Topic: Planned obsolescence, or not?

[MauiK3]

I’m about to restart the project. Most of my delay has been my garage was jammed full due to my oldest moving in (with 2 grandkids) while she searched for a place, she found it now. I’ve also done some pretty big home projects. I’m hoping for the best, if it doesn’t work I’ll have a difficult decision to make. I’m not used to failing to figure such things out, I hope I can get it going.

[grcamna2]

I’m about to restart the project. Most of my delay has been my garage was jammed full due to my oldest moving in (with 2 grandkids) while she searched for a place, she found it now. I’ve also done some pretty big home projects. I’m hoping for the best, if it doesn’t work I’ll have a difficult decision to make. I’m not used to failing to figure such things out, I hope I can get it going.

You will prevail 

[beemerbum]

Lots of good stuff here.
I too did the iPad upgrade for similar reasons. It is sad to create so much electronic waste but my iPhone I have now is so much better than the first mobile phone I had, it was a lunchbox size truck mounted monster. My first flip phone was ok......for calls, not much else.
Life goes on
I'm just glad I captured a great piece of lasting industrial art in my K3 750. I'm pretty sure no one in my family will use it when I too go to the great gig in the sky but at least I'll go with a smile on my face for having enjoyed it.

Have you tried the Z1 yet ? I have indeed. No question an excellent machine. Nevertheless there is something aesthetically pleasing about the look of the SOHC4 motor. In particular the sculpted cam cover of the CB 750. Twin cams, after all the subsequent UJM's even from Honda just lacked the charm. In any event beauty is in the eye of the beerholder.

[Deltarider]

Even BMW's legendary bikes began to lose lifetime as they all seemed to change to the go-faster, sell cheaper mantra of making bikes that can't make it "to the ton" without extreme care.

You are ill-informed and ignorant of the depth of the BMW bike market. I’d wager there are more BMWs Airheads with well over 100k miles on them than there are SOHCs. That does not even begin to include the K and R model line-up. Their boxer engine is one of the most durable, easy to service, and long living motors made.

I’ve got an ‘87 triple with over 260k miles on the original engine, never rebuilt as an example. It is capable to this day of two-up riding with hard bags for a cross country trip at a moments notice. Quality bikes and sturdy like a forged hammer.

Back in the 70s I met this Austrian BMW mechanic in the Sahara desert. He rode a Russian Dnjepr in which he had fitted a BMW boxer. In the sidecar he had even a little refrigarator built in. At the campfire we discussed bikes and I asked him which one I should buy, if I ever wanted one.
'Not a BMW', he replied to my surprise, 'we're almost finished'. He was referring to rumors that BMW seriously considered ending the manufacture of motorcycles all together and return to small cars again. In the opinion of the Austrian mechanic BMW would not be able to catch up anymore. Well, look where they are now.  
"If I were you, I'd opt for one of the CBFours." When back in Amsterdam, I asked a restorer of British twoseaters. He gave me more or less the same answer: don't buy British. If you want a reliable bike, have a Honda Four.
Now, there's durability and there's reliability and people often mix these up. Yes, boxers can go a long way, but what if every 40.000 km or so you have to take the engine apart for a small 25 cents seal pissing oil? What about cold starts? BMW's were notorious for bad starting, as I also found out when I rode one in British Columbia for a week. And I had made sure everything was up to spec. BTW, have you ever tried to set the ignition on one of them old boxers? Did you like the compromise?
Recently I read an article about the technical aspects of that recently released big boxer (1600cc or so?) in a magazine for professionals in the automotive branche. In it BMW's press release was cited in which the company proudly proclaimed they had projected its technical life for a ton. Are you kidding me? Nowadays every Japanese bike over 500cc is expected to do 3 tons with just regular maintenance.
Is there something good to say about BMW? Certainly, the K75 has a very good reputation and, btw, much better than the earlier K100. But that info is from hearsay, knowing the AA and BMW mecs in the workshops.
My CB500 has been with me since 1980 and apart from flat tyres, it has died en route only once. In torrential rain the ignition (probably the plugs) was soaked. Next morning, without me having done anything, it started right up again. Another event that I have described here in this forum, was the failure of the IGN SWITCH right before entering a tunnel. Luckily just by fiddling the key, I was able to make it home. So far my report on reliability and I guess my 43 years experience is enough to be well-informed. The bike is 47 years old, btw.

[MauiK3]

Yep, the old Hondas surely have that "something" and a lot of it.

[Rosinante]

Another old fart here.  I wish I had known, when I was younger, the importance of buying quality.  In the long run, quality things are less expensive because they last longer.  They also perform better in the meantime.  A few years ago I got tired of having a drawer full of screwdrivers with bad tips.  Instead of getting another $20 set of cheap ones, I splurged for the Snap-On set.  Wish I had done that in 1973.

Yes, today's stuff is made to eventually fail, after poor performance.  I walk on by those today, and purchase something worth buying instead.

[C317414]

Another old fart here.  I wish I had known, when I was younger, the importance of buying quality.  In the long run, quality things are less expensive because they last longer.  They also perform better in the meantime.  A few years ago I got tired of having a drawer full of screwdrivers with bad tips.  Instead of getting another $20 set of cheap ones, I splurged for the Snap-On set.  Wish I had done that in 1973.

Yes, today's stuff is made to eventually fail, after poor performance.  I walk on by those today, and purchase something worth buying instead.

