Author Topic: Honda vs. Kawasaki  (Read 1451 times)

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Offline tsp37

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Honda vs. Kawasaki
« on: July 24, 2007, 06:00:09 PM »
I was looking at 1970's Kawasakis on Walneck's and my first impression is that old Kawasakis can demand a higher price than similar Hondas.  My sample was small, and it is rare that I window shop for anything other than Hondas.  Can anyone confirm my suspicion and speculate why this is so, or am I just wrong?  Perhaps I should ask my wife for the quickest answer to that.

One of the first bikes that I almost bought was a KZ440 - the sales lady at the Kawasaki dealer was also the first to take an 18 year old seriously.  But I bought a Honda Custom 250 with a $250 rebate and I'm a faithful sort of idiot.

Offline BobbyR

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Re: Honda vs. Kawasaki
« Reply #1 on: July 24, 2007, 06:05:21 PM »
Well there are probably less Kawis left and they probably sold fewer bikes than Honda. If you want a KZ440 so you can relive your youth I happen to have one I can sell you in very minty condition.
Dedicated to Sgt. Howard Bruckner 1950 - 1969. KIA LONG KHANH.

But we were boys, and boys will be boys, and so they will. To us, everything was dangerous, but what of that? Had we not been made to live forever?

Offline nickjtc

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Re: Honda vs. Kawasaki
« Reply #2 on: July 24, 2007, 08:13:17 PM »
Well there are probably less Kawis left and they probably sold fewer bikes than Honda.

I agree. Also bear in mind that before the Z1 came along Kawasaki was hanging its hat on the whole two stroke thing. Those triples were fragile at best if poorly maintained, so any that have made it through to today in original condition will have the cachet of rarity value.
« Last Edit: July 25, 2007, 11:50:32 AM by nickjtc »
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Offline cafehonda

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Re: Honda vs. Kawasaki
« Reply #3 on: July 25, 2007, 11:10:38 AM »
Alot of guys turned their Z1's into drag bikes. The bottom end was bulletproof. So, I guess alot of them got cut up and abused.
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Offline dusterdude

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Re: Honda vs. Kawasaki
« Reply #4 on: July 25, 2007, 01:33:43 PM »
what cafe said,and the aftermarket has supported kaw very well,unlike honda which they left to wither on the vine.
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Offline bill440cars

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Re: Honda vs. Kawasaki
« Reply #5 on: July 25, 2007, 02:51:37 PM »


        Speaking of Kawasaki, This afternoon, I was up in town and saw a Kawasaki 650 four being trailered out of town. Somebody dug that one up from somewhere cause, it was covered in dirt (like it had been sitting out in a field or something), the seat was gone, and it had a Windjammer fairing, Vetter Hard bags and helmet box set. Kinda wondered about the details on it but, will never know.

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Offline BobbyR

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Re: Honda vs. Kawasaki
« Reply #6 on: July 25, 2007, 06:47:19 PM »


        Speaking of Kawasaki, This afternoon, I was up in town and saw a Kawasaki 650 four being trailered out of town. Somebody dug that one up from somewhere cause, it was covered in dirt (like it had been sitting out in a field or something), the seat was gone, and it had a Windjammer fairing, Vetter Hard bags and helmet box set. Kinda wondered about the details on it but, will never know.

                                Later on, Bill :) ;) 
Bill, you may see the parts on ebay soon.
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But we were boys, and boys will be boys, and so they will. To us, everything was dangerous, but what of that? Had we not been made to live forever?

Offline tsp37

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Re: Honda vs. Kawasaki
« Reply #7 on: July 25, 2007, 06:49:22 PM »
Would I "relive my youth" with a KZ440?  No, that would take supporting a worn out Chevy with a job at Burger King.  I think that I'll pass.

The Kawasaki had something new that year - a drive belt.  It promised a 50,000 mile life and no maintenance.  The Honda 250 got the belt the next year.  That sounds nice.  As I write, my garage has the overwhelming smell of 90W since I oiled my chain after work, and tomorrow I'll get fresh black lines across the white letters on my rear tire.  What happened to drive belts?  My guess is that motorcycle buyers just never accepted belts.  I don't imagine anyone here will disagree.

Offline bill440cars

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Re: Honda vs. Kawasaki
« Reply #8 on: July 25, 2007, 07:38:53 PM »


        Speaking of Kawasaki, This afternoon, I was up in town and saw a Kawasaki 650 four being trailered out of town. Somebody dug that one up from somewhere cause, it was covered in dirt (like it had been sitting out in a field or something), the seat was gone, and it had a Windjammer fairing, Vetter Hard bags and helmet box set. Kinda wondered about the details on it but, will never know.

                                Later on, Bill :) ;) 
Bill, you may see the parts on ebay soon.

         That could very well happen Bobby. That bike looked like it got caught in a very severe dust storm! ;D Be nice if that guy had the perseverance of Gordon (Ilbikes) and would put it back on the road. I remember when the 650 came out, heard nothing but good things about it. Were they THAT good?

