Author Topic: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects  (Read 26383 times)

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Offline Terry in Australia

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #325 on: December 17, 2021, 03:01:13 PM »
And ulgee

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And that's a good thing mate, less chance of me getting kidnapped than you "pretty boys"........ ;D
I was feeling sorry for myself because I couldn't afford new bike boots, until I met a man with no legs.

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Offline carnivorous chicken

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #326 on: December 17, 2021, 04:00:27 PM »
We also have the government mandated "No Jab, No job" rule here, which I don't really understand, I'm fully vaccinated but I know I can still be a carrier even if I don't get very sick, so it wouldn't worry me if I had to work with someone who wasn't vaccinated as there is just as much chance of me giving them covid as them giving it to me? I guess it's just the government's way of getting everyone vaccinated. Strange days indeed....... ;D   

Sorry to hear about your loss. In the early days of Covid I remember so many people saying they don't know anyone who's had it or died. Not really the case these days, after nearly two years. In the US, it's killed nearly one out of every 400 people.

In Mexico City the vaccination rate is (nominally) above 90% as well, and we are doing boosters. Things have been returning to normal but we'll see if that lasts.

But regarding vax requirements and work, while it is possible to get and transmit the virus if vaccinated, vaccinated people clear their virus load much quicker and therefore are contagious for less time (and of course don't suffer death and hospitalization at anywhere near the rates of unvaccinated people). So requiring vaccinations slows or prevents the spread of Covid as well, even if not 100%.

Offline Terry in Australia

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #327 on: December 17, 2021, 04:19:45 PM »
Yep, that is scary mate, I guess we've been lucky with only 2100 deaths, that equates to 1 in 12,000. 
I was feeling sorry for myself because I couldn't afford new bike boots, until I met a man with no legs.

So I said, "Hey mate, you haven't got any bike boots you don't need, do you?"

"Crazy is a very misunderstood term, it's a fine line that some of us can lean over and still keep our balance" (thanks RB550Four)

Offline RAFster122s

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #328 on: December 17, 2021, 04:31:06 PM »
Within the US the bulk of the deaths have been in those over 65 and a very high percentage of those numbers being over 75.
The older you are or if you have other significant health risks for this disease, then your risks are higher.

Odd statistics is those over 100 often do not have severe case of Covid or they recover… heard that observation was coming out of all this being reported over 6 months ago.


Have you realized that 2022 is pronounced 2020 too…??
David- back in the desert SW!

Offline Terry in Australia

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #329 on: December 17, 2021, 04:38:43 PM »
Within the US the bulk of the deaths have been in those over 65 and a very high percentage of those numbers being over 75.
The older you are or if you have other significant health risks for this disease, then your risks are higher.

Odd statistics is those over 100 often do not have severe case of Covid or they recover… heard that observation was coming out of all this being reported over 6 months ago.


Have you realized that 2022 is pronounced 2020 too…??

Same here David, due to one massive cock-up by our state government last year, it spread thru several old folks homes and killed 800 oldies over only a month or so. Makes sense, any virus or disease will affect oldies whose immune systems are weakening as they get older. Not sure about the over 100's here though, there are so few of them.

I was eating some Edam cheese yesterday and my wife told me that it's made backwards? No idea how they do that? ;D 
I was feeling sorry for myself because I couldn't afford new bike boots, until I met a man with no legs.

So I said, "Hey mate, you haven't got any bike boots you don't need, do you?"

"Crazy is a very misunderstood term, it's a fine line that some of us can lean over and still keep our balance" (thanks RB550Four)

Offline BenelliSEI

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #330 on: December 17, 2021, 06:48:17 PM »
I was eating some Edam cheese yesterday and my wife told me that it's made backwards? No idea how they do that? ;D

Took me a minute, but I figured it out.....  ;)

Offline Don R

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #331 on: December 17, 2021, 08:24:28 PM »
Within the US the bulk of the deaths have been in those over 65 and a very high percentage of those numbers being over 75.
The older you are or if you have other significant health risks for this disease, then your risks are higher.

Odd statistics is those over 100 often do not have severe case of Covid or they recover… heard that observation was coming out of all this being reported over 6 months ago.

