Author Topic: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc  (Read 78735 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Dimitri13

  • Not a
  • Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,603
  • 1974 CB550K
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #325 on: February 07, 2020, 01:44:20 PM »
Good suggestions Mike. I did a quick carb sync when I first got the bike running and they were very close in specs, but I was more worried about keeping it running and it not exploding. I can pull out the gauges again since it's running more smoothly than before.

Unfortunately my front fender hasn't arrived on island yet, so I'm not sure if it'll be here in time to get it fabbed up for a safety inspection on Monday. Might have to rig one out of scrap metal or something.

Offline Dimitri13

  • Not a
  • Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,603
  • 1974 CB550K
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #326 on: February 07, 2020, 08:05:28 PM »
Checked all adjustments before I fired it up and all seemed well.

Fired it up and it still has trouble maintaining a steady factory idle (even at the upper range of 1200). My digital tach is still having trouble showing a steady RPM too, it jumps around a lot. I'm gonna check the voltages or ohms or amperage or whatever of the coils to make sure I'm getting strong spark on all cylinders. I don't know if I'll even be able to get a steady idle with the work that's been done.

I did take it out on the road and kept an eye on the a/f ratio. Idle is about 12.5 (which after doing some more reading that might be too rich, I should be aiming for 13-13.5ish). Off-idle throttle input drops me down to about 8 and causes a big stumble. Still rolling on the throttle returns me to the previous a/f ratio. I think I'll first drop down to 40 slows (currently have 42s, previously had 38s which were too lean). That should get me closer to an ideal idle mixture. If I still have some off-idle stumble I'm going to mess with the air mixture screws. I haven't touched them at all so I believe they're going to be at the stock 1.5 turns out. Slide needle is at the stock #2 position and from what it feels like I don't need to adjust it quite yet.

Offline Dimitri13

  • Not a
  • Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,603
  • 1974 CB550K
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #327 on: February 08, 2020, 05:40:35 PM »
Turns out 40 slows are the only jets I don't have, even though I'm supposed to. Sticking with 42s and will mess with the idle air screws. I have at least two fulls turns out of adjustment.

Mounted my afr gauge properly with a gauge pod. When I say properly, I mean I drilled and tapped the dummy light clamp thingy and screwed it into that, but the dummy light clamp thingy is zip-tied to the top tree clamp.

Put the stock air plenum back on because one of the pod filters I was using fell off. I had them on because I expected to be removing the carbs repeatedly. Replacing them with the air plenum in place is a huge PITA, even with brand new boots.

Having trouble with my Tarozzi rearsets' brake lever. Seems like it's binding when actuated so the brake sticks. I know it worked well before I had it apart but I can't figure out why it's binding now. The pivot hole for where the brake arm attaches is totally clean and lubricated.

I'll get some pictures of the nearly finished product soon.

Offline HondaMan

  • Someone took this pic of me before I became a
  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 13,856
  • ...not my choice, I was nicknamed...
    • Getting 'em Back on the Road
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #328 on: February 08, 2020, 07:40:39 PM »
With 42 idle jets, turn the air screws inward about 25% about 1 to 1.25 turns out from stop). The mixture gets leaner when the screws are turned inward. Their total authority is between 3/4 and 2.0 turns, no further change in either direction beyond that.
See SOHC4shop@gmail.com for info about the gadgets I make for these bikes.

The demons are repulsed when a man does good. Use that.
Blood is thicker than water, but motor oil is thicker yet...so, don't mess with my SOHC4, or I might have to hurt you.
Hondaman's creed: "Bikers are family. Treat them accordingly."

Link to Hondaman Ignition: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67543.0

Link to My CB750 Book: https://www.lulu.com/search?adult_audience_rating=00&page=1&pageSize=10&q=my+cb750+book

Link to website: www.SOHC4shop.com

Offline Dimitri13

  • Not a
  • Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,603
  • 1974 CB550K
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #329 on: February 08, 2020, 08:25:42 PM »
The mixture gets leaner when they're turned in? It's a 022A carb and the screw is on the air side of the slide, so that means it affects the amount of air, not fuel, right? So turning in should close off the amount of air and turning out should open up the amount of air?

Turns out my rough sync on first startup was just that, rough. Got them balanced and it definitely holds an idle much better, but I'm still running pretty rich. Getting closer to 13 but still hovering around 12.7-8.

Could the fact that I'm using a colder plug be an issue? Should I start with the stock D7EAs and see if I'm encountering the same symptoms?

