Author Topic: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.  (Read 23432 times)

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Offline Alan F.

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #25 on: November 28, 2021, 05:34:01 PM »
No pics in this update, sorry.

I've just finished taking the wheels apart, I think the spokes will all be ok, I'll get a better view of them after Evaporust.

Both rims are stamped near the valve stem hole, inside and out with D.I.D. and along the lip of both sides of both wheels there are no markings at all.
With a ruler the width on both is 1-9/16" so they're 1.6" width or WM1.

The 18" front wheel from a 91-08 CB250 Nighthawk is the same size and also drilled for a drum brake, but they are more modern and have stamped markings on the side. Maybe someone finds this in a search someday when searching for an alternate 36 spoke wheel, they're identical.

Offline grcamna2

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #26 on: November 28, 2021, 09:01:34 PM »
Subscribed,love this CB160  :)
75' CB400F/'bunch o' parts' & 81' CB125S modded to a 'CB200S'
  I love the small ones too !
Do your BEST...nobody can take that away from you.

Offline Alan F.

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #27 on: November 28, 2021, 09:05:15 PM »
Good news, I dug out the shifter and took it a few times through the gears and back down while turning the countershaft sprocket a little this way and that to simulate rocking the bike.
But the kick start still isn't turning the engine.
I wonder if the clutch needs to be disengaged to allow the kicker to turn the engine? I'm perusing manuals now.

Offline jgger

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #28 on: November 28, 2021, 09:49:12 PM »
The kicker will might move with the clutch pulled, but only because that will disengage it. If the plates are stuck together then it will act the same as it does now.
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Offline jgger

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #29 on: November 28, 2021, 09:55:26 PM »
"The SOHC4 uses a computer located about 2-3 ft above the seat.  Those sometimes need additional programming." -stolen from  Two Tired

The difference between an ass kisser and brown noser is merely depth perception.  Stolen from RAFster122s

Offline PeWe

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #30 on: November 29, 2021, 03:52:40 AM »
Possible to fix the rims? Take apart, grind off rust and send to chrome.
I have seen old CB750 where they went the expensive way restoring the old rims. They look different than the later DID replacements. I understand those who prefer the old stock design.
CB750 K6-76  970cc (Earlier 1005cc JMR Billet block on the shelf waiting for a comeback)
CB750 K2-75 Parts assembled to a stock K2

Updates of the CB750 K6 -1976
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180468.msg2092136.html#msg2092136
The billet block build thread
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,49438.msg1863571.html#msg1863571
CB750 K2 -1975  build thread
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,168243.msg1948381.html#msg1948381
K2 engine build thread. For a complete CB750 -75
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180088.msg2088008.html#msg2088008
Carb jetting, a long story Mikuni TMR32
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,179479.msg2104967.html#msg2104967

Offline RAFster122s

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #31 on: November 29, 2021, 04:42:30 AM »
Would a wallpaper tray with couple bricks in ziplock bags or trash bags ( to take up room in the tray) work as a soaking tub for your rims for the Evaporust?
5 pounds of Oxalic Acid from Amazon mixed pound per gallon of distilled water works really nice as a cheaper substitute for Evaporust.
Evaporust or MetalRescue or Oxalic Acid works quicker when the solution is warm...
Aquarium heater if container has enough depth will warm the fluid...since it is fall/winter most places and solar heating of fluid isn't as easy ...
David- back in the desert SW!

Offline Alan F.

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #32 on: November 29, 2021, 05:46:35 AM »
It would work well. My first thought was:



But I've been searching for the perfect half donut shaped, 20" OD, 16" ID container for a few years now.

« Last Edit: November 29, 2021, 05:50:17 AM by Alan F. »

Offline RAFster122s

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #33 on: November 29, 2021, 05:55:16 AM »
Tire works until it reaches a point. Too bad you cannot slip them into an inner tube and fill that, but being a perfect circle that is unbroken...
David- back in the desert SW!

Offline Alan F.

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #34 on: November 29, 2021, 06:03:34 AM »
*Jgger: Thanks for the link.

*PeWe: I have the wheels apart and I think they'll come clean with Evaporust followed by CorrosionX which is a thin film corrosion inhibitor. I'll use this combination for the whole bike.

*RAFster122s: I've searched again for a wide, shallow container to soak rusty rims in and settled on a 20" plastic water heater drain pan, it's 2-1/2" deep so may be fine for these wheels in one go maybe not. I'll plug the pan's drain fitting and will most likely silicone in an inverted dish or bowl in the center to take up volume.
Best deal including shipping was online for under $12 and it should be here in a few days.

I plan to hit the inside of the rims with a wire wheel then soak the rims in Evaporust with a heat pad under the pan to keep things active while I soak the spokes and nipples in other containers. I'll start this process after the CorrosionX arrives so I can apply it to the de-rusted parts and not worry about flash rust for a few years.

I'm really trying to keep side projects to a minimum, I tend to waste a lot of project time on tangents that don't further the project.
« Last Edit: November 29, 2021, 11:38:21 AM by Alan F. »

Offline Alan F.

