)..... For the fins or added detail, carve them in wood, then glue on with epoxy and use that epoxy to form a smooth fillet at the joint, and also at the edge of the pattern, Aluminum like this will shrink quite a bit around the outside, and sink in the middle, and that means you need to add a riser right at the shrink area to feed it.

But you probably know this all ready. The work going in, well its a lot, and you really need to just concentrate on doing what you love. Using the original works pretty good, just have to build it up a bit and experiment with it! I have a pair of finned breather covers for the 550, and you always get a kick in the pants at the way some guys drool when you say you cast your own parts!

wolf550 · « **Reply #90 on:** June 25, 2020, 12:39:42 PM »

thanks RAF122S!
Thanks Hasenkopf!
Wood Epoxy! That is something didn't think of!
The shrinkage was something I thought of but didn't keep it in mind on these when I was doing a mock up on the the bike.
Im going to have to take out the rubber grommets and lose the tabs Godffery made me until I can relocate the top rear corner tab.
Another thought was just move the metal tabs to where they need to be but I don't weld and that seems another project would have to get started after that cause after i learn to weld I would have to make my own insane exhaust or frame!

Knowing these are out there makes me know I will get to them eventually with more work and fails.
luckily a fail only shows a way that didn't work, It is to inform you, to educate you, its to see if you have what it takes to keep pressing on.

RAFster122s · « **Reply #91 on:** June 25, 2020, 04:46:50 PM »

Wolf550, don't need to weld as aluminium cannot be welded but brazed, easy to learn. Much lower cost of entry to braze as well...

wolf550 · « **Reply #92 on:** June 25, 2020, 06:30:55 PM »

Quote from: RAF122S on June 25, 2020, 04:46:50 PM

Wolf550, don't need to weld as aluminium cannot be welded but brazed, easy to learn. Much lower cost of entry to braze as well...

that is good to know. i have seen some advertisements from people teaching how to do stuff for motorcycles near me but haven't committed to it.

wolf550 · « **Reply #93 on:** June 25, 2020, 06:34:35 PM »

Quote from: Hasenkopf on June 24, 2020, 09:23:29 PM

It's nice to see that someone else fell down the rabbit hole of casting their own parts. A thin cross section like this is almost impossible to cast as the metal cools faster the thinner it gets. A passage all around the pattern with plenty of gating and pouring from both sides at once should work pretty good. ( That means you need a helper)..... For the fins or added detail, carve them in wood, then glue on with epoxy and use that epoxy to form a smooth fillet at the joint, and also at the edge of the pattern, Aluminum like this will shrink quite a bit around the outside, and sink in the middle, and that means you need to add a riser right at the shrink area to feed it.

But you probably know this all ready. The work going in, well its a lot, and you really need to just concentrate on doing what you love. Using the original works pretty good, just have to build it up a bit and experiment with it! I have a pair of finned breather covers for the 550, and you always get a kick in the pants at the way some guys drool when you say you cast your own parts!

If you have a pic of those side covers somewhere Please throw it up on here for some much needed inspiration!

On another note I have to remember to start using my bench when working with my aluminum stuff cause I seem to drop things alot!

Hasenkopf · « **Reply #94 on:** July 01, 2020, 12:51:14 PM »

I can make this. A bit crude, but they seem to work ok.

wolf550 · « **Reply #95 on:** July 01, 2020, 02:34:02 PM »

Awesome work!
The only one I know of!

wolf550 · « **Reply #96 on:** July 05, 2020, 04:39:23 PM »

Has not been much down time here as I finally went back to work at my old job while still working at my essential job. I didn't look for a polishing place or machinist to finish the side covers but went ahead and did it myself. I put them on to see how they looked and they looked like aluminum side covers.

The Breakdown:
6 Gallon Bucket with lid $15
Propane Tank $45
Propane Burner $30
propane regulator 30psi $30
Brass connectors and fittings $10
Plaster of Paris $8
Kaowool 1x12x72 $35
6kg crucible $40
Green sand 25lb x 3 $135
Steel flat bar stock $10
Tongs $20
Gloves $5
Wood 1x4x8 times 3 $25
Propane 10x$19 refill $190
Total $598

I have spent about double on the propane using for the other various castings but at least 10 of those has been on the failures for the side covers. I did not add in the aluminum since I melted most of it from cans and various broken honda parts.

With the rubber grommets off I did a sandwich of rubbers to give it some protection. With the airbox and electrical panel on, there is still plenty of room to get back there and screw the nuts on. with the covers on the bike I rolled it oustide for some pics and then rolled back in.

If I ever time travel to the past i have to let my past self know to always use the original when casting to reduce the shrinkage. after every successful casting i used the copy to make the copy so every time it became smaller and smaller. how much? not sure but enough to cause trouble. On the 500 frame they fit pretty good but when I tried on the 550 frame, they would not get on but only by a mm im guessing. I think it was because the frame was powder coated so I sanded off the paint and they fit. if i knew how to weld i could relocate the grommet openings and use those prongs that were made. maybe in the future.

don't think I left anything out. any questions let me know.

RAFster122s · « **Reply #97 on:** July 06, 2020, 02:06:52 PM »

Very nice!

wolf550 · « **Reply #98 on:** July 06, 2020, 05:52:40 PM »

Thanks Raf!
Since I can't use these to make another set, I'm going to keep the lighter set that's missing the lips and throw these on Ebay and see if I can get some money back into the next project.
The 350F side covers seem smaller and maybe easier to make.
or maybe even a set of these

wolf550 · « **Reply #99 on:** March 15, 2022, 05:38:17 PM »

Well it has been awhile but as most things, these side covers have gotten better with age.
with more trial and error these have come out pretty good.

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Author Topic: CB550 or CB500 Aluminum Side Cover Castings (build?) (Read 13461 times)