Author Topic: Does anyone else see that the Corona Virus situation has been manipulated now?  (Read 2922 times)

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Online jlh3rd

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to answer the original question, ....yep it's being manipulated, marginalized and politicized.....as even evidenced in this thread.
     If you hate trump, then any twisting of facts is allowed, and monday morning quarterbacking is the pompous, arrogant act of the left, as evidenced on here.......BTW, I am NOT the one who made this thread political, someone else mentioned trump initially so I'm responding in step.....so do not jump on me..
     You wanna blame someone, blame china, who kept quiet about what they had, lied about what they had, and eliminated the ones who began to point it out. And the W.H.O.? ..how do you believe them, they've changed their stories and they're in china's hip pocket....
      The REAL sad thing to all of this is that the American public has to wade through all of this to try and get some semblance of the truth.....
       And all these " horror" stories?....it reminds me of the majority of people , when I told them I road motorcycles, had to inform me of this motorcycle accident and  that motorcycle accident and they knew this person or that person who died horribly.....ok.....got it...
        do what you gotta do..........stay inside, if ya want...
       gotta go now....have to get a weld repaired on my pontoon boat.........have a nice day, stay safe....
     

Offline Kevin D

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Hi All..

Just sending the following article on building/maintaining resistance to Covid here..

https://www3.nhk.or.jp/nhkworld/en/ondemand/video/2050094/

Probably good overall advice..

Cheers..Ichi

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Offline carnivorous chicken

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On Wednesday, the US reported 36,880 new cases. This is the highest daily count since the start of the pandemic, and a full two months (!) after the previous highest count. While politicians in Scottsdale, AZ, were holding a rally against wearing masks, Arizona hospitals are overwhelmed with cases and testing centers cannot process the tests because they are swamped. One of the reasons people were supposed to take strong precautions (and milder ones, such as wearing a mask) is to "flatten the curve" or lower the rate of transmission so that the healthcare system would not be overwhelmed.

Offline Medyo Bastos

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Question, how many more tests are currently being given compared to 2 months ago?


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Offline carnivorous chicken

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Question, how many more tests are currently being given compared to 2 months ago?

https://www.politico.com/interactives/2020/coronavirus-testing-by-state-chart-of-new-cases/

This is a pretty sound estimate.

Offline Don R

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 I've witnessed the false promises told on TV, only a few cases, it will go away, when summer comes it will be over, we've done a great job. The overcrowded hospitals in the hot zones must be full of illness faking Trump haters. Seriously? 
  The Virus doesn't care if you believe in it or not. In my opinion, fox news has killed thousands, and if you spread it you are too.
No matter how many times you paint over a shadow, it's still there.
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Offline Ichiban 4

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Hi Folks..
Found another interesting statistical resource on Covid recovery rates.
https://usafacts.org/covid-recovery-hub/

This USA Facts website seems to be relatively unbiased with their figures..
Cheers..Ichi
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Offline J-Rod10

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Hospitalizations, and deaths are soaring here, along with positive tests.

Have friends and family that work at multiple hospitals. Their ICUs are hovering between 70%-80% capacity.

This is from a friend who is the CFO at a major hospital in Houston.

"Just a FYI - our ICU capacity here is 99%, meaning we have no empty ICU beds left as of now. Numbers have been spiking here and FLA, so be cautious. I know I’m the pot/kettle as my ass still goes to the gym, but I think we’re finally to the point where whatever is about to happen is here w/in 2 weeks.
My barometer is hospital capacity here where my faculty work; All locations are at capacity it seems as of last week.
So just be careful."


Offline jgger

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We will never know the real story.  I heard a report that Orange County Calif has the most cases in the entire country. If that were true then I would think we would be hearing all sorts of public service announcements,  nothing but crickets.

Also heard that the media is all over Arizona and Florida ( one particular party) and not a peep about L A County ( the other party). L A county has almost the same number of cases as Florida, but Florida has twice the population of  Los Angeles.........go figure.

I think that if you are going to get it, you will get it. If you die, well that's life. We don't get out of here alive, never have. As long as our "protectors" quit doing stupid ass stuff like putting Wuhan positive people into nursing homes,  and the media would just STFU on the politics of it all and just report the TRUE facts. We will be ok.

