Author Topic: old ATP turbo bench racing  (Read 363 times)

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Offline Don R

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old ATP turbo bench racing
« on: August 30, 2024, 03:51:53 pm »
 If you had an assortment of engines, a pretty complete ATP turbo kit and a cool looking raked and lengthened swingarm frame laying around, what engine would you put it on/in? 

 I've heard good things about turboing the stock F2 but also have a K6 case with a balanced crank, MTC steel rods a backcut F2 trans and a good K head. No usable turbo pistons but several early but worn cylinders to choose from to have bored? 
 Or a new set of Wiseco K model 64 or 65mm 12.25/1 pistons in the F motor?

 Any other daydreaming ideas? the end result is just to use what's under the bed  to assemble a street freak cb750.
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Offline newday777

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Re: old ATP turbo bench racing
« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2024, 03:16:39 am »
Following to hear what you do Don. It should be interesting......
Stu
Honda Parts manager in the mid 1970s Nashua Honda
My current rides
1975 K5 Planet Blue my summer ride, it was a friend's bike I worked with at the Honda shop in 76, lots of fun to be on it again
1976 K6 Anteres Red rebuilding project, was originally my brother's that I set up from the crate, it'll breath again soon!
Project 750s, 2 K4, 2 K6, 1 K8
2008 GL1800 my daily ride and cross country runner

Prior bikes....
1972 Suzuki GT380 I had charge of it for a year in 1973 while my friend was deployed and learned to love street riding....
New CB450 K7 after my friend returned...
New CB750 K5 Planet Blue, demise by ex cousin in law at 9,000 miles...
New CB750 K6 Anteres Red, to replace the totaled K5, I sold this K6 at 45k in 1983, I had heavily modified it, many great memories on it and have missed it greatly.....
1983 GL1100A, 1999 GL1500 SE, 1999 GL1500A

Offline seanbarney41

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Re: old ATP turbo bench racing
« Reply #2 on: August 31, 2024, 09:15:42 am »
come on Don!  You are old enough to know...

Turbos are for diesels!

no seriously...I don't know.  Seems to me like folks just get greedy with the boost and of course that is when stuff starts breaking fast and kids these days won't even look at an engine without hanging ten hairdryers off of it...

If I had those parts lying about, I guess I would have to try something too...
If it works good, it looks good...

Offline BomberMann650

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Re: old ATP turbo bench racing
« Reply #3 on: August 31, 2024, 08:25:23 pm »
Wish I had known about the relative altitude adjustments before i assembled mine.

At least the valves had clearance 😅
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Offline scottly

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Re: old ATP turbo bench racing
« Reply #4 on: August 31, 2024, 08:32:59 pm »
You just dial in 2 PSI more boost to make up for the 25.5 inches of mercury, instead of the 29.5" at sea level. (2"of mercury=1 PSI)
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Offline Don R

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Re: old ATP turbo bench racing
« Reply #5 on: September 01, 2024, 03:04:26 pm »
 In a previous discussion one of the experienced racers mentioned that his bike felt puny in the lower rpm's and didn't come alive until it got into boost. I'm thinking with E85 there might be more resistance to detonation and a guy could run more static compression.
  My old Rajay might not make a lot of boost anyway. I found graphite type header flange gaskets that fit the turbo this week.
 I need to have a fresh cylinder bored for a Wiseco 836 in the Rat Race so I'll probably see what Ken at CycleX has laying around. My old 836 turbo pistons have seized onto their rings. 
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Offline Tracksnblades1

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Re: old ATP turbo bench racing
« Reply #6 on: September 01, 2024, 07:28:38 pm »
In a previous discussion one of the experienced racers mentioned that his bike felt puny in the lower rpm's and didn't come alive until it got into boost. I'm thinking with E85 there might be more resistance to detonation and a guy could run more static compression.
  My old Rajay might not make a lot of boost anyway. I found graphite type header flange gaskets that fit the turbo this week.
 I need to have a fresh cylinder bored for a Wiseco 836 in the Rat Race so I'll probably see what Ken at CycleX has laying around. My old 836 turbo pistons have seized onto their rings.

