Topic: Terry's Effing F2, return of the prodigal SOHC4?

[Terry in Australia]

Now for some reason that escapes me completely, I apparently have a reputation for dissing all CB750's that are not K0-K6? Well, that's sort of true, I was never a big fan of the K7/8 or F/F0, even though my first and only shiny new SOHC4 was a 1975 F0 that I bought as "New Old Stock" for cheap in 1978, because the dealers couldn't shift them, and the F2's were out, and selling slightly better than their predecessors.

My first F2 that I bought in the mid 1990's was a magic bike, it was a one owner bike that while a little faded, came up well with a coat of Armor all after a wash, and apart from a diabolically annoying habit of breaking down whenever moisture came anywhere near it, it was a beautiful thing. I knew the problem was ignition related so I bought a complete new Dyna III ignition and Dyna coils and leads from Mike Beltrami, a member here back in the Greenspun days, and it ran perfectly, until it got wet. I never sorted it out, and by the time I'd bought a couple more CB750's from Spotty, plus a Suzuki GS1000 and a BMW R100RS, I sold it on "Sold.com" (Ebay Oz's predecessor) and the guy I sold it to in Sydney, told me that it drove him mad until he replaced the ignition switch, and all was good.

My next F2 was a nightmare. 450 bucks on Ebay, it looked really bad in the pics, and was much worse in the flesh. I remember dropping the oil, and something akin to cafe latte ran out. On top of that it had been in a fire so the wiring harness was melted, as was the airbox, the tank was rusted out, the seat base was more melted foam than steel, the head was fcuked with at least one valve guide protruding into the combustion chamber, valves with mushroomed valve stems, rotten brake lines, cracked tyres, broken sidecovers, you name it, it was just buggared.

Mark Paris (Hondaman) and Mike Rieck helped me out with some much needed missing parts, and I eventually converted it to take a K6 head and cylinder block, with a better set of carbs and a good starter motor, 3 different tanks (another member here from Texas, Tim Kasper, now living in Oz, finally sent me a really good rust free F3 tank) and of course Ebay and various swap meets, and I had it looking nice, and going just as well. I was hoping to find a "before" pic, but anyway, it looked pretty good by the time I finished it, apart from that wrinkle in the seat cover, that  was installed by a "professional". I should have done it myself......



Of course, being the d1ck that I so obviously am, I sold it, 11 years ago. No biggie, I had lots of bikes, and back then it wasn't worth that much anyway, I think I got a shade over $3K AUD ($2K USD) so I may just have broken even, if you didn't count all the hours that I put into the thing.

Fast forward to a couple of weeks ago, and I'm trolling thru Facebook, and see an F2 for sale from a fairly well known bike importer, in "as rough as guts" condition, for $2500 AUD, in Coff Harbor, 1000 miles away.

Terry's new F2 4 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

I took a look and was impressed that most of it was there, but was up to my elbows in Kz1000/1428 and Z1-B builds, so ignored it. Last week I spotted it again, for $1999. Hmmmnnnn, On Wednesday evening I messaged him and offered him $2K including delivery to Melbourne, and thought no more about it. Next morning I had a message from him, saying he'd accepted. Woohoo! Of course the engine is locked up as it's been sitting in a carport for the last 10 years, unregistered, and unloved. Apart from the exhaust and the airbox missing, he told me that he'd sold the horns and the crashbars.

No biggie, Cliff (Maduncle here) Cafe'd an F2 years ago, and gave me a box of the bits he didn't need, which included the horns, airbox, sidecovers, headlight, tail light, grab bar, blinkers, chainguard, rear fender, tank badges, electrical gubbins etc. I bought a chrome 4 into 1 off a DOHC CB750 years ago wondering if it'd fit an SOHC4, so I'm hoping I can make it fit this bike. If so, it won't need much to make complete, even if it'll be a complete rat. With all the dough I've spent recently (another $1200 this week) on Z1 parts, this Honda will have to be a low budget build...... Anyway, surprisingly, the bike was delivered at 5 pm yesterday, only 4 days after I paid for it, which is ironic considering it took 3 weeks for a chunk of aluminium to move 20 miles across Melbourne via Australia Post. I was just able to squeeze it into my garage.....

