Author Topic: Newbie turn signal issue(s).  (Read 618 times)

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Offline LadyTano

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Newbie turn signal issue(s).
« on: May 19, 2020, 10:52:42 am »
Hiya!

Ok, so I'm new here. This is my first bike, though I've been riding since I was 7 or 8. I'm mechanically inclined, and decent with electronics. But, I'm a bit stumped.



 Been lurking a bit but thought maybe I should post about my issue since I can't seem to find an answer.

I purchased this bike, used, about a month ago. It was at 23,666 miles. Ran decent, and clearly someone at some point knew what they were doing (the engine was tuned for pods, and done seemingly well).
But, someone didn't take care of it. Read, tail end was poorly chopped off, seat... (I hesitate to say) spring was welded to frame, oil was darn near empty, and oil filter was literally falling apart.


All that said. Someone tried to convert the turn signals to LED. Now, the front runner/signals never worked for me (they had the tiniest of flicker of life to half the LEDs, it's a cluster. It would blink... A little, but again. Barely seeable unless pitch dark garage.
The rears are dim... Kinda. They also didn't blink. I read up and changed out the signal relay to a LED capable one (the relay located on left side of bike, behind battery). Now the rears blink-super bright when blink, dimmer than I'd think for running (the left side decided a couple days ago to stop being a runner, but that's not the issue-i think I have that solved).

I want the front to
 1) be a runner
2) blink when I need.


So things I know with this... "Conversion"

Two New  wires are running from the front housing to rear signals. These seem to be in place of the orange and light green.

The indicator lamp still has bulbs (I saw they provide a ton of resistance), but the wires to have those work, are cut. I don't recall the color.

There seems to be a second flasher relay in the housing. Only 2 prong.


Anyway, yesterday I fixed up the rats nest of wiring the rear of the bike had (one owner spliced in like 3" segments, for unknown reason, and did a piss poor job-i removed the spliced segments resoldered, and cleaned it all up with quick disconnects).


I'm wondering if I need to add a second LED relay? Nothing blinks if I remove the front one.

Anyway, I'm a little stumped. The wiring diagram I have, I don't see a second relay. Makes me wonder if they guy/girl added extra for God knows what reason.


Feel free to chime in, toss out ideas, or call me an idiot if it's a simple sounding fix. It's a learning process for me.

Thanks all!


-Cassie

P.S. a week ago my cousin talked me through the front housing some, so I have most of the wires there labeled for easy fixing... Cause i knew this was gonna come up eventually.




Offline xntrik

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Re: Newbie turn signal issue(s).
« Reply #1 on: May 19, 2020, 11:45:38 am »
What year is the bike?


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Offline LadyTano

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Re: Newbie turn signal issue(s).
« Reply #2 on: May 19, 2020, 12:29:53 pm »
Oh! Oops, apologies.

It's a '77

Offline xntrik

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Re: Newbie turn signal issue(s).
« Reply #3 on: May 19, 2020, 01:47:56 pm »
I’ll look over some wiring diagrams to see the system tonight. But led conversions can be tricky on these bikes due to the way their wired. I’ve done several 750k’s, CB and CL 350’s, 400a and a handful of rebels. It CAN be done. Just tricky in some aspects.

You do NOT need a second flasher module. What you’re seeing in the bucket is most likely the turn signal buzzer.




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Offline xntrik

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Re: Newbie turn signal issue(s).
« Reply #4 on: May 19, 2020, 01:49:00 pm »
If you happen to have a jpg or pdf of your diagram, could u post it?


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Offline xntrik

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Re: Newbie turn signal issue(s).
« Reply #5 on: May 19, 2020, 01:50:58 pm »
Since you’ve tinkered with the wiring a bit already.... does THIS look correct?


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Offline xntrik

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Re: Newbie turn signal issue(s).
« Reply #6 on: May 19, 2020, 01:51:50 pm »
Stock rears signal only, fronts park/signal?


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Offline xntrik

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Re: Newbie turn signal issue(s).
« Reply #7 on: May 19, 2020, 01:54:27 pm »
Are you using regular led conversion bulbs? Like just replacing the oe bulbs or are you wiring in new assemblies?