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #35 on: November 29, 2021, 05:29:01 PM »
I took a few minutes this evening to get out to this bike with a can of Seafoam Deep Creep recommended by calj737 and Flyin900 in another thread about unsticking/freeing a 750 engine.

After removing both plugs I gave a 6 second blast into each of the cylinders, then threaded both plugs ~halfway in, the threads seemed surprisingly good. Then I broke the alternator cover screws loose with my trusty #3 Philips and a few taps from a nearby 17mm wrench, all 3 gave an immediate "crack" breaking free cleanly. I tipped the engine to the right hand side and propped it up with the Seafoam can while I took the 3 screws out and tapped the cover once with the rubber covered screwdriver handle breaking the cover loose from its gasket in one go.
With a 14mm wrench on the rotor bolt (yup just 14mm) I leaned on the wrench a little, mind you the cylinder head is just propped up with the edge of the Seafoam can under a cooling fin....and the wrench began to move. Slowly I turned it 90 degrees then back 180 and 180 forward again! Pleased with that I wiped the oil off the alternator cover and the engine cover and screwed it back into place to keep the oil in. Then I turned the engine upright and tried the kick start with my hand, and the engine turned bubbling Seafoam Deep Creep bubbles past the loosely threaded right hand spark plug and puffing air past the loosely threaded left plug!
Win.

Offline grcamna2

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #36 on: November 29, 2021, 05:34:11 PM »
I took a few minutes this evening to get out to this bike with a can of Seafoam Deep Creep recommended by calj737 and Flyin900 in another thread about unsticking/freeing a 750 engine.

After removing both plugs I gave a 6 second blast into each of the cylinders, then threaded both plugs ~halfway in, the threads seemed surprisingly good. Then I broke the alternator cover screws loose with my trusty #3 Philips and a few taps from a nearby 17mm wrench, all 3 gave an immediate "crack" breaking free cleanly. I tipped the engine to the right hand side and propped it up with the Seafoam can while I took the 3 screws out and tapped the cover once with the rubber covered screwdriver handle breaking the cover loose from its gasket in one go.
With a 14mm wrench on the rotor bolt (yup just 14mm) I leaned on the wrench a little, mind you the cylinder head is just propped up with the edge of the Seafoam can under a cooling fin....and the wrench began to move. Slowly I turned it 90 degrees then back 180 and 180 forward again! Pleased with that I wiped the oil off the alternator cover and the engine cover and screwed it back into place to keep the oil in. Then I turned the engine upright and tried the kick start with my hand, and the engine turned bubbling Seafoam Deep Creep bubbles past the loosely threaded right hand spark plug and puffing air past the loosely threaded left plug!
Win.

YEAH !  That's wonderful Alan  ;) :)  Big Win  :)
75' CB400F/'bunch o' parts' & 81' CB125S modded to a 'CB200S'
  I love the small ones too !
Do your BEST...nobody can take that away from you.

Offline Alan F.

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #37 on: November 29, 2021, 05:42:35 PM »
Thanks Bill, it sure is a load off my mind.

I guess I'll order up some correct gray CL160 control cables to go with those Scrambler bars then!

Offline Alan F.

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #38 on: November 30, 2021, 05:50:39 AM »
I just picked up some CL control cables. I got an OEM gray Speedometer cable, and an MC hi-bar gray cable set from Rusty Riders. I'll have a look at the existing rear brake cable before deciding to replace it, there aren't many out there and they're pricey.

Offline RAFster122s

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #39 on: November 30, 2021, 06:01:22 AM »
Ohio cycle may have some oem stuff left
David- back in the desert SW!

Offline Stev-o

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #40 on: November 30, 2021, 02:39:54 PM »
Subscribed to see the patina bike be brought back to life!
'74 "Big Bang" Honda 750K [836].....'76 Honda 550F.....K3 Park Racer!......and a Bomber!............plus plus plus.........

Offline Alan F.

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #41 on: November 30, 2021, 06:12:23 PM »
Tonight I took a VHT member's advice from a few days ago and drained the oil as best I could. He had advised that the clean oil I found on the dipstick was just an illusion, and there was a ton of crud that had sunk to the bottom in there, worse it could be floating on a layer of water, yuck I hope not.

Again with the engine out of the frame I had to get creative.
I set up my aluminum ladder but couldn't find any ratchet straps and had to improvise. I found two coiled cables I used to use for locking up my old bike and decided to give those a try.
A picture would be worth a thousand words right now. Suffice it to say that I draped one cable over a 2x4 on the top step and stuck the end loops on the left and right of the top motor mount. Same with the rear mount but one step lower. The engine was sitting perfectly upright, hovering about one foot (30cm) above the ground. I was able to twist the 2x4 90 degrees to raise the front of the engine before removing the rear drain plug. I let the cold oil run until it was a slow drip then levelled the engine again and more oil ran out, rear drain plug back in I repeated the process with the front drain plug until empty the put the drain plug back in. I'll have to find some new sealing washers for these drain plugs.

