Topic: Terry's Half Arsed Fake K0 K2 Rat bike project.

[Terry in Australia]

OK, so this was never gonna be a project. A couple of weeks ago I saw a CB750 on Ebay Oz that was supposedly a K0 frame, with K1/2 parts, and a K2 engine. I contacted the dealer, who gave me the frame number (1015XXXX) so I took him at his word, and offered him 600 bucks less than his asking price, which he accepted. Bonus!

I'd dealt with him before when I bought the F2, and while he hadn't mentioned some of the more glaring faults, it was cheap enough, so I bought it. By sheer coincidence, James H here contacted me and said that he had a set of 1016XXXX K0 cases he'd sell me cheap, plus a head and some cylinders. Brilliant! I'd intended to use a cheap transport company who moved my rolling K0 chassis from Brisbane to Melbourne for only $160, but the seller rang me to say he' put it on a trailer (even though I didn't ask him to) and the cost would be $350. Oh well, it saved me a job, I suppose.....

A week later, on my 61st birthday a sh1tty old truck arrived outside my house with a trailer in tow. The driver was probably the most disorganised person I'd ever met, and I had to help him completely unload his rented trailer to get my bike out, that had a new dent on top of the tank, probably from where he'd been walking on it. Anyway, I gave him his 350 bucks and helped him repack his trailer, and as it was my birthday, he gave me a can of beer that looked like he'd driven over it in his truck, but as I was already drunk (he was 2 hours late) I gratefully received it, and drank it in one swig. It was dark, so I wheeled it into the patio and had a quick look before retiring for the night.

K0 Bitsa K2 Bitsa Friday 12 Mar 2021 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

Next morning I wheeled it out into the sun and took a closer look. The seat wasn't actually attached, it appears to be a NOS "Saddlemen" seat, as ugly as a Rottweiler sucking on a lemon, but surprisingly comfy.

K0 Bitsa K2 Bitsa Friday 12 Mar 2021 6 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

Regardless, it wasn't staying. When I lifted it off and looked at the frame, my heart sank. One of the easiest "Telltales" on a K0 is that the cross brace on the frame behind the battery box is solid, it doesn't have a hole stamped in it like every other CB750. This frame had the hole.

Dodgy K0 frame number 1 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

Fcuk. I double checked the frame number, and although it was the correct K0 number and the correct Honda script, it was sitting too low on the steering head.

Dodgy K0 frame number by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

By comparison, here's the number on my K2, in the same position as my real K0.

Dodgy K0 frame number 2 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

I sent the seller a text, and a couple of days later he replied saying that he'd accept my judgement, and offered me a 500 dollar refund. Hmmnn, well, better than nothing I guess. I contacted a guy I knew here to see if he had a K2 frame and told him the story. He's a K0 guy, and he laughed and told me that he'd told the seller that the "K0" was a fake a couple of days before he sold it to me. What a turd...... Anyway, my mate sold me a good frame for 500 bucks, plus the shipping from Brisbane. ($115) The intent was to put the K2 engine in the dodgy frame in a K2 frame and use the bike I build out of it to do a part trade for a Harley Heritage Softail with another mate.

That night, my mate Fred who was also aware I was looking for a K2 frame rang me to say a guy in far north Queensland (1400 miles away) had a K2 for sale for $1500. I found the ad, contacted him and said I'd transfer the money now, and organise transport. He rang me right back and said, "Sold! So now I have 2 K2 frames, 2 K2 engines, and enough parts to build 2 K2's, plus my K1. Sweet. Bottom line is, I didn't want to strip this bike for parts, but rather, build another 1970's themed "Rat" using as many of the parts as I can. I can't use the frame because, well, it's bogus, but I'll transfer everything across to another frame, and build something interesting out of it, once I've built the K2 for Dion, so I can have his Harley.

