Topic: What is this clutch noise

[Hoffsquig]

Maybe the clutch arm was a little too loose. The screw that must be tighten to stop, back out 1/4-1/2 turn and lock it.
My engine had tight primary chains, primary hub rubbers replaced.

I upgraded the entire clutch to an F2 clutch with double riveted metal plate. Reused the old fiber disks and metal plates too. Then really good with no rattle at all.

I have double checked the screw attaching the clutch arm (lifter plate adjustment screw).  I tried cranking it down a little more thinking it would disengage the clutch a little more, but all it did was not allow the gears to engage at all.  So I set it like the manual says, (tightened to resistance felt, and then backed off 1/4 turn) and all gears engage properly (aside from "the issue").  I'm going to check the primary chain if I can't figure anything else out, but dropping the oil pan will be the last item on my list.  I replaced the primary chain tensioner when I rebuilt the engine, but it's absolutely possible I did something wrong.

Since it is a wet clutch, oil matters.  What type, weight, and brand are you using?

I'm using 20W50 Valvoline 4 stroke motorcycle oil.  It's probably not ideal, but it's what I had available locally.  I didn't think it would cause clutch problems, but please let me know if it will, and I'll do an oil change immediately.

[Hoffsquig]

I upgraded the entire clutch to an F2 clutch with double riveted metal plate. Reused the old fiber disks and metal plates too. Then really good with no rattle at all.

I need to get a hold of that riveted double plate (B Plate, I think it's 22322371020).  right now I've got the old setup with regular discs and steels.  Maybe that will solve it.

[TwoTired]

Since it is a wet clutch, oil matters.  What type, weight, and brand are you using?

I'm using 20W50 Valvoline 4 stroke motorcycle oil.  It's probably not ideal, but it's what I had available locally.  I didn't think it would cause clutch problems, but please let me know if it will, and I'll do an oil change immediately.

Certainly seems like a decent choice.  I wouldn’t expect an issue with that oil.  Was it the full synthetic?

Having said that, I have encountered machines that definitely had an oil preference for smooth operation.  Have you experienced the same misbehavior using other brands of motorcycle oil?  If so, I wouldn’t give the brand of oil another thought.  But, if an oil brand change would correct your clutch behavior.  Would that be an acceptable “fix”?

Just tossing out ideas…

Cheers,

[PeWe]

I used Red Line 20W-50 motorcycle oil. No oil change at clutch replacement.

[PeWe]

I upgraded the entire clutch to an F2 clutch with double riveted metal plate. Reused the old fiber disks and metal plates too. Then really good with no rattle at all.

I need to get a hold of that riveted double plate (B Plate, I think it's 22322371020).  right now I've got the old setup with regular discs and steels.  Maybe that will solve it.

You need the outer steel basket and the inner alu hub with the wide grooves for metal plates to use the entire clutch package with riveted metal plate. They are a few mm deeper.
I used my K6 clutch cover. I had prepared an F2 cover but did not use it.

There is a boss for a bolt holding chrome cover that has a longer stickout on earlier covers.

Use of that riveted metal plate in a K6 clutch need 1 fiber less if not replacing the mentioned parts.

Clutch job:
https://wrenchandspanner.wordpress.com/2014/12/20/how-to-change-and-adjust-a-clutch-sohc/amp/

Rattle fix:

[Hoffsquig]

Thank you all for the responses.

You need the outer steel basket and the inner alu hub with the wide grooves for metal plates to use the entire clutch package with riveted metal plate. They are a few mm deeper.
I used my K6 clutch cover. I had prepared an F2 cover but did not use it.

I'm pretty sure I have that basket currently installed.  It's definitely not the K4 basket, like I though it was 2 years ago.  When I rebuilt the clutch this time I discovered the replacement crankcase i picked up was a K6, along with the clutch basket, so I proceeded accordingly.   I put EBC discs in last weekend.  It's just using the 6 "square' friction discs, 1 'swirled" large tab friction disc on the outside, and the 6 normal steel discs...instead of the riveted double steel minus one friction.  I dont know exactly what problem they were trying to fix with the use of the double steel plate, but maybe this is it.  I'll give it a shot.  Worst case scenario if it doesn't work, it costs me a couple extra gaskets and then I have an extra disc or two laying around.

Certainly seems like a decent choice.  I wouldn’t expect an issue with that oil.  Was it the full synthetic?