[Edit] After doing a bit of reading, I agree that my idle is still a bit rich for extended idling, but my 1/4 and up throttles are right where they should be. Idling is fouling the plugs, but if I have a hotter plug that might help burn off the deposits? I'd be keeping an eye out for excessive engine temps and detonation. I'm only going off what makes sense on paper and that real-world conditions would have an impact, but I'm trying to get in the ballpark.
« Last Edit: February 08, 2020, 08:56:36 PM by Dimitri13 »

Offline MRieck

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 10,564
  • Big ideas....
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #330 on: February 09, 2020, 10:24:10 AM »
The mixture gets leaner when they're turned in? It's a 022A carb and the screw is on the air side of the slide, so that means it affects the amount of air, not fuel, right? So turning in should close off the amount of air and turning out should open up the amount of air?

Turns out my rough sync on first startup was just that, rough. Got them balanced and it definitely holds an idle much better, but I'm still running pretty rich. Getting closer to 13 but still hovering around 12.7-8.

Could the fact that I'm using a colder plug be an issue? Should I start with the stock D7EAs and see if I'm encountering the same symptoms?

[Edit] After doing a bit of reading, I agree that my idle is still a bit rich for extended idling, but my 1/4 and up throttles are right where they should be. Idling is fouling the plugs, but if I have a hotter plug that might help burn off the deposits? I'd be keeping an eye out for excessive engine temps and detonation. I'm only going off what makes sense on paper and that real-world conditions would have an impact, but I'm trying to get in the ballpark.
You are correct.....screws on the air side control air. Screwing out leans the mixture. I'd stick with the stock plug. Not sure what Mark is talking about.
Owner of the "Million Dollar CB"

Offline Dimitri13

  • Not a
  • Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,603
  • 1974 CB550K
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #331 on: February 09, 2020, 09:49:38 PM »
Spent most of the day fixing my fork seal fiasco. Had to hone the bore and shim the seal with a strap of nickel. Not a permanent fix but good enough to pass safety; no leaks.

Amazon really screwed up and the fender that was supposed to arrive on Thursday won't be arriving til Wednesday. We spent the rest of the day cutting up an old toaster oven tray and hammering it into a fender. Coated it with crinkle black ad bolted it to the Tarozzi fork brace. Ugly, but looks somewhat like a real fender from afar. Hopefully it's good enough to pass safety.

Forgot about the Tarozzi rearset brake lever not springing back. Will ask about that in Bikes and hopefully I can get it solved by the time I'm ready to leave for safety.

Offline Dimitri13

  • Not a
  • Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,603
  • 1974 CB550K
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #332 on: February 11, 2020, 08:26:53 PM »
Spent all day out but it's legal now. I lost my plate reservation (the one from my profile picture) but maybe I'll try getting it again. Shop I went to loved the bike. Pulled it out of my van and everyone passing by complimented it and asked a bunch of questions. Took me about 15 minutes to get to the service desk. Mechanics also liked it. I didn't want to rev it too much in case it was too loud for safety. Basically kept it at idle and maybe up to 1500rpm just to keep the revs up so it didn't die while warming up.
Spent about 90 minutes at the DMV, which isn't too bad for a Tuesday during the middle of the month. Registration wasn't too much either, at least 1/4 the cost of my van.

Now that she's insured and legal, I can finally take it down to the straightaway by my house and and run it out for testing.

Unfortunately I only have a few days for testing and tuning since I'm leaving in a week and my van leaves in two days. Really gonna try getting it shipped out before I leave but I'm not sure that's the case. There was a two week lead time for my van.

Still waiting on my 40 jets, but in the meantime I'm gonna try hotter plugs (bought colder ones to start with, D8EA, stock is D7EA) and see if that helps fouling at idle. Maybe not but who knows.

I can't really take it out riding too much because I'm still waiting on my rear brake return spring. Don't know what happened to mine but it disappeared over the last 7 years.
« Last Edit: February 11, 2020, 08:29:02 PM by Dimitri13 »

Offline SF

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 527
  • I burn gas very well
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #333 on: February 11, 2020, 08:47:09 PM »
glad you’re moving forward and it’s starting to pay off.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
92 wr250 sold
98 zx6r sold
04 zx10r
73 cb350 twin
75 cb550f
75 cb550f
72 r5c
rgid springer bobber project

Offline Dimitri13

  • Not a
  • Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,603
  • 1974 CB550K
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #334 on: February 16, 2020, 03:58:21 PM »
Swapped in the 40 slows, but I think it's still rich. I have the air screws turned out two full turns but it's still running at below 13:1 at idle. It still stumbles off-idle down to 10:1 or less and at part-throttle cruising it's anywhere between 11-12:1. At 1/2 to wide open throttle it's at a sweet 12.5:1 and pulls hard.