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Offline raymond10078

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Re: Newbie turn signal issue(s).
« Reply #8 on: May 19, 2020, 05:12:11 pm »
If you happen to have a jpg or pdf of your diagram, could u post it?
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On this site:  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,99952.0.html
1978 CB750A (upgrading very, very slowly)

Past bikes - Honda: SL350, CX650C, CB900C, CB1000C, CM450A; Kawasaki: several 1972 750 H2's; Suzuki: TC90J.

Bikes I want: CX650ED, a mid-sized japanese V-twin with ABS.

Offline LadyTano

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Re: Newbie turn signal issue(s).
« Reply #9 on: May 20, 2020, 06:49:51 am »
UPDATE!!!!


So, I got it running.


I'm using different LED signals entirely. Aftermarket, turns out none had severe solder issues. I swapped it out, and all good.
Even got the indicator for high beam fixed, new headlight bulb, and indicators all good. Pain in the butt, but omg it was bright as all get and worth every knuckle bash (my poor hands, between this and playing mandolin, and being a violin technician they never get a break).

The "second relay" was indeed the buzzer. I saw your comment and bypassed and yay! All good!

(Pic from last night, 3am when I finished everything. I had to run new ground to back, etc).

Now the new issue.
1) I HATE crimp quick disconnects. They were being a jerk all night.
2) today on way to work, while accelerating on the on ramp, turn signal (left) on, entire left side died. No signal, no running lights, etc.


So I'm thinking it's likely in order of most likely:

*Indicator bulb burned out
*Loose connection
*Fuse?
* Revving engine pushed too much power to the side and something cooked.


So, tonight will be trouble shooting that. But, still a huge step that it worked. Huge improvement for safety. Till I hit freeway >.>


-Cassie

P.S. the underglow kit was not on during the ride. I'm ify on it (legality) but my cousin insisted. Saying "better a ticket than someone doesn't see you at night," which is hard to argue....

P.P.S. also thank you all! I logic-ed the wiring between diagram, and just toying a bit.


P.P.P.S. sorry, so my horn is shot. If you'd recommend one I'd appreciate it!

Offline xntrik

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Re: Newbie turn signal issue(s).
« Reply #10 on: May 20, 2020, 09:55:39 am »
Loookin good! What state are you in? SOME states (MO for me) as long as the bulb(s) of the under glow kit are not visible, you’re fine. But I’m pretty sure in ANY state you cannot have ANY color other than white or yellow/amber shining forward. Soooo the lights on the front cradle would be an issue.


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Offline xntrik

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Re: Newbie turn signal issue(s).
« Reply #11 on: May 20, 2020, 10:01:49 am »
Yes, crimps SUCK... and I wouldn’t be using off the shelf connects. Amazon has heat shrink crimp connects that will seal out the elements. If u keep that bike for anytime, you’ll have to re-do all those connections that have connects that aren’t sealed. ALSO, there is such a thing as a heat shrink tube that has a solder inside with a low melting point that solders a butt joint together while it shrinks to seal.

I just use a small pencil torch... lightly.

As for randomly flickering lights, be sure to check all your grounds too! And, your signal switch could be a little dirty inside. LED’s draw VERY LITTLE amperage, so even just a weak contact in the switch, or a light ground will cause issues.


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Offline xntrik

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Re: Newbie turn signal issue(s).
« Reply #12 on: May 20, 2020, 10:04:46 am »
If you’ve utilized stock wiring (for the most part) the indicator bulb shouldn’t affect weather the actual signal works.


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Offline xntrik

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Re: Newbie turn signal issue(s).
« Reply #13 on: May 20, 2020, 10:13:31 am »
Flickering/going out after revving sounds more like a loose connection, those leds SHOULD work fine from 9v ( maybe even less) up to 16v or more.

One of the FIRST things I’ll do to any old bike I get is go through, one by one, and meticulously clean every connector with a wire brush/pick or whatever make sure they’re tight, and finish up with a little smear of dielectric grease to keep em good.

