Topic: OK, almost done. Need some input!

[HondaMan]

As far as I know the CB450Ks originally did not have the slanted version friction disks. Not that it matters much: they're interchangable. IIRC the slanted ones were first introduced on later CB500s. Partnumber went from 22201-323-000 to 22201-323-010.

Yep, that's how it went: the last 3 digits of the plate number changed when ordering the 'normal' plates, but were later substituted to a common part number for all the bikes that used them. Honda always "fixed" immediate problems like that, and then later consolidated their part numbers for the same part in multiple bikes by changing the middle number to something along the lines of "-MG8-" or similar.

[bryanj]

You dont rerivet the clutch basket after replacing dampers, you tap the holes and use countersunk allen screws locktighted in.
The primary dampers you split the primary gear by removing circlip.
If you meant primary chain you dont, you remove crank and replace as a complete chain

[Oddjob]

You don’t, you tap the pillars where the rivets fit to 6mm, you then use thin headed socket screws to bolt it together afterwards. Need to have a head on the bolts less than 3mm or it will foul the gear change mechanism behind the clutch.

[HondaMan]

Need to have a head on the bolts less than 3mm or it will foul the gear change mechanism behind the clutch.

Good catch to note there, Oddjob: the modern DIN 6mm screws have taller (and wider) heads than the older JIS form.

[Oddjob]

Actually it was the rivets Honda used which dictated the clearance, they stood 3mm proud at the back of the clutch basket, so any alternative bolt/rivet needed to have the same or less clearance, most were too tall head wise, it took a little bit of searching to find suitable bolts with the right size head etc.

[hawaiikid]

Aloha Mark, interesting reading about the 500/550 bikes. If you ever do a book on the 350/400 models i want to be first in line for one. I have a lot of interesting articles i can donate if you would like them.
just passed 65000 miles on my 400. Couldn't have don it without all your help and valuable information.

[HondaMan]

Aloha Mark, interesting reading about the 500/550 bikes. If you ever do a book on the 350/400 models i want to be first in line for one. I have a lot of interesting articles i can donate if you would like them.
just passed 65000 miles on my 400. Couldn't have don it without all your help and valuable information.

Wow, you're rockin', HK! That's terrific miles on that bike. I know it runs well, you've put the hard work into it to make it do that. Nice job!
There's a bunch of people wanting me to do the 350F/400F, but I haven't done the research [yet] to find out how possible it might be. I have a 350F of my own which would be great for the pictures and stages, don't have a 400F [yet], though. My shed is also currently full, so I'm out of space until I get one of the 750's in there built and sold. Maybe it could fund that book? Dunno yet.

[jlh3rd]

Have you mentioned that the UK model ranges, specs and parts fitted are different for both the 500 and 550?

I'm a little "short" in that area (other than mentioning it) due to lack of hands-on experience with the Euro bikes (other than 1 of them). It's hard to learn something you've never seen? 

I agree Mark. Maybe put a mention in the front of the book that only USA models / specs etc are covered and the rest of the world has different models and varients. It's very confusing for many owners here in UK (and other countries I expect) when, as an example, the UK had the 500K1 up until late 1975 and we didn't get any 550 model at all until the F1 in 1976 and in USA the model range was totally different. Plus, in USA bike models are refered to by their model year, in UK they are only know by the actual model, ie, 500K0,500K1,550F1 and F2 and 550K3, that is entire model range for 500/550 from 1971-1978.
"[/ Plus, in USA bike models are refered to by their model year," in UK they are only know by the actual model,

officially only after 1973 in the U.S.....prior to that , the actual model should be used to avoid confusion.

[Redline it]

it's been a while since i posted or replied on this site. i don't have any input on this post for book writing for giants in the sohc4 website, such as Mark and some others here.

i don't write all that well, and it seems to reflect why i've stayed away from this site. and today i opened it, luckily as i forgot all the passwords to google, lost my phone. twice. but what reached out was the author of this post mentioning the spirit of younger generations who have lost interest in these complex inline 4s that honda milestoned the world in the greatest bikes ever.

sad as it is, us with collections, mine are 3 cb400f, 75, 76 and a yellow one, for parts, the 76 i bought in 1980, the frame has 42100 miles on it, with the yellow one's motor in it, and the bike still runs as much time as it gets between the newest one, and a xr650r 2000, i'm 65 all my friend are dead or dying, i came from the 60's district 37 desert races. i'm in checkers mc. the other day i'm in the albersons, in line, oh it was on thanksgiving, a guy behind me, goes, so you a checker? i'm like yeah, lifer. i go, who are you? he says, I'm Eddie Moulder. i wanted to kneel and kiss the ground he was standing on. the last cb400f 75 i just bought for 5k, i was on my home from my cousins house to buy 2 triumphs 650 bonevilles 1968. that deal fell through, but Eddie if anyone knows any thing about the 50s of desert racing in california, Eddie was king on a triumph through the 60s. with ronnie nelson, whitey martino, rich thordwaldsen, anyway, my cat is beggin me to tuck her in.

all i can say is keep riding hard, until that last day and just hope that all these bikes we got and ride doesn't fall into ingrateful hands, we're lagacies, giants of a time, i've been riding the same sierra pelona mountain ranges for 50 yrs. and still never see any other riders up there. my cat isn't showing any patience. i gotta go.

