Topic: I went shopping last year, inside the 836

[seanbarney41]

On that flathead v8, valves most likely stuck.  Its really easy to break the stems

[Don R]

I recently purchased a 1963 Corvair engine for a project car that was locked up from sitting.  I had previously read on one of the car forums that a 50/50 mixture of acetone and marvel mystery oil(orAtf) was very effective in loosening up a stuck engine. After backing off the rockers of several valves that were open, I poured the mixture in each cylinder. I let it sit for 3 days and sure enough I got it to budge a tad. I moved it back and forth and I broke loose completely. After doing some other checks, I plan to crank it up on a pallet to see what condition it's in. I intend to use this same liquid formula on a 1949 Ford V8 flathead that's also locked up. You may want to consider trying the same thing. It was a fairly cheap method.

 
If you get it turning over and pumping oil get some marvell mystery oil into it. My brother built and raced flatheads in the late 60's and 70's. the marvell works wonders on the lifters. An older guy at the gas station said he had a 37 with a sticky valve, I was 16 and told him to try the MM. The next time I saw him he thanked me for fixing his car. These days he has a modern V8 in it. Holy crap, that was over 50 years ago.

[dragracer]

On that flathead v8, valves most likely stuck.  Its really easy to break the stems

Yeap. The plan was also to run the mixture into the intake as well so the stems could get a little love.

[Don R]

 Speaking of valves, I got a bag of Honda valves out today to see what was in it. I found valves that are too big, valves that are too small and valves that are just right. Some magnetic heads, some non-magnetic heads, some F and some K. one bent really bad looks like it hit a dome, it had a Z bend. No head that these big/little valves fit into though, I think there were 36mm intakes and smaller than normal exhausts that I assume went on the same head.
  The new head for the turbo motor is ported but has stock size magnetic valves. Some stock exhausts seem to have an Inconel or similar alloy head with a magnetic stem.

[Don R]

 
 While reading, I was reminded not to use solid core wires on an MSD ignition and it occurred to me the Gerex is also a multi spark discharge and it has solid core wires on it with no resistor caps. It did have Resistor plugs (that hit the piston domes) and I took them out. I'm wondering if I should make up a set of resistor core wires for it? 
  I'm not really sure what the science is concerning solid wires on an msd other than RFI.
 
   The Gerex instructions don't really mention coils or plug wires.

[Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er]

Don, I will be back in CO for a week or so after 2/2. Remind me and I will pull out the info from my NOS Gerex

Well my trip is over. I will be back around the first of May if info still needed. Gotta remind then too LOL

[scottly]

Solid core wires are fine with the Gerex. Don, there is a special race only version, which is only run in a total loss mode; max voltage is 12.6V?? Does your unit say Race on it? I couldn't see the box clearly in the pics, but IIRC it wasn't quite the same as mine?

[Don R]

It's black plastic, was difficult to read the gerex up under the oil cooler. Now it's in the back like the manual shows. The PO street rode (raced) it. He said he loved to pick on kz900's, they didn't expect a 750 honda to run that hard. I don't see anything other than Gerex. He did run a charging system but not a starter on a light flywheel.
 I printed read the manual you guys linked me to, it doesn't mention plug wires at all. I think the msd reasoning is about rfi.

[Don R]

 I've read a little more on the Gerex and I was wondering if mine is one of the electronic ignitions and not the CDI version. My reasoning was, it does not make any noise at all when energized and the Cir-cycle coils seem to be standard, close to 5 ohm.
  The box is rear outlet wiring, plastic and says multifire on it with a G. According to a KZ forum I read multifire is CD and convertible electronic is not a CD, the electronic has a smaller box.
  This being the case, I think I should try some lower ohm coils.

https://kzrider.com/forum/4-electrical/183884-gerex-ignition-system

https://www.advrider.com/f/threads/anyone-familiar-with-gerex-ignition.1511361/

 https://www.holley.com/products/marine_and_powersports/motorcycle/motorcycle_ignition/motorcycle_ignition_coils/parts/140404?utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&hsa_acc=7848552874&hsa_cam=1739794947&hsa_grp=1147890726837754&hsa_ad=&hsa_src=o&hsa_tgt=pla-4575342763268921&hsa_kw=&hsa_mt=e&hsa_net=adwords&hsa_ver=3&msclkid=adb957cfe368105e327335c68a072c73&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=Google%20Shopping%20-%20Accel%20-%20Non-Brand&utm_term=4575342763268921&utm_content=Accel%20Motorcycle

[scottly]

Hey Don, if your ignition is not a CDI, lower resistance coils may fry it, just like too low resistance coils would fry points in a short time. Play it safe and keep the coils you have; I ran my CDI for decades with stock Honda coils.