Many are not willing to pay more for higher quality, this eventually leads to the demise of some companies.   For example, my wife and I like using a traveling lawn sprinkler to water our yard.  Not knowing better, we bought a cheap one, and it lasted a year.   After that,  I did some research, and bought a high-quality, expensive one from National Walking Sprinkler.  I ran great for over 10 years. 

After cleaning and lubing it earlier this month, I noticed that it was not running as well.  I decided to take it apart to replace some of the worn parts (they are fully rebuildable).  When I went to order the parts I was surprised to find out that the company, established in 1937, has gone out of business. 

https://www.nationalwalkingsprinkler.com/

[Rosinante]

Sadly, the overwhelming majority of consumers here prefer the least possible cost products, nearly always made in China, found at a certain very large retailer.  Among other things, this is a transfer of wealth and jobs from one country to another.  I wonder what would happen if......aw, nevermind.

[calj737]

Sadly, the overwhelming majority of consumers here prefer the least possible cost products, nearly always made in China, found at a certain very large retailer.  Among other things, this is a transfer of wealth and jobs from one country to another.  I wonder what would happen if......aw, nevermind.

Yep. “Thy name is hypocrisy…”

[willbird]

Sadly, the overwhelming majority of consumers here prefer the least possible cost products, nearly always made in China, found at a certain very large retailer.  Among other things, this is a transfer of wealth and jobs from one country to another.  I wonder what would happen if......aw, nevermind.

I vastly prefer walking into a brick and mortar store and buying a tool or part that I need.

The store which was not named actually does have product that you can walk in and buy.

For darn sure not all my tools come from there, not even close. But my 5 drawer tool cart that I just used at work did, I could have ordered one or bought one from a tool truck for 3X-4X more money that would not offer me the user anything of worth for the extra $$.

Some made the same type of grumbles about the new 1972 CB750K my dad bought new too ;-).....and I took it for a ride today, it is still doing what it was bought to do :-).

[calj737]

But my 5 drawer tool cart that I just used at work did, I could have ordered one or bought one from a tool truck for 3X-4X more money that would not offer me the user anything of worth for the extra $$.

I have heard many cite this scenario of paying much more for a tool from a “truck” and disagreeing with the price delta versus a store-bought brand. But for most professionals, a truck comes by weekly, and if you need something or need to exchange/replace/repair something, if there’s one on the truck it’s yours on the spot. No questions asked, no receipts needed, no time wasted in lines with consumers. Time vs money and convenience. Well worth the delta.

And I beg to differ about the durability and of a truck brand tool box and a store bought tool box. The drawer guides and metal are substantially stronger in the truck brands. My son bought one from a store and sits next to my truck brand (19 years old vs 15 months old). His drawers are broken, won’t stay closed, and his power ports are all dysfunctional. Meanwhile mine (I don’t have power ports) still hold lots more tools than his and close with a gentle bump.

[willbird]

But my 5 drawer tool cart that I just used at work did, I could have ordered one or bought one from a tool truck for 3X-4X more money that would not offer me the user anything of worth for the extra $$.

I have heard many cite this scenario of paying much more for a tool from a “truck” and disagreeing with the price delta versus a store-bought brand. But for most professionals, a truck comes by weekly, and if you need something or need to exchange/replace/repair something, if there’s one on the truck it’s yours on the spot. No questions asked, no receipts needed, no time wasted in lines with consumers. Time vs money and convenience. Well worth the delta.

And I beg to differ about the durability and of a truck brand tool box and a store bought tool box. The drawer guides and metal are substantially stronger in the truck brands. My son bought one from a store and sits next to my truck brand (19 years old vs 15 months old). His drawers are broken, won’t stay closed, and his power ports are all dysfunctional. Meanwhile mine (I don’t have power ports) still hold lots more tools than his and close with a gentle bump.

I work in Industrial Maintenance. There is no truck that comes by every week. 20 folks at least have this same 5 drawer tool carts in every color they make. None of them have failed. We roll them all over the building across bumpy expansion joints too.

The store we are talking about without naming it does sell some stuff only worth it's price or maybe not even that. But that 5 drawer on sale right now for $199 is not one of those ;-).

I have had mine for 3 years and counting. I also have the lid totally loaded with sockets held on with powerful magnet strips. I did upgrade the lid shocks to compensate for sticking all that stuff on the inside of the lid.

And any of the 7 days of the week 8AM to 8PM a person can walk into a brick and mortar and load one up. Now they DO have to take about an hour and assemble it.  The low price point makes modifying it to suit the user an easier choice too.

https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/threads/modifications-to-the-hf-4-and-5-drawer-service-carts-what-changes-have-you-made.137365/

I love spotting these in YouTube videos, any time I see a possible one I keep my eyes peeled to see what brand it is ;-).


Bill

[bwaller]

Interesting topic Mike. I worked in motorcycle shops until 76 and felt the same way about the sohc fours. I've owned a 750 for 50 years, but enjoyed the smaller fours for what they were intended to be.

I roadaced, then retired, then discovered vintage, but for me I was racing those same Honda fours, so nothing changed except a period of time! A CB550 engine with double original HP and never had a DNF. Awesome. My 750K3 sat in my shop while I scratched my racing itch. Now I'm riding it again and feeling very familiar on it after so many years.

I agree and doubt there was such a thing as your "planned obsolescence" with these bikes. Ride on!