Topic: CB350F New / Aftermarket parts problems - anyone else?

[brianc]

Getting through the rebuild of my 72 CB350F. I have two issues with replacement parts that I'm not having any joy with and wondering if its just me or there is a bigger problem here.
First the clutch cable. I have been supplied a genuine Honda cable 22870-ME7-405, as the original has been superceded and not available. From what I can work out, the lever end mechanisms and the clutch cover etc at the engine end are identical on all the 350Fs. The difference is the handlebars, so the overall length would be different. No problem there. My issue is the 'operating' length of the new one is 15 - 17mm longer and you cannot adjust the freeplay, well you are at the limit of all the adjustments. This is not right. A fellow restorer with a similar F has the same issue, but the source of his cable was different to mine? Anyone else?
The biggy is the Front Fender. I've put up the photo.The Fender fits fine, but the stays are too long. The 350 fender has a squarish profile, yet these stays have a rounder profile (Like a 750??) The stays are about 12 - 15mm too long (x 2 = about 1" !!) and to me are look like are for a 19" front fender as opposed to the 18" of the 350. Coincidentally, my fellow restorer (again differently sourced fender) appears to have the same issue. Looking at some supply sites now, they seem to be magically out of stock? Hmmm.

I have been back to both suppliers over the last few weeks, they are responding and seem to be trying to resolve, but I'm not hopeful.

Making it tricky is that I'm in Australia, they are UK / Euro.

So any of you good people seeing either of these issues?
Thanks

[dave500]

could almost be 500/550 stays?

[brianc]

That's my argument back to the supplier. 500 / 550 / 750, anything with a 19" wheel. But they say - I have the correct ones!!!
I am fairly competent mechanically - I have some bits of paper that say so, I still make mistakes, I'm not perfect.
But assembling the front fender is pretty straight forward. I'm pretty sure I've done it right.

[Flyin900]

I have a 1972 CB 350F that I have restored to a high level and it came with a new DSS front fender attached, although this fender was sourced likely 8 years ago from DSS.
Measure your brackets from the curve start to the mounting point and I will compare them to mine for a length reference.

My brackets measure 13 3/4" (500 mm) from the front rounded mount that bolts onto the lower stanchion to the first hole in the curved area in back that screws to the fender. Both upper and lower brackets measure the same to that first hole.

[Robbo]

I took some measurements of the stock front fender stay on each bike using the string method and then measuring the string length.  Measurement was taken along the top of the stay for the full length of each stay.

1973 CB350f measures 77cm

1975 CB550K measures 81cm

Also for reference, the stock fender length for each bike.

CB350f measures 79.5cm

CB550K measures 92cm

Hope that helps you in some way.


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[brianc]

OK thanks for those couple of bits, Ill check those in the morning.

[Trevor from Warragul]

The cable issue can be solved by making a custom adjuster out of a long aluminium cap head screw.  Drill through the center and cut a slot..

[brianc]

Thanks for the info.
Clutch adjustment, yes the adjuster mod is a solution, but that would be my last option.

The fender - well I'm really confused now. The length of the fender given as 79.5cm, mine says 78.5cm. +/- OK.
Total length of the stay 77cm, mine 76 +/- .
The stay length at 13 3/4" - exactly the same.
Now if I pull the fender out to meet the stay (15mm each one), I could probably fit the bolts and tighten it up, but er, no.

I might be cutting, shortening and rechroming the stays?

Thanks so far.

[Robbo]

Thanks for the info.
Clutch adjustment, yes the adjuster mod is a solution, but that would be my last option.

The fender - well I'm really confused now. The length of the fender given as 79.5cm, mine says 78.5cm. +/- OK.
Total length of the stay 77cm, mine 76 +/- .
The stay length at 13 3/4" - exactly the same.
Now if I pull the fender out to meet the stay (15mm each one), I could probably fit the bolts and tighten it up, but er, no.

I might be cutting, shortening and rechroming the stays?

Thanks so far.

That is strange.  They are relatively close (the string method is far from perfect) yet you cannot fit them together on the bike?

Is it perhaps the width or the shape of the fender vs the width/shape of the stays?

Do they comfortably assemble off the bike?

Btw, my stock fender width is 103mm.


