Author Topic: can I do it? ( buy a 750 and not regret it)  (Read 1882 times)

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zoomer

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can I do it? ( buy a 750 and not regret it)
« on: February 13, 2007, 03:29:12 AM »
m looking at buying a fairly tidy cb750 supersport that the owner says he's been told the primary chain needs replacing. Now I have read up on the issue and am aware that a lot of the rattle can be down to bad carb sync but what if he's been told correctly?
I have a wee bit of mechanical nouse but no experience with multicylinder ohc wrenching. 2T scooters OK, big bike I have always left unknown stuff to "professionals". However I am tired of so called pro's wrecking stuff and would like to 'get with the programme' so to speak.
Back to the cb750. Without investing in a manual for a bike I don't own can someone please tell me what is the extent of the work required to check the primary chain tensioner/ slack. It's a 4 into 1 exhaust. Do you need lose a lot of oil to get into the oil pan and can it be done with the exhaust on?

Ditto cam chain tensioner. Assuming it's adjusted correctly what is the drill for checking the limit of the tensioner? I assume that most owners would have got their head around adjusting that one as I could just about do it in my sleep having read the how to in here.

If the chains and/or tensioners are toast are these teardown jobs or can they be done without taking head off/ pulling engine out of frame? I've got tools and enough nouse to follow instructions but what specialist tools are required? I read the one about the sparkplug screwed in some shaft in lieu of Soichiro's overpriced puller but I'm short on the rest of the deal. I could probably find it with more searching but I keep getting sidetracked.

Bike has about 50k miles on it. If it doesn't smoke then can I assume it will run for awhile longer without needing a teardown?

« Last Edit: February 13, 2007, 03:55:46 AM by zoomer »

Brunow

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Re: can I do it? ( buy a 750 and not regret it)
« Reply #1 on: February 13, 2007, 04:05:58 AM »
Hum to fix the primary chain (strange there is a problem there) you will gonne have to take the engine out of the frame.

You can let the oil out, place the engine upside down, take the oil pan & lower carter half off ... and maybe fix it... but you better do a total rebuild and check up. 

my 2 cents

Offline GoatBaSS

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Re: can I do it? ( buy a 750 and not regret it)
« Reply #2 on: February 13, 2007, 05:54:53 AM »
Out of my league but not out of the realm of possibilities?! ???
Sounds weird. But then again so do these engines at idle. And everybody has an opinion, thats why a great deal of these bikes have been pulled from the shadows after years of "hibernation"! If your mechanical ability is there, ask around, someone has some knowledge of these beasts. If it is truly a problem, it should lower asking price as you do have a rebuild concern.
At 55k I would see if there are any indications of someone already having been in the engine for one reason or another.
Also I would see if there was another running bike/engine about. Could be good for refrence and parts.
I am in the middle of a teardown now and I will let you know if there is anything I come across that would be of help, if this was at all.
Leethal # 3046?
1972 CB750K/900CC Red Headed Dunstall, 1975CB750FSS Gone BNF: 1974CB500T, 1976CB750K X 2

Offline jrrobertsjr

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Re: can I do it? ( buy a 750 and not regret it)
« Reply #3 on: February 13, 2007, 06:17:14 AM »
Yes. You will regret it.

It will keep you awake at night and burn through your cash like an unthankful prom date.

It will bust your knuckles, crush your fingers, burn you and then spit oil in your eye.

It will cause you to question your own drive, skills, ability and patience.

Your friends will stop calling and your wife will think you are on the brink of insanity.

You will have to explain to your boss that you smell like gas cause you were working on your bike before you came into the office.  And no, you don't think unleaded is aftershave.

Even your dog won't come in the garage because of the backfiring.

You will drink cheap beer to save money for parts and you will drink a lot of it.

You will be able to think of nothing else.

And then one day it will run.

And I don't mean just barely-maybe make it around the block run. It will howl and the hair will stand up on the back of your neck as you chin sits between the bars and the needle that counts goes past 100 with throttle to spare.

Yes, you will regret it. But you'll regret it a lot more if you don't go for it.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2007, 05:55:50 PM by jrrobertsjr »

eldar

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Re: can I do it? ( buy a 750 and not regret it)
« Reply #4 on: February 13, 2007, 06:20:11 AM »
I like jr's words there!

drain the oil and drop the pan, you can check on the chain that way.
But more times than not, it is either cam chain noise, solved by using the tensioner OR by clutch rattle which can cause the primary to rattle as well.

slarty-bart-farst

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Re: can I do it? ( buy a 750 and not regret it)
« Reply #5 on: February 13, 2007, 09:14:18 AM »
If you can get to hear it on low revs pull the clutch in, does the sound get better? If so that bit was the clutch, they all do that, run it and balance the carbs to get rid of 50% of the noise, the chains will still rattle. As previous post drop the sump tray off and measure the primary chain deviation as per Honda spec.

