Author Topic: 3 yellow wires meltathon  (Read 994 times)

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Offline Romhog

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3 yellow wires meltathon
« on: April 30, 2024, 12:02:56 PM »
So, I had the classic trapped on the road with complete electrical loss. Looked right to my wires and sure enough, my fully insulated disconnects were brittle and brown. (I have the updated rectifier regulator and it's been working fine for a few years)
Anyhow, right above the connections is where there was also a wire melt through. I was shocked to see it above the connections as thinking in the direction the electricity flows I would have assumed the connectors to create a resistance point and a buildup cause a melt through before the connector. *Shrug* so... You can see the slits in the melted wire above my connections, please ignore the black electrical tape that was an emergency splice in troubleshooting I'm going to remove that ultimately. Anyhow that's the back story and here's my main question, I was going to just solder comparable wire gauge in place there but that's going to double the amount of connections so..
 does anybody know if there is a high amperage jumper connector that can span a few more extra inches because I have no wire slack available. And because I have the rectifier regulator combo the three yellow wires obviously go straight into the box so even if I cut the wires way back closer to the stator I'm still looking at four connection points per wire , and I'm trying to avoid that.

Offline newday777

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Re: 3 yellow wires meltathon
« Reply #1 on: April 30, 2024, 12:43:21 PM »
It looks like someone has removed the original block connector at some point. How long has it run that way?
What bike is it on?
The usual culprit is dirty connectors causing resistance and heat.
Stu
Honda Parts manager in the mid 1970s Nashua Honda
My current rides
1975 K5 Planet Blue my summer ride, it was a friend's bike I worked with at the Honda shop in 76, lots of fun to be on it again
1976 K6 Anteres Red rebuilding project, was originally my brother's that I set up from the crate, it'll breath again soon!
Project 750s, 2 K4, 2 K6, 1 K8
2008 GL1800 my daily ride and cross country runner

Prior bikes....
1972 Suzuki GT380 I had charge of it for a year in 1973 while my friend was deployed and learned to love street riding....
New CB450 K7 after my friend returned...
New CB750 K5 Planet Blue, demise by ex cousin in law at 9,000 miles...
New CB750 K6 Anteres Red, to replace the totaled K5, I sold this K6 at 45k in 1983, I had heavily modified it, many great memories on it and have missed it greatly.....
1983 GL1100A, 1999 GL1500 SE, 1999 GL1500A

Offline Pbeattie89

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Re: 3 yellow wires meltathon
« Reply #2 on: April 30, 2024, 01:14:46 PM »
I'm not a 100% sure where you would get an appropriate connector but my recommendation for replacement wire will be to stay away from PVC sheathed wire it doesn't have a high enough temperature rating for the application.
What you'll be wanting to look for is TXL wire, probably in 16 Gage. Crimping The wire repair would also be better than solder, where it is a high vibration situation as well.
But solder will do in a pinch.

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Offline willbird

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Re: 3 yellow wires meltathon
« Reply #3 on: April 30, 2024, 01:49:07 PM »
I'm not a 100% sure where you would get an appropriate connector but my recommendation for replacement wire will be to stay away from PVC sheathed wire it doesn't have a high enough temperature rating for the application.
What you'll be wanting to look for is TXL wire, probably in 16 Gage. Crimping The wire repair would also be better than solder, where it is a high vibration situation as well.
But solder will do in a pinch.

Sent from my SM-G991W using Tapatalk

Solder often runs back up the wire and makes that area brittle and prone to break off as well from what I have seen in other places in the past.

Offline Romhog

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Re: 3 yellow wires meltathon
« Reply #4 on: April 30, 2024, 03:46:36 PM »
Oh it's a CB550. And thanks for the recommendation on sticking with crimped I'm just going to see if I can find some longer butt splice crimp connectors that could possibly bridge the gap I need to cover  and minimize the connection points for the wire. And yes the rectifier regulator that I bought had a typically white box connector on it which I cut off because it didn't match what I had on the other end. (Which I think was nothing from a previous mod); thanks for the ideas thus far

