Topic: Gap between top of fork cover and top bridge after tapered bearing instal

[BillinSC]

So I just installed a set of All Balls tapered bearings on my '73 CB 750. I'm certain all the races are seated and the correct washers are being used and in the correct position/order (per the instructions). The thing is that now when re-assembling the front forks (in particular the upper fork covers), there seems to be about an extra 1/8" gap between the top of the cover (with the upper isolator in place on the cover) and the under side of the top bridge (triple tree). I seem to recall when disassembling there was little to no gap and the covers were slightly wedged in place. It's almost as though the upper and lower triple tree are now a little further apart? I disassembled the triple tree to double check that the races are seated properly and the bearing on the steering stem is also seated properly (there does not seem to be any gaps that would account for the 1/8" gap I'm seeing up top).

I also tightened the spanner nut to the point where everything was pretty snug and a bit of turning resistance and then backed off about a half turn until turning was nice and smooth. So it seems as though all the parts are compressed properly.

The only thing I can think of that would make up this difference is the washer under the bearing and dust cover on the steering stem. I did the measurement of the old bearings and ended up using the thinner of the two washers provided in order to be within the +-1mm height measurement specified in the instructions. Also the steering stops seem to be right where they should be relative to the steering tube stop plate.

Is it normal to have a little gap where I'm seeing it? Just trying to check my work.

Thanks!
Bill

[seanbarney41]

Tons of controversy about this over the years...if you do some searching here you find many lengthy threads and it seems many have found differing results.  Plenty of folks have had the same problem as you.  I think if you omit the grease seals provided, everything comes out right. Or you can omit the top seal and grind or file the locating ring off the inside of the adjusting nut.  I have installed several of these All Balls kits over the years and noticed that the sohc4 kits don't necessarily always have the same manufacturer bearings, and don't necessarily stack up the same.  Last time I installed a roller bearing kit, I sourced it from Yamiya, and the fork covers fit perfectly just like stock, with no mysterious fiddling about.

[MauiK3]

+1 Yamiya, they seem to be very careful about their parts. I've only ever had one bad part, a rear turn signal assembly, that needed some "adjustment".

[BenelliSEI]

I’ve had the same experience with the all balls kits. I found it so annoying that I’ve gone back to stock. I bought +100 new 0.025 balls (about $10) at a good bearing shop. Usually those are all you need. The originals get “squared off”. If not, replace the race too.

[WhyNot2]

Still considering doing the 750 and 350F, but not sure now.

I do have a SL350 frame, that I replaced and it seems fine.

I have a CB and CL100 that may get the same treatment. These are distant projects.

[69cb750]

I bought +100 new 0.025 balls

.250" balls

[BenelliSEI]

I bought +100 new 0.025 balls

.250" balls

Oops! Thanks.

[denward17]

On my 550 I installed the AllBalls bearing set, and also have a gap, which leads to the fork ears moving up and down a bit when hitting abrupt bumps.  Little irritating but don't think it hurts anything.  Will go with originals with the 750, when I change them.

[HondaMan]

So I just installed a set of All Balls tapered bearings on my '73 CB 750. I'm certain all the races are seated and the correct washers are being used and in the correct position/order (per the instructions). The thing is that now when re-assembling the front forks (in particular the upper fork covers), there seems to be about an extra 1/8" gap between the top of the cover (with the upper isolator in place on the cover) and the under side of the top bridge (triple tree). I seem to recall when disassembling there was little to no gap and the covers were slightly wedged in place. It's almost as though the upper and lower triple tree are now a little further apart? I disassembled the triple tree to double check that the races are seated properly and the bearing on the steering stem is also seated properly (there does not seem to be any gaps that would account for the 1/8" gap I'm seeing up top).

I also tightened the spanner nut to the point where everything was pretty snug and a bit of turning resistance and then backed off about a half turn until turning was nice and smooth. So it seems as though all the parts are compressed properly.

The only thing I can think of that would make up this difference is the washer under the bearing and dust cover on the steering stem. I did the measurement of the old bearings and ended up using the thinner of the two washers provided in order to be within the +-1mm height measurement specified in the instructions. Also the steering stops seem to be right where they should be relative to the steering tube stop plate.

Is it normal to have a little gap where I'm seeing it? Just trying to check my work.

Thanks!
Bill

There are 2 or 3 (depending on when you got your All Balls kit) large washer-spacers in the All Balls kits. One of them goes above the lower bearing shell, in the bottom of the triple tree, before installing the tree. Honda changed the spacing in the 750's steering head 3 times alone, and just made long threads on the steering stem to make them all still fit together, regardless of year of manufacture. So, All Ball's instructions tend to be vague about which spacer to use, also partly due to how many different bikes their kit will fit.

Measure the "gap" that you have when the fork ears (with their rubber seals on top) are placed into the upper & lower trees to see how big the gap is, then select the washer from the All Balls kit that is that same thickness, or slightly less. Then remove the bottom race (a long screwdriver will let you tap it back out) and install it again, but with that spacer above it. Then it will all fit together.

Annoying, but still WAY better than it used to be before All Balls kits came along.

[pjlogue]

what I have done is use the All Balls lower bearing and race and use the stock OEM bearings for the top.  This gets rid of the gap between the headlight ears and the top of the steering stem.  The upper steering bearing really has no load on it as the weight of the bike and road bumps are all on the lower bearing. 

-P.

[BenelliSEI]

what I have done is use the All Balls lower bearing and race and use the stock OEM bearings for the top.  This gets rid of the gap between the headlight ears and the top of the steering stem.  The upper steering bearing really has no load on it as the weight of the bike and road bumps are all on the lower bearing. 

-P.

I like this and will try it!

[Medyo Bastos]

This is what works for me, and what works for me, may or may not work for everyone else…

I put the lower race in the frame, and hold the lower bearing in the race with my fingers. I check which combination of washers just barely gives enough clearance to avoid any scraping. I can’t explain why some frames take one washer, some the other, and some both, but once this is sorted out install the correct combination in the correct order onto the lower tree. I’ve done this countless times. Ahhh, if you jack up, or are in the habit of practicing to make perfect, the easiest way i have found to remove the lower bearing from the lower tree and not destroy it, is with an air chisel underneath the washer. Im not in practice mode and prefer to do things just once, but have learned by practice


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[majorzozo]

You can also go to the local hardware store and find an o ring about an 1/8 inch thick that fits snug around the fork tube to use as a shim to just make the headlight ears snug.  If you use it on the bottom it is very hard to see.  I think I found the perfect fit by the sink drains section.  Just a suggestion.

[Don R]

 As a retired plumber, I totally endorse the sink washer trick and can say that I've done it myself with a good result.

[MauiK3]

Plumbers are really never retired since plumbing never really stops giving us challenges:-))))

[PeWe]

My K2 got a few mm gap between headlight ears and upper yoke.
I filled it with a rubber washer and forgot about it.

Here many others discussing Tapered bearings
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,1516.625.html

[Stev-o]

Here is the official tapered bearings thread, should answer all questions...

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,1516.0.html