Thinking about it literally right now though I'm going to replace my air filter. It was a used unit with unknown miles and quite a number of years old. It's a big k&n single unit attached to the stock plenum. I'll do that first and see how it goes.

I keep saying this but I'm too old and broken for clip-ons. I really really want to switch to at least flat track or higher bars. The 20-minute freeway ride was pretty sore and my carpel tunnel was kicking in.

My one biggest concern right now is that after that ride, my oil light came on at idle. It didn't feel any different like running rough or clunking. All the clearances were nice and tight during assembly, I feel like I broke it in well enough, and I changed the initial break-in oil with 15w40 with a bit of extra zinc.

Can running rich cause that? Like the extra fuel is causing the oil to thin out or wash off the cylinder walls or something?  Should I be running heavier oil?

My first step is to check or replace the oil sensor, or get an actual oil pressure gauge on it.

Either way I can't really do anything with it until the end of next week since it's going to be on a boat very soon.

Offline Bankerdanny

  • Eventually I will be old enough in reality to be
  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 7,626
  • Endeavor to persevere
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #335 on: February 18, 2020, 01:42:58 PM »
Try Norman Hyde M bars. Basically no rise, but a slight pullback. I ran them on my 550 and really liked them.
"The problem with quotes on the Internet is that you never know if they're true" - Abraham Lincoln

Current: '76 CB750F. Previous:  '75 CB550F, 2007 Yamaha Vino 125 Scooter, '75 Harley FXE Superglide, '77 GL1000, '77 CB550k, '68 Suzuki K10 80, '68 Yamaha YR2, '69 BMW R69S, '71 Honda SL175, '02 Royal Enfield Bullet 500, '89 Yamaha FJ1200

Offline Dimitri13

  • Not a
  • Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,603
  • 1974 CB550K
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #336 on: February 26, 2020, 08:20:08 PM »
New bars will come eventually. Likely when I do the rewire and get new lighting and controls.

My brake lever return spring came in and after some intense thinking I got it installed. Seriously, I sat there for like 30 minutes rotating it and putting it in different places before I figured out where it went.

I didn't swap in 38 slow jets but I did clean and oil the air filter. It was super dirty and oily (not the good kind) and I couldn't find a replacement locally.

As for the supposed low oil pressure issue, I'm gonna get a mechanical gauge on there sometime next week. I don't think I'm going to be able to fit an electric oil pressure sender in the stock location but that would be awesome if I could. I saw the mechanical gauge cyclex and carpy sells but I don't have that oil galley cap above the points cover that it taps into.

Other than those issues (though admittedly pretty important ones), it's pretty sorted. Once I get those issues taken care of I'm gonna take it around the island and get some nice pictures.

Offline ralt12

  • Enthusiast
  • **
  • Posts: 143
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #337 on: February 26, 2020, 08:32:00 PM »
I ran into the same wrist issues with my 916, but run Euro CB400F bars on my 550, massive difference.

Offline Dimitri13

  • Not a
  • Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,603
  • 1974 CB550K
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #338 on: March 01, 2020, 02:48:40 PM »
Apparently the side of the island I moved to is the rainiest part of the island. In the two weeks I've been here, I've had a single full day of sunshine (and it rained later that night). I'm sitting here waiting for the sun to come out long enough to dry out the gravel driveway and road, but heavy rain falls periodically throughout the day.

Anyway, I'm sitting here watching a long YouTube series of someone building a 90-something turbo Hyundai Elantra from mostly used and recycled parts, and realized I didn't change the oil filter during the initial break-in oil change. Probably a combination of forgetfulness and not wanting to unbolt the exhaust. When I drained the oil, there was a lot of junk and contaminants, likely a mix of dust from sitting, powdercoat overspray and from grinding, and whatever normal break-in wear. I'm really hoping that when I pull the filter I see it clogged full of contaminants and that being the cause of my oil pressure issues (if there even is one).

I have a filter on order but I still have to figure out an oil pressure gauge solution. No way in hell am I gonna have high pressure oil fittings sticking out the bottom of my engine. I want to use the stock location on the oil pump but I don't know what size, pitch, and taper the threads are. I don't have any thread gauges or spare bolts to check.

