Topic: Frame Weld: Should I be worried?

[Jp9090]

Previous owner added some funky welds to the front of this cb500. I'm concerned and no idea whether this bike is safe to ride or not. Any thoughts here anyone is willing to share? Am I screwed?

[calj737]

Looks to me like they grafted the neck from a bike to a donor back-half. Where’s the VIN tag on the neck??? There should also be an inscribed corresponding and matching number on the opposite side of the neck to assure the tag=VIN.

[Jp9090]

Looks to me like they grafted the neck from a bike to a donor back-half. Where’s the VIN tag on the neck??? There should also be an inscribed corresponding and matching number on the opposite side of the neck to assure the tag=VIN.

There's no vin tag on the bike but you can very faintly see the vin engraved onto the neck of the bike just besides the weld on one of the photos.

[TwoTired]

I don’t see any developing cracks. But, they could be hidden with paint.  If you are concerned, grind off the paint to expose solid metal with no cracks.  Gonna be a task to see if they maintained original geometry and alignment.  Or, if they just made it sellable.

[newday777]

I'd be concerned about that also. Definitely you will need to clean it up to see if it's safe or not and check the neck angles.
You are in Sacramento? Does it have current registration and title? No vin tag will be a problem.

[PeWe]

If frame is OK with both wheels aiming into same direction......

Is serial number stamped into that part, "steering head"?

- Will a vehicle inspection accept that?
- It look like a frame fix (identity move), adding an OK serial number on another bike.
If serial number came from a crashed bike in need of a better frame.
Or from a not stolen bike to a stolen one as worst case.

[Shtonecb500]

am i the only one who thinks it looks raked? Those welds look like #$%*. i would strip the paint and look at the welds or grind and re weld...idk.

this come with a title?

[Jp9090]

am i the only one who thinks it looks raked? Those welds look like #$%*. i would strip the paint and look at the welds or grind and re weld...idk.

this come with a title?

Luckily did come with a title that matches the numbers on the frame.
I think my next steps will be tearing the bike down, stripping paint and looking for cracks on the frame

[Stev-o]

Wow..that is ugly!  Wonder if there is some bondo under the paint?

[CycleRanger]

Wow..that is ugly!  Wonder if there is some bondo under the paint?

I was wondering the same thing.  I would take a wire wheel and remove the paint, just to check it out.

It looks like it could have been brazed rather than welded.

[ekpent]

+3 on checking to see if some bondo was smeared on there also.

[WideAWAKE]

This may be a dumb question but you’re just seeing those welds now?

They look aweful.

If it were mine, I’d grind it all back and reweld it.

If you have to ask if those are terrible welds, it’s already established your not capable of fixing them (no disrespect, just the facts)

Take it to a welder and get it cleaned up. Your life depends on it.

The most likely chopped the neck off a bike they had a title to and welded it to one they didn’t.

Replacement vin tags are pretty easy to get online if need be.

[jgger]

If there is bondo involved, it looks like the suspect was equally adept at bondo as welding. JMHO.

[Shtonecb500]

I just wanted to come back on here and say don't worry, you might be feeling cheated or upset if that wasn't disclosed to you before hand, or that you have more work in front of you, but you'll get through this. You don't need to be worried because you are being responsible and tackling this, rather than ignoring it and riding it and just hoping for the best. Get that paint off and post those pics, I didn't mean to come off so doom and gloom before.

[PeWe]

If frame is OK, let a pro welder make it to look better, like stock. Grind and weld.

[RAFster122s]

Magnaflux the welds to determine if the welds are sound… just have to strip the frame back to provide enough access for the magnaflux machine. Magnaglow is another trade name for the non destructive testing method. Call around to machine shops to get info and pricing.

Definitely a poorly welded headstock to frame…inadequate equipment or inexperience.

One option would be to buy a clean straight frame and transfer everything over to that titleable frame once you verify it is straight and true… lots of measurements…

[Tracksnblades1]

I believe as 500, wake, and others have already indicated..