                                 Later on, Bill :) ;) 
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Offline 6pkrunner

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Re: Honda vs. Kawasaki
« Reply #9 on: July 26, 2007, 02:33:36 AM »
I'd say it was a performance thing. When the CB750 came out it set the world on its ear as the ultimate in performance. Successive years saw the CB detuned a bit each year. The Mach III when it came out in 1969 was pure performance. Sure it was a disposable bike, but the few months you had with it were intense. Same with the Mach IV. Pure performance. And the Z1 did the same thing. While the CB was still losing horsepower for civility, the Z1 set the bar at a new level. Sure Pops Yoshimura was grinding out CB parts but even he switched to Kawas for the performance. However the fairing and saddlebag aftermarket was keen on the CB. Years later the in your face examples are the best remembered. A LS6 Chevelle will get more attention than a 4 door Biscayne.

Offline BobbyR

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Re: Honda vs. Kawasaki
« Reply #10 on: July 26, 2007, 05:46:48 AM »
Would I "relive my youth" with a KZ440?  No, that would take supporting a worn out Chevy with a job at Burger King.  I think that I'll pass.

The Kawasaki had something new that year - a drive belt.  It promised a 50,000 mile life and no maintenance.  The Honda 250 got the belt the next year.  That sounds nice.  As I write, my garage has the overwhelming smell of 90W since I oiled my chain after work, and tomorrow I'll get fresh black lines across the white letters on my rear tire.  What happened to drive belts?  My guess is that motorcycle buyers just never accepted belts.  I don't imagine anyone here will disagree.
No fear of that happeneing. A guy put the KZ on a trailer last night, so I have more room in my garage.
Dedicated to Sgt. Howard Bruckner 1950 - 1969. KIA LONG KHANH.

But we were boys, and boys will be boys, and so they will. To us, everything was dangerous, but what of that? Had we not been made to live forever?

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Re: Honda vs. Kawasaki
« Reply #11 on: July 26, 2007, 06:38:38 PM »
Hey Bill, I remember when the 650 Kaw came out, sure sounded nice with
kerkers too ;D But now a days I haven't seen one anywhere on the street or
behind the barns.

Offline kslrr

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Re: Honda vs. Kawasaki
« Reply #12 on: July 27, 2007, 08:54:19 AM »
My brother's first big bike was a KZ650 in candy orange.  It came with 4-2 Bassani's.  He changed those out for 4-1 Kerkers.  That thing sounded soooo sweat.  Until a semi ran over it!
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Offline dusterdude

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Re: Honda vs. Kawasaki
« Reply #13 on: July 27, 2007, 10:42:59 AM »
there`s a guy in my town that has a kz650,nice bike.
mark
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Offline Carbine

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Re: Honda vs. Kawasaki
« Reply #14 on: July 27, 2007, 11:30:21 AM »

......I don't know if I would use asking prices in Walnecks for a benchmark for market trends. A bike is worth for what someone is willing to pay for it, and with Walnecks, you never know what they really sell for. The places where you can see what bikes actually sell for, like Ebay, classic bike auctions, etc, show that original/correct early Z-1 and H-2 prices can be very high. However, I have noticed that minty original and correct CB750's have skyrocketed in value in recent times, and certainly are holding thier own with the Kawasaki's. That said, bikes from both genres can still be found at reasonable prices of one looks patiently for his disired machine within his own regional market....thankfully!

......I know that survior rates for H-2's in my own area were very, very low. H-2's were owned by a very high majority of head-banging (even though that term wasn't around in '72..it fits) very young guys. They rode 'em hard, wrecked them, died on them, and never once put a tool on them. They sat outside year round, were never cleaned, and when they finally grenaded (usually transmission) they were simply discarded......just something left behind in the wake of misspent youth. H-2's were not turned into touring bikes, like many CB750's or Z-1's, they were just pitched. Tranny parts for them were expensive, I know this from painful first hand knowledge!

.....Z-1 survival rates were a lot higher. Nobody threw a Z-1 in the garbage when it was 3-4 years old. They were so expensive new....so many young guys, myself included, lusted after the 'Root Beer 900'. None of us could afford one. Z-1 owners, those who could come up with the 3 grand to buy one, tended to be the older and more mature riders. Fewer Z-1's were sold, but most survived the first critical 5-10 years of ownership. Indeed, some were purchased later in life by young owners, and lead hard lives, but their engineering saw them through much of the abuse.

.....CB750's.......back in the day, they attracted everybody! The young squids, older mature guys, touring people, you name it, you saw anyone on them. There was no set owner genre for a CB. There probobly still isn't to this day. Surival rates, which somewhat dicate prices today, I think, are moderate. Production numbers ensured an adequate supply for many years, for everyone. Factory support kept parts available for those who wanted to keep thier CB on the road.  Many, many CB's were wrecked, many were modified to custom or touring spec, but a surprising percentage have made it through to 2007 in relative stock form.......and these are the machines that are commanding higher demand today.

......But, like I said earlier, enthusiests don't have to spend collector prices, for decent Kawis or CB's. There are still gems in all areas, and many are owned by people who have never heard of Walnecks, don't know how to get on Ebay, and just want to sell their bike.... All a guy has to do is start looking, be patient, and have the funds ready to go when the right one pops up.  ;)     
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Offline BobbyR

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Re: Honda vs. Kawasaki
« Reply #15 on: July 27, 2007, 02:12:39 PM »
Well put
Dedicated to Sgt. Howard Bruckner 1950 - 1969. KIA LONG KHANH.

But we were boys, and boys will be boys, and so they will. To us, everything was dangerous, but what of that? Had we not been made to live forever?