Next sunny day I have I'm going to take it out and see if cleaning and oiling the air filter did anything to help my fuel mixture. If not then I'll finally swap down to 38s. It just doesn't make sense that with all the porting, polishing, valvetrain, and rotating assembly work, that I still need to use stock slow jets. Ideally I'm hoping that cleaning it made enough of an impact that I can stick with my 40s and not have to open up the carbs again :P

Last thing that crossed my mind. My front brake lever is a pain for my carpel tunnel. The lever sticks way out so that when I grab full brake pressure, the lever is still still really far out causing strain. I partially remedied that by loosening the adjustment screw way out, but because it's spring loaded, I have a ton of play before the lever engages the piston. I'd like to replace the lever with an adjustable one like on sportbikes, but all the aftermarket/generic ones I see are the two-finger short levers. That's not great because when carpel tunnel kicks in, my thumb, index, and middle fingers lose feeling so I need to rely on my ring and pinky fingers to feel how much I'm squeezing the lever. Any recommendations for a full-sized adjustable lever that fits the stock mount?
« Last Edit: March 01, 2020, 03:06:03 PM by Dimitri13 »

Offline Dimitri13

  • Not a
  • Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,603
  • 1974 CB550K
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #339 on: April 05, 2020, 09:14:00 PM »
Finally getting around to the oil filter.

Swapped down to 38 slows and even with the air screws an extra turn out, it's still acting up. That got me thinking about actually what throttle positions I'm at, and I may have been underestimating what what position I'm at. My "1/8th throttle" may very well be 1/4 or more. Anyway, I'm pretty sure my main jet is too big. Cruising all the way to wide open, it sits at a steadyish 12.1-5. so probably too rich.

Once I finish diagnosing my oil issue, I'll get back into the carbs.

Offline Dimitri13

  • Not a
  • Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,603
  • 1974 CB550K
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #340 on: May 12, 2020, 06:52:01 PM »
Got the oil filter off. Inside the housing and inside the filter looked like this.





It appears to be normal break-in shavings, plus a whole lot of gunk. My guess is a mix of sanding dust (from a paint shop), assembly lube, and whatever dust and dirt had accumulated inside through the bottom of the engine over five or six years.

I also dropped the oil pan and in there was the same mixture of stuff. The side cover had accumulated a lot of oil which appeared to be coming from the pump. Either it had heat cycled and loosened up, letting oil out of the sealing surface, or the cover of the pump was leaking. All new o-rings were used. It wasn't coming from the sensor hole.
I popped off the oil pump and it was clean and unclogged. I have yet to spec the rotor inside, but I will.

Aside from that, I'll be doing another complete tune-up. I have a set of feeler gauges coming in so I can verify valve lash (I think it's .002/.003 for my cam). I also need to pick up a torque wrench to re-torque the head stud nuts since I totally forgot about that.

Other than that I hope everything works out. I haven't had much time since we just gave birth, so that's taking up most of my time when I'm not trying to catch some shut eye.

I had my triple tree top clamp sent over so one of these days I'll be picking up a set of bars and getting that all worked out. I think my clip-on length cables and lines will fit since there's plenty of slack.
« Last Edit: May 12, 2020, 06:55:35 PM by Dimitri13 »

Offline Dimitri13

  • Not a
  • Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,603
  • 1974 CB550K
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #341 on: June 24, 2020, 12:28:25 AM »
Checked the oil pump, clearances looked all good and it didn't appear to be clogged or anything. Buttoned it all back up but it's still giving me the same issue (low oil pressure at idle after warming up). Just off idle the oil light goes off. Anything else I can check before I have to tear the whole engine down?

While it was sitting I swapped in 40 slows (up from 38) and 115 mains (down from 120) and it was too rich at idle and stumbled at WOT. So 38 and 120 seems to be correct. Still seems weird that all the work and it still wants stock slow jets.

Obviously the first issue is more important than the second issue. It's just pretty frustrating.

On top of all that, when I took it out for a test ride after buttoning it up, the front caliper froze up and started smoking the pads. It's been sitting since my last post (looks like about three months? Wow, a lot longer than it seems) and it rains a lot here so it doesn't surprise me.

Lots going on, baby was born about two months ago and I've been trying to find another job. Just got one about two weeks ago. Also picked up a new daily driver, a '79 Mercedes 240D. My Astro wasn't a good fit for the baby because of the leaking windows, no AC and permanently smelly interior. The 240D is great. 4-speed, nice cold AC, comfortable ride, and big back seat.

Offline RAFster122s

  • I feel like a really really
  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 12,373
  • SOHC4 member # 2605
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #342 on: June 24, 2020, 03:07:36 AM »
Original rubber brake hoses can collapse inside acting like a one way valve or the return hole, tiny hole in brake master cylinder, can get clogged not letting fluid pass.
David- back in the desert SW!

