Author Topic: CB350F vs. CB400F  (Read 1340 times)

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Offline andyman

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CB350F vs. CB400F
« on: October 11, 2020, 07:48:45 am »
Hey guys!
So is there someone who has ridden both machines? What are the differences? 400Four much more power than the 350?

Greets Andy

Offline carnivorous chicken

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #1 on: October 11, 2020, 08:59:29 am »
I'm sure I am not the only one...

There is a noticeable difference, especially with the 6th gear. It's only 50ccs more but the extra gear does allow for faster cruising on the highway and slightly higher top speed. But in all honesty, we're also talking about an early 70s 350 and a mid 70s 400 so there isn't a ton of power to begin with.

The 400F, at least in 75 and 76, has a more "aggressive" stance with lower bars and set back pegs. And you'll find fans of the 350F's 4-4 as well as the 400F's 4-1, the first (IIRC) stock 4-1 set up.

I like the 350F styling a little better: cooler colors (candy bacchus olive!), a tank with knee dents, key under the tank and cleaner gauge cluster, painted fork ears/covers (the 400F headlight mount -- dunno what they were thinking).

It's a pretty easy switch to throw a 400F engine into a 350F frame, including the set back pegs. I wrote a post on this years ago.

But no matter how you slice it, I dig 'em both.

Offline andyman

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #2 on: October 11, 2020, 10:49:09 am »
Thanks for answering.

I am very interesting about the differently performance of the both bikes. There are 60cc and 3hp more and a 6th gear.....

Offline robvangulik

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #3 on: October 11, 2020, 11:27:10 am »
I had a 350F in '76-'77, and since 2008 I have a 400F. According to Honda there is a mere 5 hp between them, although looking inside I wouldn't know why the 400 could have more power than the 350, as those 60cc are the only real difference, camshaft, heads and valves are interchangeable and a gear extra makes no power in itself. Even so 32 or 37 hp (on the crank) would MAYBE be 3 more on the wheel.
A good 350 could easily be as fast as a mediocre 400

My present 400F has a 450 high compression kit, larger intake valves, a Webcam camshaft, flowed channels and carbs and a higher gearing and will outrun any standard cb500/550 if needed, where that sixth gear comes in very handy ;D

Offline andyman

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #4 on: October 11, 2020, 01:52:13 pm »
Hi!
The Cylinderhead and valves aren't identical, valves are a little bit bigger in the 400 engine. Camshaft is identical.

Offline robvangulik

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #5 on: October 11, 2020, 03:28:16 pm »
Oh really?
The original intake valves from my 400 have been running without problems in a 350 for the last 3 years.... :o

Offline andyman

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #6 on: October 11, 2020, 03:42:32 pm »
Yes the Inlet valves are 0,5mm and Exhaust 1mm bigger than the 350 valves

Offline Bodi

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #7 on: October 11, 2020, 07:40:18 pm »
They do feel different, but the ones I rode probably had oversize tires (everyone put bigger tires on in the 70s) and that has an effect on handling. The 350s felt more stable in general to me, the 400s cornered easily while the 350s had to be muscled into turns more.
The 6th gear is definitely missed going from one to the other.
Power is hard to judge, they are both fairly peppy (for their era) and the different gearing makes "seat of pants" power measurement difficult. I was faster in a timed distance on the 400 but not a lot faster (and a 350 twin would win every time).

Offline scottly

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #8 on: October 11, 2020, 08:51:09 pm »
The 400 has approximately 15% more displacement, with a corresponding 15% increase in power. 
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Offline jlh3rd

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #9 on: October 12, 2020, 04:37:47 am »
get a 350 twin, it's faster than the 350/4 and the 400....according to honda...

Offline Alaxy Galaxy

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #10 on: October 12, 2020, 05:01:38 am »
I had both a 350 twin and a 400/4 in around 2005. Both finely tuned. They both topped out a hair over 100mph. The 350 was quicker, easier to thrash around, sounded amazing when it hit the cams and felt lighter and more solid. I still always go back to 400s, though.

Offline carnivorous chicken

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #11 on: October 12, 2020, 05:50:17 am »
THe twins are quicker and lighter but will rattle your teeth out. The fours are waaaaay smoother. I like the look of the early (68, 69) twins, but the 350F is just a more beautiful bike IMHO. Supposedly the 350F was Soichiro Honda's favorite bike.

Offline Quattrocilindri

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #12 on: October 12, 2020, 05:53:19 am »
I had a blue 400F back in 1976. It had a few quirks: the 6-speed gearbox, with its short  pedal linkage, did not like to be shifted using the clutch, and preferred clutch-less upshifts with rev matching. The other was that, in the UK damp climate I was living in back then, it took a lot of cranking when cold before at least one cylinder would fire.

One day, after one starting failure, I opened the air box lid, and found the air filter partially submerged in water. After clearing the airbox drain and air drying the filter, all was great again. Aside from that, bike was enjoyable.

Roll forward to 2020, after 44 years, and I now have a 73 CB 350 four. I like it even more;  at least its styling is more classic than the spartan 400F, and the passenger accommodations are a little better for a (small) passenger, since the foot pegs have their own mounts instead of moving with the swing arm.
Of course, at 66, I am no longer weighing 125 lbs; I am 50 lbs heavier now, and the 350F seems a little slower than the 400. But I like the 350F even more, as performance has never been my top priority, anyway.
In short, both great machines usable at any age and experience level.