Terry's new F2 9 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

My first concern today was if I was able to "unstick" the engine. Now providing it wasn't heat seized, there's a chance that I can free up the pistons  in the bores with the right "Juice", so I made up a batch of the time honored 50/50 mix of ATF and Acetone, and pulling the spark plugs, I poured a cup full of the magic juice down each plughole, and into each of the inlet ports.

Terry's Effing F2 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

I had a bit left over, so I filled a spray bottle and sprayed it over every fastener, hoping that if need be, I'll be able to get them out reasonably easy.

Terry's Effing F2 3 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

One noticeable absence, was a tacho.

Terry's Effing F2 1 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

Once again, I ratted through my bins of parts, and found one that will do the job, and installed it.

Terry's Effing F2 2 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

And that's about as far as I got,I'll leave the magic potion in it for a few days before I try to budge those pistons, which is no problem anyway, because I have a Z1 to build, and a 1428 to finish. (not to mention the Harley ironhead Sporty, Yamaha XS650, Honda SP1, BMW K100RS, Spotty's K7, My K2, the BSA C11G, etc etc.

One thing that is very interesting with this bike though, is that I think that it may in fact be my first F2 that I sold back in the late 90's. Not just a "maybe", more a "probably". Interesting............
 

[PeWe]

Will be interesting Terry!
Your red F2 looked really nice!
The goal is to recreate it and forget you ever sold it? F2.2

[spotty]

i think the sooner i get you some room in my garage in rezza the better, and once i'm living back up there i'll be able to get  round to yours and we'll get that new back shed up too, that garage is just about to split at the seams, and i've seen how much more is in there that doesn't show in the pictures

i'm guessing you don't have any records from when you may have originally owned the bike ? or the details of the guy you sold it to ?
the poms have a good system, a vehicle gets a rego number and keeps it for life, the details of every owner go in its log book so its whole history can be traced

were there any particular bodges you might have performed on it that you could look for ?

also that fence is looking a bit worse for wear these days compared to its current condition, obviously not enough rattlecan bling was applied to it in an effort to waterproof and preserve it, pick up your game there

[Terry in Australia]

Thanks Per, the plan is to get it going, and decide where to go with it after that. I might keep it, I might flip it, but if I'm right, this bike could be the same bike I sold over 20 years ago, which would be an amazing coincidence, if true.

It has some distinguishing features that my first F2 had, the Koni shocks, (fairly common) remains of the Dyna 3 ignition I bought from Mike (not very common) and a silver alternator cover and sprocket cover (uncommon on an F2) Also it's fitted with Metzler tyres, and the guy who bought it from me told me that he'd put new Metzlers on it to pass a roadworthy inspection in New South Wales, where the bike was last registered in 2010. I might try doing a search by engine and frame numbers, and see if it goes as far back as the Victorian registration number?

It was registered in my name here in Victoria, but I can't find the original registration papers which would list the engine and frame number, and I can't find any pics of it either. Back then I had a kodak digital camera, but don't think there were any pic hosting sites back then, and didn't ever print any either. I still have the camera, I wonder if I could get it to work still? It might not be mine, but there are a lot of cues that make me think it might be. Kind of sad if it is, the last 20 years haven't been good to it..........

[Terry in Australia]

i think the sooner i get you some room in my garage in rezza the better, and once i'm living back up there i'll be able to get  round to yours and we'll get that new back shed up too, that garage is just about to split at the seams, and i've seen how much more is in there that doesn't show in the pictures

i'm guessing you don't have any records from when you may have originally owned the bike ? or the details of the guy you sold it to ?
the poms have a good system, a vehicle gets a rego number and keeps it for life, the details of every owner go in its log book so its whole history can be traced

were there any particular bodges you might have performed on it that you could look for ?

also that fence is looking a bit worse for wear these days compared to its current condition, obviously not enough rattlecan bling was applied to it in an effort to waterproof and preserve it, pick up your game there

Thanks Spotty, I agree with all of the above, especially the fence, it was replaced a couple of years ago. I think the paint overspray was all that was holding it up. When are you moving back?