Offline madmtnmotors

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Re: 3 yellow wires meltathon
« Reply #5 on: April 30, 2024, 06:52:49 PM »
I really don't like those single crimp connectors. The double crimp connectors with a separate insulator like those available from Vintage Connections are my go-to for all motorcycle and automotive electrical connections. Here is a sample from another thread:

I highly recommend the proper crimp tool. Here is a copy of my post from another thread, ironically titled "Electrical Connectors":



Strip it. I usually strip about a 1/4" to 5/16". Three-eights is a bit much and not necessary:






Don't forget the insulator! (ask me how I know):




I finally figured out (after about three tries) that it's easier to load the connector in the crimp tool first. Note the stepped jaw. The trailing end has a higher relief so as not to over crimp the insulation:




Ratchet down on it just enough to hold it:






You only need about a 1/4" of insulation extended into the connector. Too much and you get into the part of the crimp that should be catching wire only. The jaws are pretty wide and hard to see inside, so I use my thumbnail as a guide when inserting the wire:






Crimp it!:




Voila' (as opposed to "Viola" which everyone knows is a musical instrument):




And finally, the insulator:




Procedure is the same for other types of connectors, just be sure to use the right insulator. Here we have the insulator for the female bullet:




Load the tool:




Crimp it... crimp it real good... and voila'! (as opposed to "viola" which everyone knows is a musical instrument):




Slide the insulator into place:




Dang! This is how they must of looked when the bike was new!:






Give the wire a tug when you're done. Occasionally I will get a loose crimp, but most of the time it is a result of smaller gauge wire. In those cases I will strip 1/2" of insulation and double the wire back on itself to mimic a heavier gauge wire. The double crimp is considered "gas tight" and highly resistant to corrosion at the crimp. These are my go-to connectors for all things automotive.  8)
TAMTF...


Wilbur



Projects:
"Evolution": http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=100352.0
"P.O. Debacle": http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,126692.msg1441661.html#msg1441661
F2/F3 O-rings: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=113672.msg1300721#msg1300721
Cam Tower Studs: https://www.mcmaster.com/#93210a017/=t19sgp
Clean up that nasty harness: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=137351.msg1549191#msg1549191
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,148188.msg1688494.html#msg1688494
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,139544.msg1579364.html#msg1579364
                                          
Charging system diagnosis: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=1012.msg8345#msg8345
Get the manuals: http://manuals.sohc4.net/cb750k/
The Dragon: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=45183.msg1571675#msg1571675
Headlight Switch: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=113986.msg1283236#msg1283236
Branden's leak free top end thread: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=107040.0
Engine Lifting Made Easy: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,58210.msg1684742.html#msg1684742
                                      http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,100352.msg1675840.html#msg1675840
Static and Dynamic Timing: http://www.hondachopper.com/garage/carb_info/timing/timing1.html
Airbox Gasket Replacement: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,114485.msg1290000.html#msg1290000
"Café" : http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,84697.msg953814.html#msg953814
PD Carb Choke Linkage: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,100352.msg1669248.html#msg1669248
                                    http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,110931.msg1248354.html#msg1248354
                                    http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,48858.msg515204.html#msg515204
Follow up on your damn posts: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,144305.msg1791605.html#msg1791605
Taiwanese Cam Chain Tensioners:  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,155043.msg1774841.html#msg1774841
Gumtwo Seat Cover: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,164440.msg1897366.html#msg1897366
Primary Drive: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,166063.msg1919278.html#msg1919278
Tank Latch: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,165975.msg1919495.html#msg1919495
Shorten your forks: http://vintage-and-classic-honda-s.456789.n3.nabble.com/How-to-shorten-forks-td4042465.html DO NOT CUT THE SPRINGS!
Clutch How To: http://vintage-and-classic-honda-s.456789.n3.nabble.com/How-to-change-and-adjust-a-clutch-SOHC-td4040391.html
Late model K7/K8/F2/F3 front sprocket cover removal: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,178428.msg2072279.html#msg2072279
630 to 530 conversion: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180710.msg2094423.html#msg2094423

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Offline grcamna2

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Re: 3 yellow wires meltathon
« Reply #6 on: April 30, 2024, 10:49:49 PM »
Excellent tutorial Wilbur.
75' CB400F/'bunch o' parts' & 81' CB125S modded to a 'CB200S'
  I love the small ones too !
Do your BEST...nobody can take that away from you.