Funds are getting tight (I've just bought a set of K0 carbs from James for my K2 bitsa, because I love the light throttle pull of my K0) plus a new Kokusan ignition and K&N filter, but luckily Spotty came along with a cunning plan to buy his K7 back from me, which will free up some cash for more parts buying. I also sold Clay, the guy I bought the K2 frame from, my wrinkle tank, which pretty much paid for the transport of the newest K2 and the K2 frame, so things are kind of looking up. More tomorrow.

K0 Bitsa K2 Bitsa Friday 12 Mar 2021 9b by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

 

[PeWe]

Good Luck with the build Terry!
That frame number will not pass vehicle inspection when it look home made, right?

Not Honda specific stamps and different forces when stamped.

[BPellerine]

kinda sucks terry,but you will not have to hunt for ko parts

[PeWe]

An extra frame can be useful if you find a frame with historical important number you need to decaf.

[newday777]

Good Luck with the build Terry!
That frame number will not pass vehicle inspection when it look home made, right?

Not Honda specific stamps and different forces when stamped.

It might have been a dealer stamped replacement frame.

[Terry in Australia]

Good Luck with the build Terry!
That frame number will not pass vehicle inspection when it look home made, right?

Not Honda specific stamps and different forces when stamped.

It might have been a dealer stamped replacement frame.

Hmmnn, that’s a possibility I suppose, I guess I’ll find out once I strip it down and clean the paint off. I’ve seen restamped frames and cases, but not in the correct Honda font like this one. Regardless, everything else is K1 except the gauges and idiot lights, so I doubt it.

[WhyNot2]

wow......just wow......you got all those bikes, and running at that, and here all i have is 1 750, and can't get it running at all.

Nice, can't wait to see where this one goes......gotta get out there and yank those carbs again.

Bought some new berryman juice, so some soaking and cleaning and these 80 bux worth of gasket. We'll see, course it'll take me a month.

[Terry in Australia]

Ha ha, you'll get there mate! Make sure you strip the carbs right down, i.e., remove the jets, fuel mixture screws, everything! If you've got an air compressor, make sure you blow through every orifice and confirm that what goes in one end comes out another, then reassemble everything paying close attention to the mixture screw adjustment, float heights etc, try "bench synching" them using a piece of wire as a "gauge" to ensure all the slides are set at the correct height, and make sure the rubber insulators are all soft and not cracked, and they have to be good.

[Terry in Australia]

And I have to correct myself, the stamps used on the "fake" frame number are similar, but not the same as the standard Honda font. Not that it makes any difference, the seller made sure he didn't send me any pics of the frame number so I wouldn't have known until it arrived. Oh well, I kinda like it, so no biggie........

[BenelliSEI]

Terry...... I sure you’ll turn “a sow’s ear into a silk purse”, as usual!! I will be curious to see what you find on that headstock, when you clear away the paint above the stamped VIN number.

Last one I had that was “suspicious” had been smoothed over with nickel bronze and a file...... Lesson learned. I turned the bottom half of the frame into a lovely engine cart for the shop, and used the side stand bracket on the Rickman CR......

[Terry in Australia]

So moving along as chronologically as I can, once my heart healed and I realised that one of the benefits of not owning a second K0 is that I don't have to spend ridiculous amounts of money on crappy used K0 parts (not talking about the stuff James offered me, he was very generous, thanks mate!) so my thoughts turned to actually starting the bike up and taking it for a lap.

Well the first problem was that the seat wasn't actually attached to the bike, and the tank had no cap or petcock, and the rubber mount at the rear was missing, so the seller had secured the tank to the bike with a cable tie. I cut the cable tie and removed the tank, and noticed this.

K0 Friday 19 Mar 2021 1 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

Yep, the bike that he'd advertised as "Runs Great" had a set of coils off a later model bike (which wasn't an issue) but the plug leads were so short they only reached 2 of the 4 spark plugs. Maybe "Runs great on two cylinders" would have been more accurate? Well I'd just removed the coils from my K2 bitsa, so I installed them, replaced the rotten fuel lines and routed them correctly, put the custom painted tank (which has a pinhole about halfway up, but is fine with just a little fuel down low) on, found a good used rubber rear mount, found a better seat and after searching through all my tubs found a K1 seat latch and hinges, and properly mounted the seat. The front master cylinder was also seized solid, so I removed it to rebuild at a later date, and installed an Ebay cheapie.