Offline Dimitri13

  • Not a
  • Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,603
  • 1974 CB550K
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #343 on: June 24, 2020, 03:11:56 AM »
Brake hoses and lines are all new stainless steel from Slingshot Cycles (several years ago but just recently installed). So my guess is the piston seized. It seems to be alright now but I'm keeping an eye on it.

Offline MRieck

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 10,564
  • Big ideas....
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #344 on: June 24, 2020, 07:52:28 AM »
Original rubber brake hoses can collapse inside acting like a one way valve or the return hole, tiny hole in brake master cylinder, can get clogged not letting fluid pass.
Had that happen to one of my front car hoses.....caliper seized at about 70 mph. Talk about steering wheel shake! ;D
Owner of the "Million Dollar CB"

Offline Dimitri13

  • Not a
  • Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,603
  • 1974 CB550K
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #345 on: July 05, 2020, 04:14:45 PM »
I took it out for one more ride. The front brake doesn't seem to be seized anymore. But now it squeals. The pads are at least 6 years old and while the bike was apart, probably got some grease and debris on them. I'm going to pull them apart and at least sand down the pads. The rotor is many years old, it's been on there longer than I've had the bike. I have access to a rotor lathe thingy so if it's within spec I'll at least turn it down. I'm still planning on doing a dual disc conversion since I'm a heavier rider and the engine is much more powerful than stock and I'd like to take it down the track at least once in its lifetime. Plus that'll give me a reason to upgrade to prettier controls since I'm still running the stock stuff. All beat up, multiple repairs and the threads on the control body are starting to get iffy.
I had planned on a complete front end conversion from cognitomoto but with a baby (they're expensive!) that's out of the question now. I could save up for that, but that amount of money would get me dual discs, new controls, cr26 carbs (more on that later), a welding setup, and probably more stuff to fix all the things that weren't done right. So until I start making more money (I manged to land a full time job making as much as I did at OfficeMax but I'll be going to school again soon), I have to table that.

Anyway, on to the core, pressing issue. I mentioned that I'm considering CR26s. I'm getting pretty tired of the tedious removal and installation process of the stock carbs. The float bowls screws and screw holes are getting to be more of a pain. Half of them are already drilled out for larger screws. I'd also like to be able to get all the performance out of my bike. I don't know if the stock carbs can do that but I'm tired of messing with them. Plus I think the stock carbs are kinda ugly too :P

So after my last ride, it was running very rich. Rich enough that it didn't want to idle at all after getting hot. I needed to keep it up at 2000+ RPM at stop lights. Plus my air fuel ratio was dipping well below 11:1 at idle and cruise, and barely cracking 12:1 at speed. That may be because I swapped back up to 40 mains. But I think the real issue is that my float levels are out of spec. On my way home, it was running even more rich and noticeably "burbly." One street before I got home, I turned off my petcock so that I wouldn't have full float bowls for when I take them off again. Just seconds after that, the idle picked up, it sounded less burbly, and the throttle was much more responsive. That leads me to believe my floats are set too high (fuel level too high) so it's choking on its own fuel. I know that I set them exactly with a micrometer when I put everything back together the first time, but the last few times I've worked on the carbs, I've been leaving them on the bike and just dropping the float bowls. It makes sense that I've managed to bend the tang while working because I'm pushing them out of the way and even hitting them. Just a theory. I don't know if I'll have time to mess with them today.
Also I just decided to check the oil on the dipstick, and I can't tell for sure but it smells like fuel. Either that or burnt oil. If it's fuel, it might be likely that since it's running too rich, unburnt fuel is washing the cylinder walls of oil causing my oil issue. Or something. If I don't get to it today, I'm going to look into it next weekend. I'm also going to be removing the cam cover because I need to retorque my head studs.

Offline Godffery

  • Godffery's Garage
  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,172
  • Wisdom brings a realization of how little we know.
    • Godffery's Garage hosted by VinMoto.org
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #346 on: July 06, 2020, 09:12:30 PM »
I can hook you up with a set of twins, when your ready.
 https://godfferysgarage.com/wp-content/uploads/Hon-267.jpg

 https://godfferysgarage.com/

Offline johno

  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,316
Re: CB550 Gulf road race build 592cc
« Reply #347 on: July 06, 2020, 11:05:36 PM »
GRASSHOPPER SOHC HONDAS ARE THE MEANING OF LIFE.