Offline jlh3rd

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #13 on: October 12, 2020, 06:14:32 am »
Id get a 350/4 or a 400 f over a 350 twin any time.....

Offline Bodi

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #14 on: October 12, 2020, 07:09:13 am »
I am not recommending the twin over the four! But in stock condition the twin is quicker...
The four was and is just cooler and more desirable in my opinion.
Personally I like the stying of the 400F over the 350-4.
The smoothness and sound of these fours over a twin is obvious but back then fours were very unusual, with few exceptions other bikes were singles or twins. With a 400F in the late 70s I remember lots of derisive comments about the sound, complexity, and engine weight from other bikers. There were countless other bikes with "better" qualities but the early fours, for me, combined styling, handling, smoothness, and power into a hard to beat package.

Offline jlh3rd

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #15 on: October 12, 2020, 09:02:51 am »
70's Honda four's are timeless......

Offline Gordon

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #16 on: October 12, 2020, 02:28:57 pm »
About 17 years ago I had a '73 350F and a '75 400F at the same time.  They were both in very good mechanical condition, and there was definitely a noticeable difference between the two. 

The 350, while perfectly capable on the highway, felt much more at home just cruising around town or maybe on some mild back-road twisties.  It was a very comfortable ride and mild-mannered.  It was a great date bike, and my (now) wife and I went out on it a lot.

The 400 WANTED to go fast.  I'm sure it had as much to do with the more aggressive riding stance, but it definitely accelerated faster, it took fast twisties more readily, and it absolutely screamed the best note I've heard any motorcycle make at WOT in 6th gear. 

They are both fantastic bikes and built on the same platform, but they have very different spirits.     

Offline Erwin83

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #17 on: October 13, 2020, 06:34:58 am »
I have both (engines):
- a CB350f with the 4-1 exhaust of a 400, and
- a CB400f (big bored to 466cc) with a 4-4 exhaust (in a CB350f frame).

The 400 engine (especially with the big bore, obviously) makes noticeably more speed with less effort. I would say the biggest power results are to be found in a better mid-range power delivery, and the different gearing of the 6 speed 'box.

Still... to modern standards these are slow bikes, so I'm not too bothered by their performance.
The 4 tiny cylinders with old fashioned noisy exhausts make it sound fast anyways, that's what counts.
CB466f

Offline Trevor from Warragul

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #18 on: October 13, 2020, 06:41:26 am »
When I bought my 350F over thirty years ago, it was considered a "lemon".  I even had a Honda spare parts guy snort at my choice and say "They're all revs and no action".  Fair enough, because it was heavier and slower than the 350 twin.  Fast forward to today, and the callow eighteen year old who derided the bike is now hitting fifty.  They don't want or need a quick bike, something to tootle around on will do, and the 350F sure is pretty... 
1971 Kawasaki H1A
1972 Honda CB350F
1976 Moto Morini 3 1/2 Sport
1978 Honda CBX
1997 Suzuki Bandit 1200
1999 Ducati Monster 750

Offline Hurstman1972

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #19 on: October 13, 2020, 08:50:50 am »
IMO, the 350F checked all the boxes for the styling cues of its day - straight saddle, classic tank profile, spoke wheels, a comfortable (upright) riding position, and enough chrome to be showy, just not tacky. Fast? not really, but plenty fast enough- as long as I stayed off the interstates! I've ridden the mtns of NC/TN/GA on mine with no issues and it always garnered more attention than the way faster, newer bikes of my riding buddies. If I had to ding it for something, it would be slightly twitchy handling, probably due to its short wheelbase.

Offline carnivorous chicken

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #20 on: October 13, 2020, 02:08:50 pm »
Whoa Hurstman, what's in the garage?

My buddy Trev owns the 1 of 1 1970 Chrysler 300 Hurst convertible. Amazing car.

Back to the 350s -- I kept up with two less experienced riders on modern Triumphs in some twisties, just keeping the revs up and throwing it around. Yes, they could have smoked me if they were better riders, but keeping that thing above 8k rpm and taking turns low is a blast.

Offline Gordon

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #21 on: October 13, 2020, 03:08:45 pm »
Whoa Hurstman, what's in the garage?

My buddy Trev owns the 1 of 1 1970 Chrysler 300 Hurst convertible. Amazing car.

Back to the 350s -- I kept up with two less experienced riders on modern Triumphs in some twisties, just keeping the revs up and throwing it around. Yes, they could have smoked me if they were better riders, but keeping that thing above 8k rpm and taking turns low is a blast.

I used to ride with an old dude who showed up on his vintage Lambretta scooter one time to canyon carve with a bunch of us on much bigger, faster bikes.  He was nice enough to wait for us at the bottom while we all caught up.  ;D

Offline Hurstman1972

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Re: CB350F vs. CB400F
« Reply #22 on: October 13, 2020, 06:09:31 pm »
Whoa Hurstman, what's in the garage?

My buddy Trev owns the 1 of 1 1970 Chrysler 300 Hurst convertible. Amazing car.

Back to the 350s -- I kept up with two less experienced riders on modern Triumphs in some twisties, just keeping the revs up and throwing it around. Yes, they could have smoked me if they were better riders, but keeping that thing above 8k rpm and taking turns low is a blast.

1972 Hurst/Olds. owned since 1981, aka the “other woman”! Ha! Besides a ‘74 350F, it’s other stablemates are a ‘70 CB100, a ‘15 KLR650, and a ‘78 KZ1000. Ride on!