Offline Romhog

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Re: 3 yellow wires meltathon
« Reply #7 on: May 01, 2024, 06:58:20 AM »
Thanks mad!

Heh, a devil whispered wagooooo in my ear.
Jkjk




Offline Bankerdanny

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Re: 3 yellow wires meltathon
« Reply #8 on: May 01, 2024, 09:33:39 AM »
This is a common issue for GL1000 owners. On my '77 I even installed a brand new OEM style block connector from Vintage Connections and it melted anyway. I soldered the connections together, which ended the problem. Neither of my 550's had any problems with the alternator connections, but if I did and didn't want a permanent connection, I would go MadMountain's route and use individual OEM style bullets from Vintage Connections. I keep one of their multi connector box sets on hand all the time just in case I decide a connector needs replacing.
"The problem with quotes on the Internet is that you never know if they're true" - Abraham Lincoln

Current: '76 CB750F. Previous:  '75 CB550F, 2007 Yamaha Vino 125 Scooter, '75 Harley FXE Superglide, '77 GL1000, '77 CB550k, '68 Suzuki K10 80, '68 Yamaha YR2, '69 BMW R69S, '71 Honda SL175, '02 Royal Enfield Bullet 500, '89 Yamaha FJ1200

Online Don R

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Re: 3 yellow wires meltathon
« Reply #9 on: May 01, 2024, 09:44:57 AM »
 I cleaned and di-electric greased the original connector on my 79 gl1000. This is a reminder to check it, I had a blade fuse holder melt down a couple of years ago and caused me to injure myself trying to get it out of traffic.
No matter how many times you paint over a shadow, it's still there.
 CEO at the no kill motorcycle shop.
 You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows.

Offline grcamna2

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Re: 3 yellow wires meltathon
« Reply #10 on: May 01, 2024, 10:48:07 AM »
This is a common issue for GL1000 owners. On my '77 I even installed a brand new OEM style block connector from Vintage Connections and it melted anyway. I soldered the connections together, which ended the problem. Neither of my 550's had any problems with the alternator connections, but if I did and didn't want a permanent connection, I would go MadMountain's route and use individual OEM style bullets from Vintage Connections. I keep one of their multi connector box sets on hand all the time just in case I decide a connector needs replacing.

I looked at their site and noticed their #CK-1 box of connectors;which box did you purchase and how much did they charge you ?
75' CB400F/'bunch o' parts' & 81' CB125S modded to a 'CB200S'
  I love the small ones too !
Do your BEST...nobody can take that away from you.

Offline madmtnmotors

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Re: 3 yellow wires meltathon
« Reply #11 on: May 01, 2024, 04:20:43 PM »
If you anticipate connecting to any of the stock bullet connectors be sure to get the 3.5mm to match the stock connectors. The 4mm connectors would be ever so slightly larger than stock. A new 4mm male connector would work with an existing 3.5mm female, but a new 4mm female connector would be a poor fit to an existing 3.5mm male.
TAMTF...


Wilbur



Projects:
"Evolution": http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=100352.0
"P.O. Debacle": http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,126692.msg1441661.html#msg1441661
F2/F3 O-rings: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=113672.msg1300721#msg1300721
Cam Tower Studs: https://www.mcmaster.com/#93210a017/=t19sgp
Clean up that nasty harness: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=137351.msg1549191#msg1549191
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,148188.msg1688494.html#msg1688494
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,139544.msg1579364.html#msg1579364
                                          