I stole the battery out of the Effing F2 and connected it up, turned on the gas, hit the button, and...... nothing. I took the tank back off and found that one of the wires from the ignition switch had fallen out of an aftermarket crimp connector, so I re-crimped it, put the tank back on, and even though the battery didn't have enough gumption to crank the engine, it fired up after the first or second kick.

   

[Terry in Australia]

Terry...... I sure you’ll turn “a sow’s ear into a silk purse”, as usual!! I will be curious to see what you find on that headstock, when you clear away the paint above the stamped VIN number.

Last one I had that was “suspicious” had been smoothed over with nickel bronze and a file...... Lesson learned. I turned the bottom half of the frame into a lovely engine cart for the shop, and used the side stand bracket on the Rickman CR......

Thanks John, yeah, sadly the frame is only good for parts, but my only other K1 frame has a broken lug for the passenger footpeg and someone's drilled a couple of extra holes in the frame, so it'll come in handy for parts. No biggie, I have an angle grinder and a welder, and my welds are no worse than Honda's were back then! While I've got you, my K1 frame number is 112XXXX and I'm really looking for a K1 frame in the 106XXXX region, so if you have one (or even the steering head........) let me know?

[Terry in Australia]

OK, so I installed the new MC, got the engine running nice, and thought I'd take it for a lap. I fired it up and grabbed the front brake so I could pull the clutch and pop it into 1st gear, and immediately started rolling backwards down the driveway. WTF? I had great lever pressure, just no front brake. OK, it had to be a blocked line or a frozen brake caliper piston. I decided to explore the caliper first:

The piston was badly pitted and the little domed "Hat" that allows the pad to self align with the rotor wasn't even there, so I found the piston from my K0 caliper rebuild, that was in much better shape, along with a new seal and "hat". The pads looked a bit odd.

Fake K0 tinkering 21 Mar 2021 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

I couldn't see much value in having a pad with a reduced surface area, God knows these things don't stop all that well with standard pads, so as there was plenty of meat on them, I put them in my lathe and machined them square and back to full width again.

Fake K0 tinkering 21 Mar 2021 1 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

Fake K0 tinkering 21 Mar 2021 2 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

I reassembled the caliper, used some acetone to clean the disc rotor, and called it good. Whilst all this was going on I'd determined that it was the top brake hose that was blocked, so found a good used hose in a tub in my garage and installed it, then bled the brakes.

Fake K0 tinkering 21 Mar 2021 4 by Terry Prendergast, on Flickr

The rain slowed, so I rode it up and down the driveway, and apart from the noise, (no baffles) it went well. More on my absolute PITA  half-arsed baffle fix tomorrow.

[PeWe]

You need to describe all your CB750's with names and status
4, 5 or 6?
1x F2
2x K0 (1 real + 1 fake)
K2. Really only one?

I do not remember which you sold and not.

[Terry in Australia]

You need to describe all your CB750's with names and status
4, 5 or 6?
1x F2
2x K0 (1 real + 1 fake)
K2. Really only one?

I do not remember which you sold and not.

Ha ha, OK, current bikes in my garage as follows:

1970 K0 (my favourite)
1971 K1 (in pieces)
1971 K0 (fake, the featured one in this thread)
1972 K2 Bitsa (with recently rebuilt engine)
1972 K2 (to be delivered in the next two weeks, floods permitting)
1977(?) K7 (at Spotty's place, Spotty is buying it back)
1978 F2.

So, there's 7 CB750's that are more or less complete, but I also have another K2 frame coming down from Brisbane to build into a complete bike using parts from the "Fake K0" to build a rat. That still leaves several engines and frames around the place, but may or may not ever be built into bikes, I might just keep them for parts.
 