[PeWe]

It can be a good project, back to how it looked before.
Paint, decals and clear.

I think the old Fs will get more interests. They can look really good and have the sound.

[PeWe]

But why is this thread in 'Other bikes'?
This is a proud CB4 SOHC!!

[Terry in Australia]

Good point Per, I’m so used to posting outside of SOHC builds lately I just forgot!

[spotty]

still no firm date on my return to civilisation, it all depends on the covid crap in a couple of ways

at the moment landlords can't kick tenants out and theres talk of extending that for quite some time to come, we can take the tenant to VCAT for a trib\unal determination but.....

she's also claiming mental distress re covid and some undefined personal situation so the outcome of a tribunal is by no means easily predicted. our argument is that one of the owners of the property wishes to re-occupy the property , it won't be being put back on the market for rental

she has been informed of our desire to re-occupy but apparently doesn't want to go

[Terry in Australia]

That's no good Spotty, does she not understand how I need garage space for excess motorcycles? Or have you been such a good landlord in the past that she just can't bear the thought of moving out? What if you tell her she can stay, but you're moving in too?

Anyway, while I wait for one of the mods to come along and move this to the SOHC4 build threads section, I'll take the opportunity to ruminate on a point made by Don, I think, about how your possessions can easily possess you. The only part of the Effing F2 that I probably can't use is the seat, which sadly is rusted beyond repair, or at least, isn't worth putting much effort in repairing, when there are still some half decent seats available on that great online 24/7/52/365 swap meet, that is Ebay USA.

Now I only needed a seat with a decent base and foam, as I have a new cover coming from Britain, so as much as I really wanted to buy the $350 bare seat (that was in immaculate condition, apparently due to it being removed from an F2 in the very early days when the bike's owner replaced it with an aftermarket American sofa) was a little more than I deemed appropriate.

$350 USD, plus $221.00 for postage, plus 10% for various government charges was a tad above my budget of close to zero, so I kept my "Buy it now" finger well away and continued to trawl thru until I found a tatty seat complete with ducktail and trim, for around one third of that price. Nowhere as nice, but that whole "Lipstick on a pig" thing is uppermost in my mind. It becomes a slippery slope. Buy one thing that looks really good, then the rest of the bike looks sh1t, and before you know it, you're out $10K and you've only got an effing F2 to show for it..............

But anyhoo, the slightly tatty seat is on it's way, and it'll suit the rest of the bike.

Terry's effing F2 seat. by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

There is quite a lot of surface rust on the chrome bits, probably due to it's proximity to the ocean, ass opposed to being left in the weather. If you remember my K2 "Swamp Rat" project last year, that bike had been left leaning against a shed in all seasons for 10 years, and it was just rotten.

Terry's frame kit install 1 May 2019 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

On the other hand, while not pampered in an airtight shipping container for the last 10 years, this bike is just looking tatty, with some corrosion and surface rust, as opposed to everything just rotten with rust. I took the chrome starter motor cover off late this afternoon and dropped it into my old bucket of phosphoric acid, and it'll be interesting to see how it comes out. If it looks OK, I'll pop the front fender off and drop it in, as it has some pretty nasty looking surface rust. Not deep, but not good either.

The round rocker arm adjustment covers are always a pain, and these were no different, but I wanted to take a couple off to see if there was any obvious rust or other carnage to be seen. These aftermarket finned covers won't be going back on, so after giving up trying with a 14mm spanner I took to them with my ancient pair of multigrips, and off they came, battered, but with no damage to the internal threads of the cam cover. I'm pretty sure I have some good NOS or repro covers somewhere, but if I don't, I will....... The good thing was everything looks very dry, but not rusty, so tomorrow I'll pump a litre of fresh oil in there to give everything a goodly coat, before I try cranking on the alternator rotor to break the pistons hold in the cylinders. Hopefully, there'll be some positive movement to report this time tomorrow night.........