Having said that, I have encountered machines that definitely had an oil preference for smooth operation.  Have you experienced the same misbehavior using other brands of motorcycle oil?  If so, I wouldn’t give the brand of oil another thought.  But, if an oil brand change would correct your clutch behavior.  Would that be an acceptable “fix”?

It's a synthetic blend oil.  Menards carries it near my house.  This is the only oil I've used in it since I acquired and rebuilt it.  So I dont have a comparison.  But I'm not opposed to doing an oil change, just to see if it helps.  At this point I'm just throwing money at possibilities, because I can't seem to troubleshoot it down to even the general area....and I'm okay with that.  It's tough to get a feel for where it's coming from when I'm on the bike.  I should have some time tonight to put it up in the air and see if it happens with no rider.  I adjusted the clutch cable to what I consider too much free-play so it disengages later in the pull...I'll hop on tonight and see if that did anything. 

I'm ready to be done and do some worry-free riding.  And I appreciate the help.  Out of that whole top-to-bottom rebuild, I didn't think this would be the problem that owned me.

[TwoTired]

Something that surprised me, was when I tried out Honda HP4 10-40 in my CB550, which Honda recommends.  I wasn't looking for anything other than clean oil.  But, I noticed that it shifted and operated smoother, as the clutch was happier with it than it was with the Castrol 10-40 I used prior.  I didn't really expect that.  Now, it usually does shift better right after an oil change, but this lasted much longer with the HP4.  Empirical, I know.  Just my observation.

Note that I avoid the variant that has moly in it.  That seems to make my CB550 clutch slip.  But, who knows, Maybe that's just what you need?  Or, maybe with all the new bits, just a switch to 10W-40, might make it happy?  It IS what Honda recommends, after all.

Carry on...

[pjandrew99]

Hmmm.....
I am having the same issue. Some very strange unsettling noises on the first long ride of the season with the K1.
Not to start an oil thread here but I'm using Valvoline 20/50 dino with 4 ounces of Rislone. May switch to 10w/40 and see if it makes a difference. Maybe eliminate the Rislone this time. However, it does shift well.
These bikes are interesting. With my DR650 I just get on and ride. Then I park it and ride again, then again and again.
With the CB I ride, fix, fix, short ride fix, long ride jack up and fix. Why do I love this bike??? Drives me crazy!

[TwoTired]

and see if it
With the CB I ride, fix, fix, short ride fix, long ride jack up and fix. Why do I love this bike??? Drives me crazy!

When the cb was new it had minimal maintenance cycles.  Honda’s were noted for their reliability.  And, I can attest to that, having had one or more for over 40 years.  But, a machine is only as good as it’s mechanic.  What do you know of its treatment over its life?  You may be playing “catch up”.  Or….maybe you aren’t as good a mechanic as you think you are?  /jk. 

But, to continue the comparison, how well of if your DR650 will run in 50 years?  Who today makes vehicles to withstand the test of time?

Cheers,

[pjandrew99]

and see if it
With the CB I ride, fix, fix, short ride fix, long ride jack up and fix. Why do I love this bike??? Drives me crazy!

When the cb was new it had minimal maintenance cycles.  Honda’s were noted for their reliability.  And, I can attest to that, having had one or more for over 40 years.  But, a machine is only as good as it’s mechanic.  What do you know of its treatment over its life?  You may be playing “catch up”.  Or….maybe you aren’t as good a mechanic as you think you are?  /jk. 

But, to continue the comparison, how well of if your DR650 will run in 50 years?  Who today makes vehicles to withstand the test of time?

Cheers,

[pjandrew99]

and see if it
With the CB I ride, fix, fix, short ride fix, long ride jack up and fix. Why do I love this bike??? Drives me crazy!

When the cb was new it had minimal maintenance cycles.  Honda’s were noted for their reliability.  And, I can attest to that, having had one or more for over 40 years.  But, a machine is only as good as it’s mechanic.  What do you know of its treatment over its life?  You may be playing “catch up”.  Or….maybe you aren’t as good a mechanic as you think you are?  /jk. 

But, to continue the comparison, how well of if your DR650 will run in 50 years?  Who today makes vehicles to withstand the test of time?


Cheers,

Well, I am playing catch up and thankful that this forum exist or the CB would never be on the road.
Thanks