 The statistics will say anything if you torture them long enough. But maybe those 100+ year old folks already have some immunity from some obscure epidemic long ago.
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Offline jlh3rd

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #332 on: December 18, 2021, 06:59:36 AM »
We also have the government mandated "No Jab, No job" rule here, which I don't really understand, I'm fully vaccinated but I know I can still be a carrier even if I don't get very sick, so it wouldn't worry me if I had to work with someone who wasn't vaccinated as there is just as much chance of me giving them covid as them giving it to me? I guess it's just the government's way of getting everyone vaccinated. Strange days indeed....... ;D   

Sorry to hear about your loss. In the early days of Covid I remember so many people saying they don't know anyone who's had it or died. Not really the case these days, after nearly two years. In the US, it's killed nearly one out of every 400 people.

In Mexico City the vaccination rate is (nominally) above 90% as well, and we are doing boosters. Things have been returning to normal but we'll see if that lasts.

But regarding vax requirements and work, while it is possible to get and transmit the virus if vaccinated, vaccinated people clear their virus load much quicker and therefore are contagious for less time (and of course don't suffer death and hospitalization at anywhere near the rates of unvaccinated people). So requiring vaccinations slows or prevents the spread of Covid as well, even if not 100%.

your math is wrong...and misleading.  That 1/400 is for two years. 330 million people divided by almost 800,000 deaths. Yeah, you get OMG 1/400....except that it's one in 800 in actuality, per year so far.
You can't keep totaling up the death count which can rise every year until eternity and using that number to divide the same 330 million by....eventually you get to a 100% mortality rate!.......I'm assuming you just didn't realize what you were doing.
    Now, even 1/800 sounds horrible, and it is, especially if it's someone you know. But it's wrong to twist numbers to fit a narrative....and none of us get off this planet alive.....so...
     According to John Hopkins, there were 385,363 deaths in 2020, and 2021 is at 405,405....horrible...but..
Using 2021 that is approximately 0.12% of the pop. ...
      (why is there more in 2021 ..with a "vaccine " than in 2020 that had no shot....hint - it ain't a vaccine)
However, according to Hopkins, the actual death rate/case is 1.6% , USA....that means you have a 98.4% survivability rate...sounds a whole lot better than 1/400, doesn't it...... and no matter how much you praise Mexico, it's at 7.6%......vaccine and all, right?
        You brought up numbers, not me. Numbers don't mean squat when it's personal....I understand that....some don't......And I can't speak for others who don't care to check things out on their own and just follow a crowd. But I couldn't let the sky is falling comment stand.....
       
« Last Edit: December 18, 2021, 07:09:44 AM by jlh3rd »

Offline jlh3rd

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #333 on: December 18, 2021, 07:12:38 AM »
and don't come back at me with personal bs.......we have different views...you're not changing me and Im not changing you......

Offline jlh3rd

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #334 on: December 18, 2021, 07:29:30 AM »
and sense we're throwing numbers around....check this out....hmm, almost 1/800.......just saying....numbers, right?
.....nothing to do with the wuhan virus.....just numbers.....

Offline ofreen

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #335 on: December 18, 2021, 11:22:31 AM »
and sense we're throwing numbers around....check this out....hmm, almost 1/800.......just saying....numbers, right?
.....nothing to do with the wuhan virus.....just numbers.....

You mean we are all going to die sometime of something?  Scary thought. The government needs to get on this right now.  :D
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Offline carnivorous chicken

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #336 on: December 18, 2021, 12:03:52 PM »
and sense we're throwing numbers around....check this out....hmm, almost 1/800.......just saying....numbers, right?
.....nothing to do with the wuhan virus.....just numbers.....

None of those things listed is contagious, which should be an obvious point. Unless your point is "everybody is going to die, so we should not do things that reduce the likelihood of death."

Regarding the number of dead, it is a lot more complicated than you present, and you can't simply divide the number by two. You'd have to create a formula for average rate of death (in any given population a certain percent will die) and increased rate of death over the same time period, for a start. Yes, some of those people who died of Covid would have died of something else anyway within 2 years. Regardless, some people don't believe the scientific consensus, some don't believe vaccination actually helps (this is demonstrable, if you want to look it up: unvaccinated are infected at 5 times the rate of vaccinated, and die at 13 times the rate), some don't believe taking precautions help (this is demonstrable as well), and apparently some people believe that taking precautions is the same thing as claiming that the sky is falling or "following a crowd" -- if the crowd is medical doctors, epidemiologists, and other specialists, I am happy to follow.