Charging system diagnosis: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=1012.msg8345#msg8345
Get the manuals: http://manuals.sohc4.net/cb750k/
The Dragon: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=45183.msg1571675#msg1571675
Headlight Switch: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=113986.msg1283236#msg1283236
Branden's leak free top end thread: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=107040.0
Engine Lifting Made Easy: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,58210.msg1684742.html#msg1684742
                                      http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,100352.msg1675840.html#msg1675840
Static and Dynamic Timing: http://www.hondachopper.com/garage/carb_info/timing/timing1.html
Airbox Gasket Replacement: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,114485.msg1290000.html#msg1290000
"Café" : http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,84697.msg953814.html#msg953814
PD Carb Choke Linkage: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,100352.msg1669248.html#msg1669248
                                    http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,110931.msg1248354.html#msg1248354
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Follow up on your damn posts: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,144305.msg1791605.html#msg1791605
Taiwanese Cam Chain Tensioners:  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,155043.msg1774841.html#msg1774841
Gumtwo Seat Cover: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,164440.msg1897366.html#msg1897366
Primary Drive: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,166063.msg1919278.html#msg1919278
Tank Latch: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,165975.msg1919495.html#msg1919495
Shorten your forks: http://vintage-and-classic-honda-s.456789.n3.nabble.com/How-to-shorten-forks-td4042465.html DO NOT CUT THE SPRINGS!
Clutch How To: http://vintage-and-classic-honda-s.456789.n3.nabble.com/How-to-change-and-adjust-a-clutch-SOHC-td4040391.html
Late model K7/K8/F2/F3 front sprocket cover removal: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,178428.msg2072279.html#msg2072279
630 to 530 conversion: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180710.msg2094423.html#msg2094423

Sent from my Tandy TRS-80!

Offline grcamna2

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Re: 3 yellow wires meltathon
« Reply #12 on: May 01, 2024, 09:10:12 PM »
If you anticipate connecting to any of the stock bullet connectors be sure to get the 3.5mm to match the stock connectors. The 4mm connectors would be ever so slightly larger than stock. A new 4mm male connector would work with an existing 3.5mm female, but a new 4mm female connector would be a poor fit to an existing 3.5mm male.

Ok,I would like to get the 3.5mm.
 I was looking at their kits and the CK-1 was roughly $35 and the other one was $65.
Do you know the difference ?
75' CB400F/'bunch o' parts' & 81' CB125S modded to a 'CB200S'
  I love the small ones too !
Do your BEST...nobody can take that away from you.

Online Don R

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Re: 3 yellow wires meltathon
« Reply #13 on: May 01, 2024, 10:15:33 PM »
 CK-2 has more stuff in it.
No matter how many times you paint over a shadow, it's still there.
 CEO at the no kill motorcycle shop.
 You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows.

Offline grcamna2

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Re: 3 yellow wires meltathon
« Reply #14 on: May 01, 2024, 10:52:01 PM »
CK-2 has more stuff in it.

A mix of 3.5 & 4.0mm ends ?
75' CB400F/'bunch o' parts' & 81' CB125S modded to a 'CB200S'
  I love the small ones too !
Do your BEST...nobody can take that away from you.

Offline rotortiller

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Re: 3 yellow wires meltathon
« Reply #15 on: May 02, 2024, 02:33:49 AM »
madmtnmotors does good work which is refreshing to see. So many just hack away with hardware store connectors and pliers.

rt

Offline madmtnmotors

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Re: 3 yellow wires meltathon
« Reply #16 on: May 02, 2024, 04:02:45 AM »
madmtnmotors does good work which is refreshing to see. So many just hack away with hardware store connectors and pliers.

rt

LOL! Getting it right doesn't take much effort, and certainly much less effort than doing it marginally multiple times. Then there's the time spent troubleshooting items that are already "done". I've seen hacked up harnesses supplemented with lamp cord, wires that are smaller gauge than the original, and the "coup de grâce" where one or more fuses are wrapped in foil...

I can restore a harness in about two weeks working evenings (since my full time job encroaches on my leisure pursuits) and weekends:

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,137351.msg1549191.html#msg1549191
TAMTF...


Wilbur



Projects:
"Evolution": http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=100352.0
"P.O. Debacle": http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,126692.msg1441661.html#msg1441661
F2/F3 O-rings: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=113672.msg1300721#msg1300721
Cam Tower Studs: https://www.mcmaster.com/#93210a017/=t19sgp
Clean up that nasty harness: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=137351.msg1549191#msg1549191
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,148188.msg1688494.html#msg1688494
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,139544.msg1579364.html#msg1579364
                                          