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[Robbo]

One more thing, the stays don’t touch the fender on assembly.  There is a slight gap.  There are mounting rubbers that go between the fender and the stay.

Front stay



Rear stay




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[brianc]

Thanks Robbo. Please have another look at the photo in my first post back up the top. There is a 15mm or so gap between the stays and the fender. I suppose I could pull that gap closed with the bolts, but I don't think that's how it goes. Surely they are close before the blocks and bolts go in? I have studied photos of other 350 front ends, the guard seems to be sitting in the right place.
Thanks

[WideAWAKE]

Have you measured the arch of your fender to make sure it consistent? Or that it’s correct?

It seems your may have a build up of a combo of a tighter arch on your fender pulling the tips towards the wheel AND a rounder arch at the top of your stay putting the stay mounting holes higher up.

Essentially both parts a little out in opposite directions compounding the issue.

If it was supposed to have from the factory a 5mm gap - and your fender is out 5mm and your stays another 5mm…

[Robbo]

It does seem to be too big of a gap to bridge.  Were the stays and fender listed to fit any other model?

Have you undone the stays from the fork lowers and attached the stays properly to the fender to see how far off the lower attachment points would be?

Your forks are stock CB350F ?


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[dave500]

be handy if another 350 was somewhere local to you to physically compare parts?

[brianc]

Another 350 with a good fender is a couple of hours away, I might need to go there.
The arc of this fender is 31cm +/- fairly even.
I've put up a couple more photos. I bolted the stay to the fender with the rubber blocks with the bottom disconnected.
They have to go out too far in my opinion.
My forks - I'm pretty sure are 350F.  Although they look similar to the 400, my internals are all 350, if that counts for anything.
Besides they both have the 18" wheel, fenders should be close??

[brianc]

And some photos

[jlh3rd]

I don't know 350f's, but I've been looking at your issue......here's a pic of a rt side stock, '72 350F, the numbers at the bottom are different, which may not be significant at all and makes no difference, dunno.....
     but it appears if the lower was longer, or extended just a little, the stays would match up with the bolt holes..maybe ?
    so, could that be the issue?

[Flyin900]

The parts don't look far off in your last picture.

Loosen the fork/fender attachment area (2 hex bolts per side of the upper stanchion leg) Loosen the top and bottom JIS screw U section fender brackets, both upper and lower brackets. Align the upper and lower front areas of the lower stanchion mounts on either side of the lower section. There should be 4 pcs X 6mm X 12 mm hex head bolts and washers here.

[brianc]

Thanks Flying900. It was sort of one of the ways I had tried, but went through it again with no joy. Next iteration- With mounting bolts loose I fitted up the lower stay to fender and forks, the gap at the top stay to pull the fender in was pretty close to 20mm. It can be done, but jeez.
Again I searched problems and fenders, I came across a couple of reviews  for the 350 repro fenders on the 4 into 1 online shop site (US based). Surprise - in 2019 this guy says -good fender but he had to force the thing into place!! Looks like I'm not alone.
Still going to pursue an original and compare.

[carnivorous chicken]

I read this and gave it a little thought. Although the first photo you posted seems a little crazy in terms of gap, as I recall even stock fenders and struts need a little push up to get into place. Perhaps try mounting the struts to the fender with the fender mounted to the forks, and then mount the struts to the fork lowers as the last step, pushing the fender up a little. IF it won't go, I guess don't force it... but it might just work.

[brianc]

Thanks,  it's looking more like that this how they are.  But I don't expect this sort of fitment from Mr Honda. Although this is aftermarket, still should be close to original. As noted, I can make all the bits bolt up by various methods- but there is a LOT of 'pre-stessing' happening in that assembly.

[Robbo]

Can you move it out in the sun for a bit or somehow gently warm up the fender?  Then only bolt the back or front stay first and leave it a day or two and see how she fares?  Then repeat for the other stay?  Just thinking this might put less initial overall stress on the install and give the metal time to “adjust”.

EDIT:  scratch that…I see you wrote about that in post #19.

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[Trevor from Warragul]

as I recall even stock fenders and struts need a little push up to get into place.

The NOS 350 Four front fender I bought years ago was a perfect fit...