For every story you hear, there is a counter story being told. Nobody knows who to believe any more. At least we know that we can't believe the W. H. O. or the Chinese!
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Offline scottly

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On Wednesday, the US reported 36,880 new cases. This is the highest daily count since the start of the pandemic, and a full two months (!) after the previous highest count. While politicians in Scottsdale, AZ, were holding a rally against wearing masks, Arizona hospitals are overwhelmed with cases and testing centers cannot process the tests because they are swamped. One of the reasons people were supposed to take strong precautions (and milder ones, such as wearing a mask) is to "flatten the curve" or lower the rate of transmission so that the healthcare system would not be overwhelmed.
There was a councilman or such at that rally who proclaimed "I can't breathe!", which caused a massive backlash in view of current events; the governor said something about how he shouldn't be allowed to hold public office....
At the same time, people were shoulder-to-shoulder in a church, waiting for Trump, and lots more outside waiting to get in, with very few wearing masks. Last I looked, ICU beds were at 88% capacity, new cases were over 3000, and 26(?) new deaths today.
It's simple: wear a #$%*ing mask people!!!
« Last Edit: June 25, 2020, 11:30:08 PM by scottly »
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Offline dave500

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well here in australia,an island country we got it good,and weve all been on our best behaviour,except for a whole lot of #$%*ing protesters about some #$%*,they disobeyed the public gathering orders etc and now we got a rise in covid,oh well.

Offline CaptFatCat

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I live in Florida, my whole family works in the medical field, I work for a Pulmonary Doctor that has been working on the front line in NY, PA, Albany GA and LA. he has treated over 2,000 patients so far. He says that we will all get it before its over and its just a matter of how our bodies will take it. He tells everyone that the best medicines are Soap, Sunshine and Vitamin C.
I asked the doctor if he knew of any doctors that would manipulate the death certificates and he said absolutely not!

I personally know only 5 people that got it and it was very bad on all of them.
My mom 85yo survived after 3 weeks of the worst illness she ever had. no underlying conditions.
My niece 35yo survived 3 weeks of serious illness, no underlying conditions.
A friend 54yo male survived but still has issues, no underlying conditions.
A friend 46yo male died after 1 day on a vent tube, no underlying conditions.
A friend 56yo male died after 1 day on a vent tube with type 2 diabetes.

Looks to me that the only ones that are making it political are the politicians.
Those Naysayers (and we have many here) will change their attitudes when they have someone close to them die from it.
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Online jlh3rd

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and for every horror story there's the opposite. My son is a P.A. in colorado ( loveland) and in conjunction with the doctor he has a joint practice with, haven't seen any cases . My youngest son who is a flight surgeon in the navy saw no cases at his base in North Carolina. He actually got sick and was in quarantine, but was negative for the wuhan virus......An ex brother-in-law who weighs in excess of 300 lbs and is diabetic, was infected as was his wife and kid and recovered normally in Louisiana.
      Another son who works in Denver did have a 50 year old co-worker die, he had underlying conditions ( smoker and obese) but no one else in the office got sick.
     Here in Pa., the only person I know of who became ill is the mother of my girfriend's daughter-in-law. No one else in that family got sick. and it didn't spread to us. And, the mother had a mild case and was done.
      Pa. has a secretary of health and a governor who herded a certain age group of individuals into nursing homes where the vast majority of deaths occurred.......of course he/she pulled her mother out of the nursing home she was in. In the meantime, the governor goes marching with protesters shoulder to shoulder, unmasked.....but threatens business owners with license revocations if not adhering to distancing, masks, or opening.
      It is reported this morning on WHP580 radio station in Harrisburg, Pa., that most, if not all, of the new cases are in nursing homes.
     And then this:
« Last Edit: June 26, 2020, 05:19:53 AM by jlh3rd »

Online jlh3rd

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and a report out of china...china, mind you......said that the protein of the antibodies can begin to disintegrate as early as two months after infection......
     I said before, how do we, even begin to get the unbiased truth....

Offline Bailgang

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I only personally know of 4 people who've had covid. Three of them dealt with it with no issues and to them it seemed like nothing more than a mild case of the flu. The one though it kicked his arse pretty bad and oddly enough he was the one most physically fit of them all. He not only had severe difficulty breathing but he also claimed it felt like his entire body was in pain, it scared the daylights out of him because he never had anything like it before and took him over a month to get over it.

Another concern is that this covid is so new that doctors and scientists keep finding out more and more about it so much so that they really don't know what it's full impact on the human body is, that in itself stirs up misinformation because they really don't know yet. They're seeing people with covid having blood clot issues and swelling toes ...... basically crazy stuff that normally have nothing to do with a flu and I've read that they're now thinking it starts out as a respiratory problem but then turns into a vascular problem.
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Offline carnivorous chicken

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There was a councilman or such at that rally who proclaimed "I can't breathe!", which caused a massive backlash in view of current events; the governor said something about how he shouldn't be allowed to hold public office....