While I had the engine suspended I cranked the kickstarter many times with the plugs removed. I noticed that it was getting very easy to turn with the kicker now, much less notchy than it was the other day. I also noticed some light brown muddy Seafoam Deep Creep beginning to ooze out of the #1 left side exhaust port, there was some wetness at #2 also but it was just clear. So #1 was the stuck side, and now I've gotten some Deep Creep past the exhaust valve. I didn't even look at the intake, that would remain dry right?
Next time I'll shoot some Deep Creep on the valvetrain and both cylinders before giving it a few minutes of turning with the kicker. I was surprised at how far around that kickstarter turns, it's active from about 11 o'clock counterclockwise until about 5 o'clock.

And just as my advisor had said, this wasn't clean oil although what was on the dipstick was. All of the crud had sunk to the bottom. And I only removed about 3/4 of a liter of dirty oil. Happily I found no water in there.
The manual says this engine only holds 1 liter of oil, and some will remain in there after draining, likely more stayed than normal with a cold engine and all of that crud in there. At least there'll never be much waste oil to get rid of.

My 21" water heater pan arrived while I was out, I think I'll Krazy glue something over the drain hole and clamp it with some blocks before beginning.
It just might be deep enough to submerge one of these rims in but I haven't put the two together yet.
I think it's probably too cold in storage for the Evaporust to do its thing, I may have to do this part at home. Stay tuned!
« Last Edit: November 30, 2021, 06:17:46 PM by Alan F. »

Offline grcamna2

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #42 on: November 30, 2021, 08:01:47 PM »
I'm glad you removed as much of the oil as you could Alan.  8)
The Evaporust Will work much better at a warm temperature.

Oh yeah,clean the oil filter after flushing it.
« Last Edit: December 01, 2021, 12:23:08 AM by grcamna2 »
75' CB400F/'bunch o' parts' & 81' CB125S modded to a 'CB200S'
  I love the small ones too !
Do your BEST...nobody can take that away from you.

Offline Alan F.

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #43 on: November 30, 2021, 08:05:19 PM »
So what's the consensus here, should I just clean the oil filter rotor then clean up the outside of the engine and set it aside until I have a clean rust free roller to bolt it into?

Offline desertrefugee

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #44 on: November 30, 2021, 08:38:46 PM »
Before setting it aside, I would mix up a cocktail for flushing the sump. There are quite a number of recommended mixtures of various petroleum-based solvent elixirs. I don't want to recommend one above the other, I'd just offer up that a google search of the aether might provide some interesting recommendations.

Simply removing the sump and cleaning the residue out would probably be enough, but there may be some other nooks and crannies that could benefit from an additional flush.
'86 Vmax, '83 ZN1300, '78 GL1000, '75 CB750 K5, '78 F4

Offline RAFster122s

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #45 on: November 30, 2021, 08:46:38 PM »
Kerosene or diesel works well, whichever is cheaper.
Diesel even as expensive as it is will likely be cheaper.

Just fill it up and let is soak before you turn it over many times before draining.
David- back in the desert SW!

Offline Alan F.

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #46 on: November 30, 2021, 09:05:54 PM »
Sounds good and adding heat will probably be a good idea too.

And I should fill only to the oil full level?

Would overfilling be detrimental when only turning with the kickstarter and not actually running the engine?

Offline RAFster122s

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #47 on: November 30, 2021, 09:59:37 PM »
Overfilling won't hurt when not running when you are wanting to flush the engine.
David- back in the desert SW!

Offline jgger

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #48 on: December 01, 2021, 12:58:12 AM »
Is evapo rust going to damage the aluminum hub if you dunk thr entire wheel?  Plus are the spoke nipples brass, steel, or aluminum,  might want to be sure on the reaction on other than steel. It would be a bummer to damage unsuspecting parts.

It may be fine, just be careful.
"The SOHC4 uses a computer located about 2-3 ft above the seat.  Those sometimes need additional programming." -stolen from  Two Tired

The difference between an ass kisser and brown noser is merely depth perception.  Stolen from RAFster122s

Offline Alan F.

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Re: Black Friday - a red 1965 CB160 build.
« Reply #49 on: December 01, 2021, 05:56:30 AM »
Thanks RAFster122s, I'll fill it full then, that should help dilute the oily crud!

Jgger I won't be submerging the whole wheel, don't want the bearings submerged. But probably if one had a container suitable enough, you could submerge an assembled wheel up to the spoke flange and give it a quarter turn now and then.

I'll soak my rims, spokes and brass nipples separately then relace them to the hubs, since spokes are all one size I'll be randomly shuffling them between the 2 wheels.


From my reading on the Evaporust website it appears that I can put other metals into Evaporust safely. Their Q&A states that it will work on aluminum, zinc and brass as well as steel. I wonder if part of it's reaction simply removes the oxygen from the oxide? Like rubbing aluminum foil on rust with an electrolyte will actually steal oxygen atoms from red steel rust to oxidize the foil.
« Last Edit: December 01, 2021, 05:58:23 AM by Alan F. »