Terry's new F2 2 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr
 

[andy750]

.... and apart from a diabolically annoying habit of breaking down whenever moisture came anywhere near it, it was a beautiful thing. I knew the problem was ignition related so I bought a complete new Dyna III ignition and Dyna coils and leads from Mike Beltrami, a member here back in the Greenspun days, and it ran perfectly, until it got wet. I never sorted it out, and by the time I'd bought a couple more CB750's from Spotty, plus a Suzuki GS1000 and a BMW R100RS, I sold it on "Sold.com" (Ebay Oz's predecessor) and the guy I sold it to in Sydney, told me that it drove him mad until he replaced the ignition switch, and all was good. .

The F2 I bought back in Scotland in 1993 had the same problem. Didnt stop me riding it for the next 6 years taking it down South when I moved to England and even a few trips to France. Never did solve the rain issue either even though I replaced everything ignition related including the ignition switch. Rain would make it stop but once dry it would run great again.

Looking forward to seeing what you do with your F2.2!

[spotty]

they're not the usual valve adjust finned covers, they look at least a bit more subtle than the usual, like the ones i gave you with the K7 of doom

[Bankerdanny]

 that seat you bought looks fine to me, and it has the side trim, which often goes missing from these bikes.

[seanbarney41]

+1 Terry....that seat side trim is impossible to find in good condition

[jaytee-nz]

Terry, I've just finished (and have now sold) an F2 semi-restoration as well, fitted with a K5 engine.
I had the same seat problem as you and like you, wasn't prepared to pay the large shipping costs to NZ.
When I was about to give in, another NZ forum member asked for some help with carbs and it turned out he had a excellent F2 seat (actually identical to your one in the picture) and so I swapped an incomplete set of carbs for his seat - job done !
Funny how the Universe works sometimes.

[Terry in Australia]

Thanks guys, I do enjoy reading your own personal experiences with these things, and I do love the "where fate steps in" stories. A quick one that I think of occasionally is how I acquired my second VTR1000R SP1. I am on an Aussie FB page and a guy called Boris told us all a story of misery about how he's collided with a Kangaroo @ 60(+) MPH, killing the 'roo, killing the bike, and almost killing himself in the process. He'd destroyed the front end, all of the plastics, and was selling everything from the tank back, including the engine, which was unmarked.

I asked him about the header pipes, aas my bike has a very rare 2 into 1 aftermarket pipe, and I thought it'd be nice to have the original 2 into 2's. I was negotiating the purchase of the pipes ($250) when for some reason I asked him how much he wanted for everything? He explained that because the SP1 wasn't insured he'd bought 2003 VTR1000F with a dead engine, and had hoped that the SP1 engine would fit, but of course, apart from a similar design, they're too entirely different engines, and nothing short of a major engineering exercise would work, so he needed a good VTR1000F engine.

Now just by sheer coincidence, I had a 2003 VTR1000F engine sitting under a tarp in my driveway, where it had been sitting since I had my 1998 VTR1000F that had dropped a couple of valves due to the dodgy Honda cam chain tensioners. (yes boys and girls, Honda occasionally fcuks up royally, and failed cam chain tensioners are the #1 killer of VTR1000F's, and also responsible for their very low resale value) I'd bought a 2003 VTR1000F that had been stolen/recovered, with only 10,000 miles on the clock, for 400 bucks, but all that was left was the frame and the engine. Anyway, I'd just taken the job in Canberra, and didn't have time to do an engine swap, so I just got Jeff at Ace motorcycles to fix the 1998 bike, and forgot about the spare engine.

I told Boris I had a good engine for him, and asked him how much more moola he wanted for the remains of the SP1, and he said, "How about 500 bucks? Woohoo! So I ended up with pretty much all of an SP1, sadly with a cracked frame and no plastics, but a great engine and enough of the "unobtainium" parts to do something with it, one day. I bought an American RC51 SP-1 frame for really cheap, and really cheap shipping (maybe 3-400 bucks all up) and a set of SP1 forks from Canada, and eventually I'll build a complete bike out of it all. Over here SP1/2's are becoming very collectable, so even in bits, it's a $5K(+) all day deal, so I'm pretty happy that just by sheer coincidence, we were able to make a deal, and I now own 2 x SP-1's.    