[BenelliSEI]

Terry...... I sure you’ll turn “a sow’s ear into a silk purse”, as usual!! I will be curious to see what you find on that headstock, when you clear away the paint above the stamped VIN number.

Last one I had that was “suspicious” had been smoothed over with nickel bronze and a file...... Lesson learned. I turned the bottom half of the frame into a lovely engine cart for the shop, and used the side stand bracket on the Rickman CR......

Thanks John, yeah, sadly the frame is only good for parts, but my only other K1 frame has a broken lug for the passenger footpeg and someone's drilled a couple of extra holes in the frame, so it'll come in handy for parts. No biggie, I have an angle grinder and a welder, and my welds are no worse than Honda's were back then! While I've got you, my K1 frame number is 112XXXX and I'm really looking for a K1 frame in the 106XXXX region, so if you have one (or even the steering head........) let me know?

Terry..... I have no frames left (and proud of it). K0/K1’s Getting very scarce around here. I will check around. John D..

[PeWe]

You need to describe all your CB750's with names and status
4, 5 or 6?
1x F2
2x K0 (1 real + 1 fake)
K2. Really only one?

I do not remember which you sold and not.

Ha ha, OK, current bikes in my garage as follows:

1970 K0 (my favourite)
1971 K1 (in pieces)
1971 K0 (fake, the featured one in this thread)
1972 K2 Bitsa (with recently rebuilt engine)
1972 K2 (to be delivered in the next two weeks, floods permitting)
1977(?) K7 (at Spotty's place, Spotty is buying it back)
1978 F2.

So, there's 7 CB750's that are more or less complete, but I also have another K2 frame coming down from Brisbane to build into a complete bike using parts from the "Fake K0" to build a rat. That still leaves several engines and frames around the place, but may or may not ever be built into bikes, I might just keep them for parts.

You need 73, 74, 75, 76 for a straight flush!
With a 69, a royal!!   

[BenelliSEI]

Terry...... checked around with “the usual suspects”, in my area. Closest bare frame i found is CB750-2018304. A K2, I think? Bare, with centre stand, no swing arm. Guy said he’d give it to me, if I lace him a couple of wheels. Been thinking of building an engine test bed, so will probably pick it up.....
Stay well. John D.

[Just John]

Terry, I have a spare 71 frame CB750-108xxxx if you are interested.  It is in Atlanta, GA.   Depending upon where your Florida shipper is located I may also be able to deliver it to the shipper.

Regards,
John

[Don R]

 Looks like fun, I'm diggin the paint job.

[Terry in Australia]

Terry, I have a spare 71 frame CB750-108xxxx if you are interested.  It is in Atlanta, GA.   Depending upon where your Florida shipper is located I may also be able to deliver it to the shipper.

Regards,
John

G’day John, hey thanks mate, that’d be great! My shipper is in Sarasota, is that do-able? I did have a Kawasaki Kz1000 frame sent to them from Ohio, but that was pretty expensive? PM me with a price, if you like? Cheers, Terry.

[BenelliSEI]

Terry..... I think getting a frame from Toronto to Florida is way more than it’s worth. I’m guessing $3-400. I’ll check and confirm. Something from the S.E. USA would be much less.

[Terry in Australia]

Terry..... I think getting a frame from Toronto to Florida is way more than it’s worth. I’m guessing $3-400. I’ll check and confirm. Something from the S.E. USA would be much less.

Ha ha, sorry John, different John. "Just John" offered me a frame, and he's in Georgia.

Terry, I have a spare 71 frame CB750-108xxxx if you are interested.  It is in Atlanta, GA.   Depending upon where your Florida shipper is located I may also be able to deliver it to the shipper.

Regards,
John

[PeWe]

Not good to read here!
Getting bad ideas...
I have a K1 bottom end in need of restoration, K1 cyl w head, K1 fenders, extra wheels....can get my Lotus root pipes.... Just find the other parts
Gauges a heavy cost....

Need a bigger garage to start with

[grcamna2]

Terry,it "Runs Great", with a bit of work..