If your old turbo pistons are good you might try a large hospital grade ultrasonic cleaner. The large ones can be really aggressive when you find the right frequency…

I’ve only heard good things so far with E85. Provided you go with an alcohol fuel system…

👍 more Static compression and timing…😇
Age Quod Agis

Offline NitroHunter

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Re: old ATP turbo bench racing
« Reply #7 on: September 03, 2024, 03:16:51 pm »
I love that we're only paying $3.50 a gallon for the E-85 we run in my pals Pro Street blown iron SBC, sure beats race gas and Methanol prices. And it's available at pumps around town.
As long as you're able to almost double the jetting volume and provide adequate fuel flow there is much upside to this idea. If I ever cobble my collection of parts together, that's how it'll be built, high compression turbo. Torque Monster that I can find fuel for away from home.
The E-85 fuel's threshold of detonation lets it work very well in very high cylinder pressure applications.
With those rods you can run higher compression pistons and enjoy the torque as opposed to the doggie-ness I had to live with lower CR.
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Offline willbird

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Re: old ATP turbo bench racing
« Reply #8 on: September 05, 2024, 04:37:29 am »
I love that we're only paying $3.50 a gallon for the E-85 we run in my pals Pro Street blown iron SBC, sure beats race gas and Methanol prices. And it's available at pumps around town.
As long as you're able to almost double the jetting volume and provide adequate fuel flow there is much upside to this idea. If I ever cobble my collection of parts together, that's how it'll be built, high compression turbo. Torque Monster that I can find fuel for away from home.
The E-85 fuel's threshold of detonation lets it work very well in very high cylinder pressure applications.
With those rods you can run higher compression pistons and enjoy the torque as opposed to the doggie-ness I had to live with lower CR.

A bunch of the K series Honda drag n drive guys got into some E85 that was somehow bad during an event and smoked some engines. Never did hear exactly what the issue with it was.

Offline NitroHunter

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Re: old ATP turbo bench racing
« Reply #9 on: September 05, 2024, 07:45:08 pm »
Bird thanks for bringing this up.
The brilliant Lake Speed jr, from Total Seal piston rings, had an in-depth look at E-85 available at the pump during one of his Engine Builders seminars... Findings were that, depending on many variables, it could range from 85-50+ ethanol and still be in state certified range. WTF...  :o :o :o
Without a doubt if I were going for serious power I'd purchase E-85 in the can from a reputable fuel manufacturer.
 We've been told by other local racers that this pump fuel we're getting is supposedly accurate... For the blown small block 10:5 Pro Street toy the max boost is relatively low at 17 psi and the mag timing is extremely conservative at only 26 degrees. Good Guys event cruising is doable, well the fuel consumption lump-lumping around is terrible, but the plugs say it wants some heat power but last Monday at Sonoma running 8.70's were safe and repeatable.
Knock on wood so far corrosion hasn't been an issue like running Methanol was in my pals funnycar. Spiderwebs of corrosion lines would grow overnight. That was a shocker, I'd never experienced that issue running nitro.
« Last Edit: September 05, 2024, 08:20:21 pm by NitroHunter »
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Offline Don R

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Re: old ATP turbo bench racing
« Reply #10 on: September 05, 2024, 11:57:05 pm »
 I think the can of Q16 I just bought was $26.00 a gallon. It's the last one I'll be buying.

 We got burned on speed shop bulk gas once and gas station unocal "race gas" another time. The one time cost me an awesome set of ported cast iron chevy turbo heads, but Earnheart's heads cracked too. The other time just ruined a season points series for us.
 I've either bought a barrel or cans since. Anybody need a 5-gallon gas can? I got a few empties.
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Offline NitroHunter

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Re: old ATP turbo bench racing
« Reply #11 on: September 07, 2024, 02:15:34 pm »
I think the can of Q16 I just bought was $26.00 a gallon. It's the last one I'll be buying.
.
Ouch.
I remember riding to a sprint car guy's race shop and filling my bike from his pump with ERC 110 for a whopping $3.65 a gallon and whining about how expensive THAT was!
My pal's done a hydrometer check every time he's filled the E-85 jugs, so far they've read the same.
But we know that isn't necessarily an absolute, just that our current tuning will work with what he's getting right now
Knock on wood...  ::) ::) ::)

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