The posted photographs depict the obvious skill sets excercised…

[calj737]

Magnaflux the welds to determine if the welds are sound… just have to strip the frame back to provide enough access for the magnaflux machine. Magnaglow is another trade name for the non destructive testing method. Call around to machine shops to get info and pricing.

Definitely a poorly welded headstock to frame…inadequate equipment or inexperience.

One option would be to buy a clean straight frame and transfer everything over to that titleable frame once you verify it is straight and true… lots of measurements…

Completely irrelevant advice. The only thing NDT can identify is porosity or inclusions in a weld. It has no ability to determine penetration unless you cut the part into an examined section.

Grind the paint off, determine that someone smeared some filler (might be JB Weld liquid metal over their weld) and grind it out and have it re-welded. Done and done right.

[Jp9090]

I just wanted to come back on here and say don't worry, you might be feeling cheated or upset if that wasn't disclosed to you before hand, or that you have more work in front of you, but you'll get through this. You don't need to be worried because you are being responsible and tackling this, rather than ignoring it and riding it and just hoping for the best. Get that paint off and post those pics, I didn't mean to come off so doom and gloom before.

Thank you man, I needed to read this. Luckily I have an engine rebuild and clean to get through first but the frame in this condition was starting to get down on me.

I should be able to get some pics with the paint stripped off in the next few days.

Would taking this to a welder for refix be something any welder could do or do I have to look for a specific kind of welder? As many have guessed, no I do not have any welding knowledge!.. yet! Haha taking some classes soon!

[Jp9090]

Would taking this to a welder for refix be something any welder could do or do I have to look for a specific kind of welder? As many have guessed, no I do not have any welding knowledge!.. yet! Haha taking some classes soon!

[Gurp]

am i the only one who thinks it looks raked? Those welds look like #$%*. i would strip the paint and look at the welds or grind and re weld...idk.

this come with a title?

I was thinking the same thing about the rake.

[Shtonecb500]

In the meantime, take pictures and email them to 3-4 machine shops/welders and see if someone will quote you. Send better pictures than the ones you posted here earlier though.

I'm thinking if you are able to just grind away and re weld it wont cost too much money, but if a welder tells you that you need to chop off the neck and weld it back on, you might be able to find a bare titled frame cheaper than what it would probably cost hourly.

Any welder should be able to the grind and put down some stronger welds, they might refer you to someone more motorcycle specific if the neck needs to be cut off completely....but like i said, in that case, it may be cheaper to find a titled frame and swap everything over.

Me personally, I would junk that #$%*er and find a new frame for 150-200, sounds like you have time during motor rebuild to find one.

Edit: properly disclosed, someone would buy that titled frame from you, like a chopper or rat bike guy.

[Stev-o]

Would taking this to a welder for refix be something any welder could do...

Depends on what kind of repair is needed.  If just a grind & "touch-up" weld then, yes, most welders should be able to handle that for relatively cheap.
But if the neck needs to be totally welded back on, it may not be feasible to do that as there are specific angles that need to be set. 

Get 'er stripped and let us look at it.

[Shtonecb500]

am i the only one who thinks it looks raked? Those welds look like #$%*. i would strip the paint and look at the welds orgrind and re weld...idk.

this come with a title?

I was thinking the same thing about the rake.

I actually like some rake on bikes,  looks aggressive.

[calj737]

Would taking this to a welder for refix be something any welder could do or do I have to look for a specific kind of welder? As many have guessed, no I do not have any welding knowledge!.. yet! Haha taking some classes soon!

Anybody with a machine can weld (your frame is evidence of that) but operating a welding machine does not a welder make. Any competent welder can make that repair. Your challenge will be finding the one who will. There’s pretty hefty liability in making that repair, and perhaps even criminal liability for transplanting a neck to another frame. It’s done, but not often advertised, and is supposed to be performed under the scrutiny of a State Police agent who confirms the destruction of the prior VIN-stamped neck.

Having that “repaired” Will possibly involve grinding out the current welds, fashioning some type of jig to hold the neck and frame tubes in alignment (welding tubes frames causes rampant distortion and misalignment) so the newly welded frame is safe, solid, and straight.

Ask around and see what you get. Might need to go donor frame route in the end as it could be cheaper too.