Topic: AVGAS ?

[gerhed]

I don't usually pay too much attention to NASCAR (I am a Formula I fan), but
the recent finding by NASCAR that Toyota, in their Daytona 500 debut, was qualifying with a "banned" substance
in their fuel just points up the fact that Toyota definitely does not plan to piously arrive on the NASCAR scene.

Attached pic of former NASCAR competitor that employed me for many years.

[BobbyR]

I don't usually pay too much attention to NASCAR (I am a Formula I fan), but
the recent finding by NASCAR that Toyota, in their Daytona 500 debut, was qualifying with a "banned" substance
in their fuel just points up the fact that Toyota definitely does not plan to piously arrive on the NASCAR scene.

Attached pic of former NASCAR competitor that employed me for many years.

It was Waltrips team not Toyota that was cheating. The word is that they were using an oxgenator found in Jet Fuel. If you employer was a Cup Driver it would have been Ward Burton. 

[gerhed]

BobbyR:

Not to be argumentative but Waltrip's team runs Toyota cars.
A Toyota car was found to be illegal.
Somebody's going after it pretty hard.

My employer was Kodak.

Gerhed

[Jonesy]

I was wondering if it was a "domestic" car, would NASCAR have gone after it as harshly? Part of me suspects Toyota might undergo some hazing this season....

[BobbyR]

Well the other Toyota teams came out clean. Waltrip was the only one. I would say there will be some rubbin out on the track, but NASCAR was about rubbin and bumpin. Even the saintly Dale Earnhardt was known to bump a bit. The sport is becoming kinda sissy. Petty made an art out of cheating.

[flatblack]

The word is that they were using an oxgenator found in Jet Fuel.

Weird. Jet fuel is basically high-quality kerosene. The only additives commonly used prevent ice crystals from forming and inhibit microbial growth. An "oxygenator" (not critiquing the author, just the term) in such an application doesn't make any sense.

I read some of the media coverage; some reports say NASCAR removed a "part" or "substance" from the intake manifolds on two cars.  The "part" or "substance" apparently is supposed to spike the fuel (Does NASCAR use gasoline?)  An component acting as an "oxygenator" would make sense, but a single component by itself couldn't do that by itself, could it?  Maybe one of those magical mystery magnets on the fuel line?

 

Anyway, typical media report: Long on innuendo and speculation, short on facts.

Sounds like a mild nitrous injection scheme to me.  How'd they expect to get that past tech inspection?

fb

[gerhed]

I was wondering if it was a "domestic" car, would NASCAR have gone after it as harshly? Part of me suspects Toyota might undergo some hazing this season....

Actually amoung Ford, Dodge and Toyota customer cars, only the Camry is made in the U.S.
Ford Fusions in Mexico and Dodge Chargers in Canada.

[MRieck]

 $100,000  fines...indefinite suspensions That's some hardball.

[tmht]

It was Waltrips team not Toyota that was cheating. The word is that they were using an oxgenator found in Jet Fuel. If you employer was a Cup Driver it would have been Ward Burton. 

From MW's statement about the fine, I have a sneaking suspicion someone is going to get fired in a very public way.

Also depending on the age of the photo, that would actually more likely be Terry Labonte in the 4. I think he drove it longer than Ward did.

[DammitDan]

Even the saintly Dale Earnhardt was known to bump a bit.

That's an understatement...  My grandfather hated Earnhardt because he was so aggressive.  "He's ruining the sport," he would always say.  And it's BECAUSE he was so aggressive that so many people latched onto him; where there's #3, there's usually a wreck.

Or maybe I missed the sarcasm in the statement? 

And if Toyota is punished for Waltrip's teams' actions, then there is something wrong with the league.

[gerhed]

  

Also depending on the age of the photo, that would actually more likely be Terry Labonte in the 4. I think he drove it longer than Ward did.

Ernie Ervin was driving--at Charlotte

[kettlesd]

The word is that they were using an oxgenator found in Jet Fuel.

Weird. Jet fuel is basically high-quality kerosene. The only additives commonly used prevent ice crystals from forming and inhibit microbial growth. An "oxygenator" (not critiquing the author, just the term) in such an application doesn't make any sense.

I read some of the media coverage; some reports say NASCAR removed a "part" or "substance" from the intake manifolds on two cars.  The "part" or "substance" apparently is supposed to spike the fuel (Does NASCAR use gasoline?)  An component acting as an "oxygenator" would make sense, but a single component by itself couldn't do that by itself, could it?  Maybe one of those magical mystery magnets on the fuel line?

 

Anyway, typical media report: Long on innuendo and speculation, short on facts.

Sounds like a mild nitrous injection scheme to me.  How'd they expect to get that past tech inspection?

fb

I think "Jet Fuel" is a bit of a misnomer. Jet fuel is either kerosene or parafin based. I think it is more-likely formulated aviation gasoline (called CLOTS around the tracks here) designed for high performance reciprocating engines. The high octane and "oxegenators" enable the engines to perform better at higher, lower air-density altitudes - meaning higher hp at sea level. The sweet smell of the stuff used to be a dead giveaway of those guys running it.

[BobbyR]

Well it may have been one of the nitrobenzine derived additives. A dead giveaway is you really need to jet really rich to use that stuff for anything more than a few seconds.

[BobbyR]

Even the saintly Dale Earnhardt was known to bump a bit.

That's an understatement...  My grandfather hated Earnhardt because he was so aggressive.  "He's ruining the sport," he would always say.  And it's BECAUSE he was so aggressive that so many people latched onto him; where there's #3, there's usually a wreck.

Or maybe I missed the sarcasm in the statement? 

And if Toyota is punished for Waltrip's teams' actions, then there is something wrong with the league.

I had a copy of the NASCAR yearbook the year before and the year that Earnhardt died. It was like they were writing about two different people. He was not a very nice
 person but he was a very good driver. Stock Car Racing, was a sport  started by Rum Runners who out drove the Law. It was never meant to be a gentelemens sport. It was poor Southern trash with some wrenching and driving ability, banging away every Saturday night on a dirt oval. In Europe the rich raced for the most part.  Maybe they got $25.00 and maybe they wrecked. They worked on their cars all week hauled them to the track and dragged what was left home. It was a people's sport and aggressive drivers like Earnhardt, Petty, Allison, etc drove that old school way. So it was rough and tough and fun to watch.

Now they call it Stock car Racing, but look at the car - it ain't stock, it is not even full size. The drivers private Jet to the airport and Chopper into the track to live in their Mobile Home and Chopper back out. If you bump a guy you get a fine. I really liked the old days.