That's despicable.

Offline carnivorous chicken

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We will never know the real story.  I heard a report that Orange County Calif has the most cases in the entire country. If that were true then I would think we would be hearing all sorts of public service announcements,  nothing but crickets.

Also heard that the media is all over Arizona and Florida ( one particular party) and not a peep about L A County ( the other party). L A county has almost the same number of cases as Florida, but Florida has twice the population of  Los Angeles.........go figure.

I think that if you are going to get it, you will get it. If you die, well that's life. We don't get out of here alive, never have. As long as our "protectors" quit doing stupid ass stuff like putting Wuhan positive people into nursing homes,  and the media would just STFU on the politics of it all and just report the TRUE facts. We will be ok.

For every story you hear, there is a counter story being told. Nobody knows who to believe any more. At least we know that we can't believe the W. H. O. or the Chinese!

First, which media are you checking? The OC Register, the LA Times, and I am sure local TV has reported on C19 in Orange County. Fox's news coverage has been focusing on protests and downplaying C19, similar to Trump (who just defunded federal testing for C19). This is not a political statement, it's a fact. Orange County does not have the most cases in the country.

But if you think politics has something to do with it, you're right. The media are focusing on Arizona, Texas and Florida because they are having huge, record-breaking outbreaks of C19. They are also, for the most part, conservative states (although AZ is definitely turning purple) with conservative state leadership. But this is to be expected when wearing a mask has become politicized, and Republicans are mostly vocal against taking precautions such as wearing a mask. Again, simply stating facts, not offering any partisan analysis.

Although whether one can find "true facts" is questionable, there are plenty of reliable sources for information, including the CDC and WHO -- the later may have made some errors but it is compiling good data at the international level.

Offline carnivorous chicken

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For all of the anecdotes about not knowing someone or hearing from a doctor friend or etc., there is strong statistical information that shows the overall toll.

There are 2.4 million confirmed cases of C19, and 122,000 deaths. That's one person out of 136 ill, and one out of every 2,700 people dead. These ratios, however, are dynamic and not static. This means that with an infection curve that has plateaued, these numbers will change. The CDC is estimating 200,000 dead by September. That brings the ratio down to one out of every 1,640 people dead.

The current number of dead is twice the number of KIA in Vietnam and more than the number of KIA in World War I, over the course of four months.

There are obviously regional variations with rates of infection, timing of the spike, etc. There will be places where the infection doesn't reach. There will be plenty of people who don't know anyone who has gotten sick or anyone who has died. That does not change the fact that a lot of people are getting sick, and a lot of people are dying.

Looking comparatively at other countries that have successfulyl flattened their curves and are reopening (New Zealand! No new cases for three weeks!), it's because they have instituted measures that their citizens follow and don't whine about how not wearing a mask is somehow their right. The solution to this is obvious and evident. You can lead a horse to water...

*** I forgot to add that the CDC issued a report stating that the number of infected people may be as high as ten times the number verified. This could be seen as good news if you only care about the percentage of people who die from C19. But it's not such great news if you realize that if there are that many people infected and potentially spreading the disease that the toll may be lower in proportion but will certainly be higher in number, and harder to control.
« Last Edit: June 26, 2020, 11:24:12 AM by carnivorous chicken »

Online jlh3rd

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anecdotal evidence does not always mean its irrelevant,or false. It plays a roll, and just because it's not coming from labeled experts doesn't mean it can be discarded as nonsense. It matters.
     You can't shut down economies for months on end..years?..Can we at least get real on that? There's no on hand evidence as to the cost in lives if that action was continued. But there would nonetheless be a high cost in lives. I know, an anecdotal observation. But does it matter as much as lives lost from a virus?
       You...Just....Can't.....Do .....That!....
        We have to come out of our hole. We are still experiencing the effects of the Spanish flu of 1918. Should we still be in retreat for that one? There is no vaccine for that and I doubt there'll be one for this. There' probably will be a "flu" shot for it, but that's it......so, do we keep wringing our hands and sit around hiding?  Or do we do what we can on a personal basis for protection of our health....and get back to work.....
      "herd" exposure is probably the best way to permanently reduce infection rates. But just what do we do if ,in fact, that china report turns out to be true?......The " blood" thing came up the other day saying people with "O" blood have a smaller reaction to the virus.....lucky me, I guess....I certainly don't want to test the theory, but Im not hiding either.
Stay home if that is where your head is.....and that is NOT a condemnation of a choice. That choice should be respected.....so should others who hold a different view.