Believe your bike will also still have an “adjustable” voltage regulator... could double check ur voltages.

HIGHLY recommend Oregon Motorcycle Parts for replacement RR units for old bikes. This guys stuff is QUALITY! He stands behind his units, and has always been a great help for troubleshooting and diagnosing. Can’t speak highly enough of him.
 
www.oregonmotorcycleparts.com


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Offline LadyTano

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Re: Newbie turn signal issue(s).
« Reply #14 on: May 20, 2020, 10:59:51 am »
Xntrik- yeah the underglow kit isnt legal here unless not moving. I gotta figure out what I wanna do. Like. Ticket is more important than idiot Michigan driver that "didn't see me" (happened a week or so again in broad daylight.. at a red light. I prefer the green to other colors- officer can't say it's red, or blue, etc. But I can change it so *shrug*

Loose connection is my thinking too. I'm gonna check fuses right quick on lunch. But I'm guessing it's a crimp being a jerk.


I'm half tempted to simply solder and heat shrink with water right stuff .... But I like the ability to disassemble if needed.

I appreciate all the input y'all. My thought with the bulb going, I went through the bulbs and checked them all. But moved them. While I thought I cleaned them really well, might have had hand oil still


But I'm guessing it's a loose connection. I'm very much thinking about just hard wiring all the front stuff that's I crimped. Annoying later ... But I'd like to save the total rewire for winter, as well as changing the throttle cables, choke, etc. . This is my (45m-hour) commute vehicle. Or hoping it will be.

But man, she's so amazingly fun to ride.


I was thinking about doing the hondaman wiring harness, fuse box, etc when it's down for winter.


-Cassie

Offline xntrik

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Re: Newbie turn signal issue(s).
« Reply #15 on: May 20, 2020, 12:44:10 pm »
I’ve also used crimp bullet connectors with dielectric grease, soldered if need be, then covered with marine heat shrink that has a glue in it for weather right connections that can be unhooked when need be.  They do make weatherproof heat shrink butt connectors, but it was just easier to do the latter


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Offline LadyTano

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Re: Newbie turn signal issue(s).
« Reply #16 on: May 21, 2020, 01:14:33 am »
Sadly I couldn't find the marine grade at my local hardware stores. I tdidngo through and solder everything. Much cleaner in the front now.

But it didn't fix it.

On a whim I checked the indicator bulb. Cause it didn't really make sense, vibration and poor crimps made wayyyy more sense.


It was a burned bulb. I'm guessing it still had a little hand oil and cooked itself. Or maybe it was just 43 years old and have up *shrug*


In any case. Reassembly was done right. A quick release latch added to gas cover (the lock was long gone).




Anyway, next item to hit. Any horn you'd particularly recommend? Trying to not break the bank, but the horn that came with it is toast.


Thank you for everything!

-Cassie

Offline xntrik

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Re: Newbie turn signal issue(s).
« Reply #17 on: May 21, 2020, 10:27:49 pm »
Can’t say I’ve ever bought a bike horn, I’m sure amazon has them. That’s where I’ve also gotten my electrical connects lately, and heat shrink. I’ve always had good luck just squirting a penetrating oil down inside the horn, smacking the $hit out of it, blowing compressed air inside to push the oil down further, and alternated between all the aforementioned methods, as well as turned the adjustment screw on it a little here and there.... guess I’ve been lucky and they’ve always just come back to life.


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Offline Maraakate

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Re: Newbie turn signal issue(s).
« Reply #18 on: August 03, 2020, 06:47:57 pm »
Are you sure the horn is bad?  I've found that, with the horn still on the frame, spray some PB blaster on the diaphragm, let it sit for a minute then hold the horn button in.  While this is happening use a mallet and smack the horn.  I've resurrected a fair number of horns on bikes and cars this way.  On the bike horns the note is somewhat adjustable with a screw.  Again, try some PB blaster on that screw and then turn it slightly one direction then the other while holding the button in and it may break loose some corrosion and let the horn live again.
1977 CB550K
1979 CM400A