Comparing countries' survivability rates without an explanation of underlying conditions (poverty, lack of medical facilities, etc.) also doesn't make sense, nor does linking an overall death toll to that rate. 800,000 Americans have died of Covid, and while some people want to minimize that or argue that precautions don't work that's their prerogative. "It's not 1 in 400, it's one in 800! No big deal." The United States continues to lead the world in Covid deaths; India, a very poor country, has 4 times the population and just over half the death toll. Some people may choose to believe that willful disregard of caution plays no role in the USA's absolutely insane Covid numbers, but I'm not one of them.

Not trying to change your mind -- people with completely different epistemological bases can't see eye to eye. But I'll go with science.

Offline BenelliSEI

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #337 on: December 18, 2021, 12:16:18 PM »
+1 to all of the above. Rational, well thought and well stated. I like to improve the odds; that’s why I bought a good helmet and wear the gear......

Offline ofreen

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #338 on: December 18, 2021, 12:28:10 PM »
The United States continues to lead the world in Covid deaths; India, a very poor country, has 4 times the population and just over half the death toll.

Assuming your India statistic is an accurate representation, that by itself would make me skeptical of the U.S. number.  But carry on...
Greg
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Offline PeWe

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #339 on: December 18, 2021, 12:31:57 PM »
You'll get a better life on a Honda as long as it last! ;D
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Offline goodtryer

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #340 on: December 18, 2021, 12:46:51 PM »
Quote
Regarding the number of dead, it is a lot more complicated than you present, and you can't simply divide the number by two. You'd have to create a formula for average rate of death (in any given population a certain percent will die) and increased rate of death over the same time period, for a start.

Gosh, perfesser, that's sounds really complicated and scientific.

Looking forward to you showing your work. Wouldn't want people thinking you were just making up... stuff.
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Offline carnivorous chicken

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #341 on: December 18, 2021, 01:27:45 PM »
Perhaps the skeptics should start a different thread, and this one can return to people who trust science and want to share information on vaccination and side effects. Reliable scientific data and information on Covid is widely available. You can lead a horse to water...

Offline goodtryer

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #342 on: December 18, 2021, 02:15:02 PM »
Perhaps the skeptics should start a different thread, and this one can return to people who trust science and want to share information on vaccination and side effects. Reliable scientific data and information on Covid is widely available. You can lead a horse to water...

So surprised.
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Offline jlh3rd

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #343 on: December 18, 2021, 02:28:11 PM »
and sense we're throwing numbers around....check this out....hmm, almost 1/800.......just saying....numbers, right?
.....nothing to do with the wuhan virus.....just numbers.....

None of those things listed is contagious, which should be an obvious point. Unless your point is "everybody is going to die, so we should not do things that reduce the likelihood of death."

Regarding the number of dead, it is a lot more complicated than you present, and you can't simply divide the number by two. You'd have to create a formula for average rate of death (in any given population a certain percent will die) and increased rate of death over the same time period, for a start. Yes, some of those people who died of Covid would have died of something else anyway within 2 years. Regardless, some people don't believe the scientific consensus, some don't believe vaccination actually helps (this is demonstrable, if you want to look it up: unvaccinated are infected at 5 times the rate of vaccinated, and die at 13 times the rate), some don't believe taking precautions help (this is demonstrable as well), and apparently some people believe that taking precautions is the same thing as claiming that the sky is falling or "following a crowd" -- if the crowd is medical doctors, epidemiologists, and other specialists, I am happy to follow.

Comparing countries' survivability rates without an explanation of underlying conditions (poverty, lack of medical facilities, etc.) also doesn't make sense, nor does linking an overall death toll to that rate. 800,000 Americans have died of Covid, and while some people want to minimize that or argue that precautions don't work that's their prerogative. "It's not 1 in 400, it's one in 800! No big deal." The United States continues to lead the world in Covid deaths; India, a very poor country, has 4 times the population and just over half the death toll. Some people may choose to believe that willful disregard of caution plays no role in the USA's absolutely insane Covid numbers, but I'm not one of them.

Not trying to change your mind -- people with completely different epistemological bases can't see eye to eye. But I'll go with science.