Online jlh3rd

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Trump (who just defunded federal testing for C19).
[/quote]

sigh....not true....see what I'm talking about ?.......just because someone hates trump.....fake news.......here's part of the real story......this had been planned from the inception....

Offline carnivorous chicken

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anecdotal evidence does not always mean its irrelevant,or false. It plays a roll, and just because it's not coming from labeled experts doesn't mean it can be discarded as nonsense. It matters.
     You can't shut down economies for months on end..years?..Can we at least get real on that? There's no on hand evidence as to the cost in lives if that action was continued. But there would nonetheless be a high cost in lives. I know, an anecdotal observation. But does it matter as much as lives lost from a virus?
       You...Just....Can't.....Do .....That!....
        We have to come out of our hole. We are still experiencing the effects of the Spanish flu of 1918. Should we still be in retreat for that one? There is no vaccine for that and I doubt there'll be one for this. There' probably will be a "flu" shot for it, but that's it......so, do we keep wringing our hands and sit around hiding?  Or do we do what we can on a personal basis for protection of our health....and get back to work.....
      "herd" exposure is probably the best way to permanently reduce infection rates. But just what do we do if ,in fact, that china report turns out to be true?......The " blood" thing came up the other day saying people with "O" blood have a smaller reaction to the virus.....lucky me, I guess....I certainly don't want to test the theory, but Im not hiding either.
Stay home if that is where your head is.....and that is NOT a condemnation of a choice. That choice should be respected.....so should others who hold a different view.

The reason I cited official statistics is to show that while some people have anecdotes that say one thing, others say a different thing, and only by viewing the whole picture can one get an idea of what is happening countrywide. I also wrote how some places are likely not affected, while some are hit hard.

As for "shutting down the economy," these measures were made to save lives. In other places, as I mentioned, they did them effectively and are reopening. Texas, a red state, just announced it was going to reverse its decision to allow bars to open. Florida, another red-perhaps-purple state, reported a record number of cases yesterday. The point is, and the point I made when suggesting comparing the USA to other countries, is that had the US taken a better coordinated approach not only would it have saved lives (36,000-86,000 according to a Columbia University study published a month ago), it would also mean that the US could be reopening. As it stands, the US will have to remain shuttered for weeks or months more. And the resistance to measures such as wearing masks is only extending that. While people of a certain political persuasion are clamoring about their "rights" none of them are talking about their responsibilities to their fellow citizens, including the elderly and infirm.

While I appreciate your thoughts on herd immunity, I'm going to read what epidemiologists have to say and follow their advice.

Regarding the story in the Hill: The Hill is a partisan paper that has been discredited for, among other things, allowing advertisers to write copy and interfering with editorial oversight in order to prevent criticism of Donald Trump. It is considered a mouthpiece of his administration. Trump himself said he wanted to stop testing because in his mind more tests = more cases, which is like saying if you don't get a pregnancy test then you can't be pregnant. I would suggest looking for better sources that have reported that the administration will defund and shut down testing sites in Texas, Illinois, New Jersey, Pennslyvania and Colorado. Try these:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/jun/25/us-coronavirus-testing-sites-federal-support-cut-officials-alarm

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/trump-administration-funding-covid-test-sites/

But, if you read the story you posted, it says the same thing: the administration is defunding 13 testing sites. It's the Hill, so they quote an administration official who obfuscates and tries to make it sound like they aren't defunding but at the same time says that states will take over. That is the definition of losing federal support.

Online jlh3rd

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and this....so who's lying?.....I've watched 3+ years of an attempted coup against a duly elected president that used lies and deceit. There's no russia, no ukraine, no dossier...kavanaugh was innocent and so was the high school kid the left tried to roast in D.C.........I've had enough!.....
     So just who do you think I believe ....
« Last Edit: June 26, 2020, 05:46:42 PM by jlh3rd »

Offline carnivorous chicken

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and this....so who's lying?.....I've watched 3+ years of an attempted coup against a duly elected president that used lies and deceit. There's no russia, no ukraine, no dossier...kavanaugh was innocent and so was the high school kid the left tried to roast in D.C.........I've had enough!.....
     So just who do you think I believe ....

This might be the "jump the shark" moment some have been waiting for. Maybe someone has something worthwhile to bring this back on topic?

Offline Gordon

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This might be the "jump the shark" moment some have been waiting for.

Agreed.  This thread was doomed from the beginning, but I'm honestly surprised and pleased that it took this long to go completely off topic and 100% political.  Good job, everybody, but this one is done.