[PeWe]

I sent primary hubs to Germany where they replaced the rubbers and riveted it together again. Both my bikes got new rubbers done.
They do 500/550 too.
Possible to order a kit and do yourself.
https://www.fourever-classic-parts.de/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=26&Itemid=31

[Oddjob]

Pewe this thread is about the 500/550 and the primary hubs on those engines doesn’t have a riveted primary hub, in fact it’s very easy to change the damper rubbers yourself. However if you meant the clutch basket then 2 things must be factored in. First the cost of sending it to Germany and back, they ain’t light, so the cost I’d imagine would be quite expensive plus of course having them do the job for you won’t be cheap either. Secondly, this is where I bought my rubbers from, they won’t post out of Europe, I’m in the UK and the last time I checked we were still part of Europe but they flatly refused to post even to the UK, whether that was sore grapes because of Brexit I don’t know. In the end I got a mate who lives in Finland to buy me 6 sets and post them onto me, I kept 2 sets for myself and I sold the rest at cost to friends who needed them. The rivets they send are frankly unusable unless you have an hydraulic press. I didn’t, so I tapped the towers to 6mm and used bolts instead, the holes don’t even need drilling as they are the right size to take the tap. It’s a far easier system than trying to re-rivet the basket tbh, plus doing it yourself makes buying just the rubbers far cheaper and more satisfying.

It also allows you to reopen the basket n the future if it’s needed and to replace the rubbers again in the event they need doing again.

One thing I thought I’d add, the 500 has more teeth on the clutch gear than the 550, one tooth more iirc, the primary gear has one tooth less than the 550 to compensate. So you cannot for instance fit a 550 clutch basket onto a 500 engine and vice versa because they don’t mesh up. If you change the primary gear as well then it does but then you need to fit the 550 clutch case in order to operate the clutch and that doesn’t work due to Honda adding a small dip in the sealing edge which allows for all the engine oil to flood out. There are ways past that but they ain’t easy.
However one thing is now possible, you can fit the rear gear off a 550 onto a 500 basket, so long as you also change the primary gear. Why, I can hear you ask would you do that? Well because it alters the gearing very slightly, so would this change make any appreciable change to the power delivery, acceleration or MPG ? We don’t know because afaik no one has compared it. So when I get my 500 engine back on the road I thought I’d test that theory and see if it does, I love experimenting with stuff like that and this mod allows that to be possible.

One mate I sold a set of the clutch damper rubbers to fitted his to his 550K3, before it was noisy on tickover and after it wasn’t so changing these rubbers does make a difference. 

I also love doing stuff no one has done before, so whilst my clutch basket was apart I had the alloy sections ceramic coated in gold. I had the gear ceramic coated in a special coating that reduces noise and friction between the gears teeth, they do gearbox gears in this coating for that reason. It’s a sort of gunmetal grey colour. When assembled the clutch looks really smart tbh but of course unless you look into the dipstick hole you’d never see it, unless of course you fit a window in the clutch cover, now that’s an interesting idea and one the shape of the 500 clutch cover lends itself too.

Sorry Mark for going a little off the topic, any ideas on whether changing the clutch gear over would affect the 500 engine?

[PeWe]

Yes, I know this is about 500/550.
You have not used the link? Possible to order parts for 500/550. No need to ship anything to them.
For CB500/550 clutch ...

Language issues? You browser can translate.

[Oddjob]

Appreciate that Pewe but you started the post with a reference to a 750 primary hub, in fact you didn’t even say it was for a 750 so anyone not clued up on the 500/550 may think you were saying it was for a 500/550.

As for the link, as I said, they said to me they wouldn’t post outside the EU, whether they’ll post to the US is not known, maybe they were, as I said, making a point about Brexit with me. You can ask if they’ll post to the US but expect to be disappointed. They are not exactly friendly people who run the business imo.

[Phoenix]

I've got a 750 so not involved.  If you have a 550, DON'T THINK ABOUT IT.  jUST BUY IT.

[Little_Phil]

Didn't know it was possible to fit the 550 clutch basket to a 500, But that would change speeds to be approx.  6% faster.

[Oddjob]

It’s possible but not exactly easy. If you can block up the 550 clutch case with either weld or some sort of filler then it’s doable. I know a couple that have done it. It’s the same xtra dip below the gasket line on the casing that’s the biggest problem