If you read all I said you'd see I made light of nothing. It is not more complicated than what I posted , where it gets complicated are all the sub categories, numerous underlying conditions, and other convoluted rationalizations conjured up to push an agenda...You project your "sources" as the only facts. I could spend hours researching counter claims and not from the conspiracy corners. And then spend hours on here...im not doing that......In no way do I trust cdc...fauci...or other sources as to " their" truth.
    So it boils  down to who's "science "is factual.......
Actually, John Hopkins is as neutral as one can get, and I just happened to stumble on it, so i used it.
The whole point of all this is not an argument as to pro/con shot or no shot, contagious/ not contagious, protecting oneself/ or not, ..works/ doesn't work...it's about choice and who tries to shame who into submission with the sky is falling...again......That's not right.
   If someone is scared about an unmasked person walking down a street...then stay home...
     The whole point about 2018 and the 1/800 is just to show it , surprisingly, is common and a general norm.
      1/400 was not correct, that's what caused my response....



Offline jlh3rd

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #344 on: December 18, 2021, 02:43:33 PM »
+1 to all of the above. Rational, well thought and well stated. I like to improve the odds; that’s why I bought a good helmet and wear the gear......

your choice on the gear, right?
How proud you must be of the intimidation and manhandling by your police force concerning some pastors and their incarceration for having services for their congregation.
You can keep canada.
« Last Edit: December 18, 2021, 02:45:47 PM by jlh3rd »

Offline goodtryer

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #345 on: December 18, 2021, 03:20:00 PM »
+1 to all of the above. Rational, well thought and well stated. I like to improve the odds; that’s why I bought a good helmet and wear the gear......

your choice on the gear, right?
How proud you must be of the intimidation and manhandling by your police force concerning some pastors and their incarceration for having services for their congregation.
You can keep canada.

Indeed, one could really improve the odds by not participating in such dangerous behavior as riding a motorcycle. Only someone who ignores the science would make a decision for themselves. Surely we should all ask permission from those who only want what is best for us.
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Offline ekpent

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #346 on: December 18, 2021, 03:41:51 PM »
 Is there still any Covid left doing its thing in China where this whole thing started ? Odd that we never hear anything on the news about that. Sure hear enough about all the other countries in the world. Odd ------------

Offline jlh3rd

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #347 on: December 18, 2021, 03:55:47 PM »
Is there still any Covid left doing its thing in China where this whole thing started ? Odd that we never hear anything on the news about that. Sure hear enough about all the other countries in the world. Odd ------------

yep.....but see, this is the problem on this forum and the rules, we can't go past a certain point without digression to the political. That's not a complaint, BTW.
   Sad, ....the party at fault, with possibly unintended help from certain factions, gets to sit back and watch us go at each other.......

Offline goodtryer

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #348 on: December 18, 2021, 03:58:03 PM »
Is there still any Covid left doing its thing in China where this whole thing started ? Odd that we never hear anything on the news about that. Sure hear enough about all the other countries in the world. Odd ------------

Looks like they've cured it. Probably using some of that science we keep hearing about.

I'll bet they won't show their work either.

"Tolerance will reach such a level that intelligent people will be banned from thinking so as not to offend the imbeciles."
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Offline Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er

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Re: COVID vaccine - Who has received - provide details and side effects
« Reply #349 on: December 18, 2021, 06:02:44 PM »
Is there still any Covid left doing its thing in China where this whole thing started ? Odd that we never hear anything on the news about that. Sure hear enough about all the other countries in the world. Odd ------------

yep.....but see, this is the problem on this forum and the rules, we can't go past a certain point without digression to the political. That's not a complaint, BTW.
   Sad, ....the party at fault, with possibly unintended help from certain factions, gets to sit back and watch us go at each other.......

Jlh3rd et al, I believe and respect in the right to your thoughts and ideas but.....

PLEASE RESPECT THE TITLE OF THIS TOPIC. This was never intended to be a political issue as viruses do not see party color. They just see hosts.

If you want to go off topic please start a different thread. We will respect whatever you decide to do with a new thread. At least I HOPE that would be the case. We are all entitled to our opinions of the facts as presented and everyone should respect that. I just hope for your continued good health as I do for all.

Jerry
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