[Terry in Australia]

But I digress. Today was a red letter day for the "F2.2". (thanks Andy, I'll use that) The weather here in Melbourne has been all over the shop, freezing last weekend, wet earlier in the week, and finally today, quite sunny. As soon as I could sneak outside, I rolled the old beast into the driveway (being mindful that it has no brakes so being careful not to let it roll backwards into something valuable) and put it on the centrestand.

I dropped the oil out, to see what came out with it. I was very happy that all that came out was old black oil, with no cafe latte, a good sign. I'd tried putting it in gear and rocking it back and forth (I didn't want to try standing on the kick starter pedal lest I do some damage to the gearbox) with no luck at all, so I popped off the alternator cover and gear change assembly cover.

Terry’s Effing F2 unfreeze 27 Aug 2020 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

I have a nice long 1/2" drive cheater bar that I bought when I was pulling apart Subaru's, so I found a 19mm socket and put it on the alternator rotor Bolt. Of course the bolt is just standard right hand thread, so I could only turn the engine backwards, but I managed enough "righty tighty/lefty loosey" to eventually break them pistonas free, woohoo! The problem then, was that I could only turn the crankshaft about half a turn, and suddenly, "CLUNK" and I couldn't turn it further. Hmmnn, what could cause that? What about, a valve stuck open, colliding with a piston? Sounded er, sound, to me, so where to go now?

I know, take the cam cover off and see what's going on, yeah? But how do you take off the cam cover with the engine in the frame? It's a CB750 of course,, so you can't just pop  off the cam cover, UNLESS, you chop a section of the frame out. Well, it's not like I haven't done that before, so out came the angle grinder, and a few minutes of butchery later, I had the cam cover off.

Terry’s Effing F2 unfreeze 27 Aug 2020 2 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

First impressions of the top end was positive. No obvious damage to the cam or rockers, in fact it looked like new! I had a look at all of the valves, and none appeared to be stuck open, so could it have been that one was stuck closed? Easy to test, I just gave every valve a tap with my hammer, and surprise surprise, the exhaust valve on #4 was stuck closed! I turned the crank again, and this time, it spewed the ATF/Acetone mix out the exhaust port! All good!

   

Once I was happy that it was good up top, I poured a heap of fresh 50 weight oil over the cam and rocker assemblies and reinstalled the cam cover, alternator and gear change covers. I kicked it over a few more times, just for the hell of it.

I looked inside the tub of parts that came with it, and found the little tool boxy thing and decided to re-install it, as the original screws were in the tube, then looked at the grab-rail light bar thingie, it didn't look good.

Terry’s Effing F2 unfreeze 27 Aug 2020 3 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

The tail light lense was busted, and the rust fairies had been doing their thing inside the tail light.

Terry’s Effing F2 unfreeze 27 Aug 2020 5 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

As mentioned previously, Cliff (Maduncle here) had given me a tub of parts he'd removed from his F2 when he built his Cafe racer. I took a look in that tub and found a much nicer grab rail and tail light.

Terry’s Effing F2 unfreeze 27 Aug 2020 4 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

I also found the correct mounting bolts, so installed the grabrail, tail light and rear fender.

Terry’s Effing F2 unfreeze 27 Aug 2020 7 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

By this time it was getting dark, the wind had come up, and it was threatening rain, so I wheeled it back into the garage and cleaned up my mess, even tipping some old stale gas on the oil and gunge that it'd spewed all over the driveway, then hosed it off, grabbed a couple of bottles of Ginger Beer to celebrate, and came in for the night.

The weather over the next couple of days is supposed to be good, so with luck, I'll have it running, by Sunday. First I want to drop the oil pan and pump and give them both a clean, have a look inside the gearbox from underneath to see if there's any rust (haven't found any, anywhere so far, which is a good sign) disassemble and clean the clutch, and prime the pump so the oil will flow around the engine as soon as I hit the button.