[Don R]

Sometimes I overthink and then overpost. Thanks for the heads up on that Scott.
  I was comparing my two ohm meters on these cir-cycle coils, a cheap H/F digital and an old  mychronta ? analog meter bought by my brother in a bar. The cheapie would not repeat close enough to call good at first, but I figured it out and eventually got matching numbers.
  According to what I've read the multifire box is CD, the electronic non CD units are labeled Gerex convertible points replacement.

[Don R]

  I took the turbo motor apart yesterday and today.
   I found the best way to remove rusted in pistons is, put them in the press and put a light load on them, if they don't come out heat with a large torch and when the penetrating oil smokes pour in some marvel mystery oil and walk away. A half hour later they pop right out. Getting the rings loose without gouging anything is another thread.

  MTC steel rods and a balanced crank, there was a little grinding/polishing done to the weights.
  I read they used small block ford rod bolts.

[Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er]

HD studs

[Don R]

HD studs

  Head and crank studs. It even has studs for the head front center bolt and under the nickel washers. They tighten through the fins with an end wrench.

[Don R]

   So far it appears I'm only using the crank and rods from the turbo motor, the case is welded, rings rusted into the grooves, cylinder rusty, an exhaust valve was stuck open, tranny not so fresh.
   I went with an F2 trans, clutch and primary chains. They were all low miles and appear perfect.
   The motor came with a ported fresh head, I think the chambers need a little work to even them up, one has a ding in a high spot. Just shelf wear.

[dragracer]

   So far it appears I'm only using the crank and rods from the turbo motor, the case is welded, rings rusted into the grooves, cylinder rusty, an exhaust valve was stuck open, tranny not so fresh.
   I went with an F2 trans, clutch and primary chains. They were all low miles and appear perfect.
   The motor came with a ported fresh head, I think the chambers need a little work to even them up, one has a ding in a high spot. Just shelf wear.

I've run the steel rods in my bike for 25 years. Nothing has come apart yet, thankfully.

[Don R]

 Ken at CycleX wants to talk on the phone after I sent an email.
  The turbo motor had steel MTC rods and also came with a set of new aluminum ones. I'm unsure if there are new forged flat top pistons available in any bore size.

[corky]

If you have a chance Don, upload a picture of one of the MTC rods.  I realize if you aren't taking the motor apart this wont be possible, lol.  I have never seen a picture of one of those posted.  They must have been even less common then the RC steel rods.

Thanks,
Daniel

[MRieck]

Ken at CycleX wants to talk on the phone after I sent an email.
  The turbo motor had steel MTC rods and also came with a set of new aluminum ones. I'm unsure if there are new forged flat top pistons available in any bore size.

Dynoman has 836 turbo pistons.....I recently installed a set.  Unfortunately they use XA rings (which are fine for NA).....I'd much rather run an XC ring pack for a turbo. Total Seal can cut the piston for XC but obviously there is more money involved.

[Don R]

 Here is a pic of an mtc steel rod, I don't have a scale but they aren't light. You can see where they were lightly milled in the web near the pin, either lightening to balance or maybe just to smooth the casting. They are a little gunky, I've been soaking and heating them to try to loosen the stuck rings.
 The rod bolts may be small block ford, The nuts are 1/2"

[desertrefugee]

I don't know Don. You're throwing all the best parts at this motor, so why would you go with the steel rods?  Understood that durability would be essentially assured, but...

Seems to me that if you're going to go "all the way", splurging on a good set of forged aluminum rods would make all the difference in taching it up.

[Don R]

 You mean like this?  The PO thinks they are new, just shelf worn and dirty. Too bad he didn't leave them boxed up.

[Don R]

  The crank may have been balanced with the steel rods. I'm not too sure if it matters that much on a 4 cylinder inline motor.

[MRieck]

  The crank may have been balanced with the steel rods. I'm not too sure if it matters that much on a 4 cylinder inline motor.

The rods don't make a difference....if the crank is balanced you can install whatever you want.

[Don R]

 Thanks Mike.