If your luckly the chains will be in spec and the culprit is the lower chain tensioner, I think you can replace this from the sump, I'll check tonight as Im splitting a motor in my workshop now. But for the cost its often better to do this anyway cause once they are in the oil/heat they harden off and become less effective.

If chains are out of spec a little way don't panic, source genuine honda chains and get ready to pull the motor, they certainly built them heavy but they are not complicated it just takes a lot of time.

Best thing to do is if you have a camera keep taking shots in the tear down. Lay out any fixing pins in a patern like the holes they go in and take a shot ( this saves sticking too short/too long pins in the wrong place ) or press the casing onto card mark run with a pen and push the pins through positions in the card to give you a template.

Make sure every thing is a clean as possible before you pull the motor and after, dont open it up until the outside is clean because you are going to have to take the shells off the crank dirt will kill them.

You will need a full gasket set, dont use anything else but grease on them unless Honda state other wise  Ive seen 2 many snapped/knackered cams caused by red hermitite used on the cylinder gaskets hardening and finding its way into the oil restrictor jets that feed the cams.

If your used to working on Jap engines you can get away with hand torqing most pins except the shell bearing caps. You need an accurate low level torque gauge for the main bearing clamps when you come to rebuild.

And you may choose the spray the cases silver, use Holts or Simonise spray tin called "Steel Wheels" from car shops check out my other post on how to.  I will be photgraphing the tear down I am doing now so I can post.

When you have done all this it will still sound rough on tickover compared to a modern 4 but like the sying goes "they all do that sir" but remember if the chains are out of spec it needs doing some time, if they are in spec put that sump back on and leave well alone I don't belive in disturbing shell bearings unless you really have to.


Cheers

Graham

« Last Edit: February 13, 2007, 09:17:42 AM by slarty-bart-farst »

Offline starion88esir

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Re: can I do it? ( buy a 750 and not regret it)
« Reply #6 on: February 13, 2007, 09:23:49 AM »
I will be photgraphing the tear down I am doing now so I can post.

Does this mean you're going to do a how-to teardown tech?
71 CB175 - next project
76 CB750F - current project

Offline paxtonpony

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Re: can I do it? ( buy a 750 and not regret it)
« Reply #7 on: February 13, 2007, 11:55:10 AM »
jrrobertsjr - that made my day.  I still haven't found a line that doesn't apply to me and my bike.  Perhaps there's a twelve step program for this sickness.  It certainly isn't here.  Nothing but a bunch of enablers heckling us on to more insanity. 
1969 CB750K - Wrecked
1978 CB750K - Sold
1992 GS500 Streetfighter - Sold
1975 CB750F - Sold (sniff, sniff)
1994 VFR750F - Sold
1990 GSXR 750 - Sold
1999 CBR1100XX - Sold
2000 Triumph Legend TT - Bike of the week for me?
1992 Mustang - Paxton powered (12.02@115mph on street tires) and For Sal

zoomer

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Re: can I do it? ( buy a 750 and not regret it)
« Reply #8 on: February 13, 2007, 03:02:30 PM »
Ha Jr, you got me worried now. But I want what you got in your avatar! No wife or kids or dog to complain so I guess I haven't got any excuse except the expense. Thanks for clearing up the primary replacement Mr SlrtyB'fast. Some good pointers in there for us young'ns. I'm looking forward to the tensioner report.

How about the cam chain, does it come apart ( intentionally! ) so you can wind a new one on? In the expoded parts gif it looks like it's threaded through the tensioner but can't be too sure, what goes there?

Maybe I'm better off with a known dud that definitely needs the full monty so I can get the price down, but I suspect that would be an even bigger money pit. Mr Honda sure knows what us fools are prepared to pay to keep 'em going.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2007, 03:06:44 PM by zoomer »

Offline jrrobertsjr

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Re: can I do it? ( buy a 750 and not regret it)
« Reply #9 on: February 13, 2007, 05:55:06 PM »
Well, you will never be able to say that I told you any B.S. and said it would be easy.

And I forgot to add the part about having to explain to your boss that you smell like gas cause you were working on your bike before you came into the office.  And no, you don't think unleaded is aftershave.

Mine was incomplete seized completely. It had been outside for 16 years. I paid way too much for it.

And the year rebuilding it was the most fun I have ever had and without a doubt the most rewarding.

The day Kghost and I got it running and we went out and did 90 miles was one of the greatest days ever.

The cam chain is endless and will be a nice project to get a new one in. I haven't done it but the manuals (Clymer and Haynes) show you how. And I am humbled by all the help I got from the forum here. If I can do it, you can too.

Whatever you get will be repairable.

I will never say it was easy but I will always say it was so worth it.

Like a friend of mine always says... Life is short. Haul Ass.