After that, well, it'll probably sit for awhile, while I go back and finish my Kawasaki projects. I did order a new repro front master cylinder though, as I may have to take it for a ride shortly, just to test out the engine before I do anything else. I might just leave it as a rat, it's too early to tell, I'm just happy to know that the engine is no longer locked up! F2.2 is looking like it might have a little life left in it! More tomorrow.

Terry’s Effing F2 unfreeze 27 Aug 2020 6 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr 

[RAFster122s]

Great news for F2.2... glad it came together and the stash yielded some gems.

[PeWe]

I read you will remove pan, clean eventual slime, rats, spiders and debris out of it so pump can get oil, refill the tank so rest of engine will be lubricated.
Take pump apart too?

[Terry in Australia]

I read you will remove pan, clean eventual slime, rats, spiders and debris out of it so pump can get oil, refill the tank so rest of engine will be lubricated.
Take pump apart too?

Thanks Per, well it will depend on how much sludge is in the pan (the tank is empty) if it's not horrible, no rust in the gearbox or clutch evident, I'll just flush the pump with degreaser, then flush fresh oil though it, and call it good. Unlike the swamp rat, this bike hasn't been sitting with the carbs off for a long time, or even the exhaust for that matter, and Rob (I presume) stuffed oily rags into the inlet and exhaust ports, so not a drop of water has entered the system. Anyway, tomorrow the pan will come off, and we'll see how much sludge lies therein.

Anyhoo, I was busy today making another batch of home made Ginger Beer. I couldn't escape outside until late, but I did get a couple of things done. First I popped off the float bowls and was amazed at how clean the carbs were. I blew some compressed air through the various circuits and called it good. I'm unsure why it was so clean, but the tank is the same, any "F-er" will tell you that clean rust free F tanks are few and far between, but the inside of mine is immaculate. The air box was gone by the time I bought it, but I had an F airbox  on a shelf, so no biggie, I'll put the carbs on along with the airbox, the throttle cables that were still in place, and I'll borrow the choke cable and bracket from Spotty's K7 to get it all working again.

Terry’s Effing F2 works 28 Aug 2020 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

As it is, for some reason I have several sets of K7/8/F2 carbs kicking around, not that it matters as there are fine.

Terry’s Effing F2 works 28 Aug 2020 2 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

I needed an ignition. I usually store all my electrical gubbins in th one tub, but all I found were some points plates with the wires chopped off (Dyna conversions) so once again, I raided Spotty's K7 and stole the points plate and ignition advancer assembly. I assembled all that and "Guesstimated" the advance, and installed a nice(ish) points cover.

Terry’s Effing F2 works 28 Aug 2020 1 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

I found a sprocket cover to replace the missing one, even in about the same condition as the rest of the bike, a perfect match!

Terry’s Effing F2 works 28 Aug 2020 3 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

I was hoping to find a nice pair of coils, but didn't have much luck. I found one pair that possibly came with my K1 that I bought in bits last year, but there were only 3 plug wires, so found another coil with some dodgy wiring on it, but I have a vague suspicion that I have another set in another tub left over from the swamprat build last year, so tomorrow I'll go looking for it in the daylight. I found the twin horns in the box of parts Cliff gave me so I installed them, I found a right handlebar switch/throttle assembly (from the K1) which I'll use unless I can find something better. By this stage, it  was starting to get dark, so I packed up for the night, and I'll hit the ground running tomorrow. The last registration expired on August 31 2010, so my intent is to have it up and running again, byt August 31 2020. Wish me luck!

Terry’s Effing F2 works 28 Aug 2020 4 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

 

[Tintop]

Didn't realize this thread was started Terry, looks like a fun project.

[PeWe]

That bowl is cleaner than new!
Must have been cleaned after last use.

[Korven]

That is one rusty taillight.

[The Sovereign Man]

If you put the tail light and the carb bowl side-by-side no one would ever guess they came off the same bike.

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

Nice project. I hope it turns out to be your original F bike.  I am partial to the F fuel tanks over the Ks. 

Two RC51s!!  I still miss mine!