Charging system diagnosis: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=1012.msg8345#msg8345
Get the manuals: http://manuals.sohc4.net/cb750k/
The Dragon: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=45183.msg1571675#msg1571675
Headlight Switch: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=113986.msg1283236#msg1283236
Branden's leak free top end thread: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=107040.0
Engine Lifting Made Easy: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,58210.msg1684742.html#msg1684742
                                      http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,100352.msg1675840.html#msg1675840
Static and Dynamic Timing: http://www.hondachopper.com/garage/carb_info/timing/timing1.html
Airbox Gasket Replacement: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,114485.msg1290000.html#msg1290000
"Café" : http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,84697.msg953814.html#msg953814
PD Carb Choke Linkage: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,100352.msg1669248.html#msg1669248
                                    http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,110931.msg1248354.html#msg1248354
                                    http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,48858.msg515204.html#msg515204
Follow up on your damn posts: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,144305.msg1791605.html#msg1791605
Taiwanese Cam Chain Tensioners:  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,155043.msg1774841.html#msg1774841
Gumtwo Seat Cover: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,164440.msg1897366.html#msg1897366
Primary Drive: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,166063.msg1919278.html#msg1919278
Tank Latch: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,165975.msg1919495.html#msg1919495
Shorten your forks: http://vintage-and-classic-honda-s.456789.n3.nabble.com/How-to-shorten-forks-td4042465.html DO NOT CUT THE SPRINGS!
Clutch How To: http://vintage-and-classic-honda-s.456789.n3.nabble.com/How-to-change-and-adjust-a-clutch-SOHC-td4040391.html
Late model K7/K8/F2/F3 front sprocket cover removal: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,178428.msg2072279.html#msg2072279
630 to 530 conversion: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180710.msg2094423.html#msg2094423

Sent from my Tandy TRS-80!

Offline Bankerdanny

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Re: 3 yellow wires meltathon
« Reply #17 on: May 03, 2024, 09:21:25 AM »
This is a common issue for GL1000 owners. On my '77 I even installed a brand new OEM style block connector from Vintage Connections and it melted anyway. I soldered the connections together, which ended the problem. Neither of my 550's had any problems with the alternator connections, but if I did and didn't want a permanent connection, I would go MadMountain's route and use individual OEM style bullets from Vintage Connections. I keep one of their multi connector box sets on hand all the time just in case I decide a connector needs replacing.

I looked at their site and noticed their #CK-1 box of connectors;bwhich box did you purchase and how much did they charge you ?

The CK one is what I purchased, I've actually bought that one twice over the years. When I did the GL connection in 2011 I bought the block I needed ala carte. The last set a bought was a couple years ago, I don't recall why I paid, but it was around $30. The connectors are an exact replacement for OEM, which is why I try to always have some on hand. I've never opted for their crimping tool, but I have heard it works really well.
"The problem with quotes on the Internet is that you never know if they're true" - Abraham Lincoln

Current: '76 CB750F. Previous:  '75 CB550F, 2007 Yamaha Vino 125 Scooter, '75 Harley FXE Superglide, '77 GL1000, '77 CB550k, '68 Suzuki K10 80, '68 Yamaha YR2, '69 BMW R69S, '71 Honda SL175, '02 Royal Enfield Bullet 500, '89 Yamaha FJ1200

Offline RAFster122s

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Re: 3 yellow wires meltathon
« Reply #18 on: May 05, 2024, 04:52:07 PM »
CK-2 has more stuff in it.

A mix of 3.5 & 4.0mm ends ?

No, you specify when ordering if you want 3.5 or 4mm, Hondas of our vintage use 3.5mm
David- back in the desert SW!

Offline Johnie

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Re: 3 yellow wires meltathon
« Reply #19 on: May 05, 2024, 05:58:29 PM »
I cleaned and di-electric greased the original connector on my 79 gl1000. This is a reminder to check it, I had a blade fuse holder melt down a couple of years ago and caused me to injure myself trying to get it out of traffic.
I did the same on my gl1000 Don. My 76 only had 15,000 miles on it, but I pulled connector apart and there is no sign of overheating in the connector of the wires. I also cleaned the contacts and put dielectric grease on it. Will keep an eye on it.
1970 CB750K0 - Candy Ruby Red
1973 CB750K3 - Candy Bacchus Olive or Sunflake Orange
1970 Chevy Chevelle SS396 - Cortez Silver
1976 GL1000 Sulphur Yellow

Oshkosh, WI  USA