Topic: Forum Rules - your thoughts

[Glenn Stauffer]

Otherwise, we could always just start another site and take our bad manners elsewhere, away from the "Thread Nazi's".
   

And who's stopping you?

Well I subscribe to other bike sites too, so if this one becomes too regulated I'll just wander off for awhile until common sense prevails, or it collapses from within. That'd be a shame, but it's happened before to good sites, and will happen again.

I'll talk to my son (my technical expert) about creating a site, but I'd really rather go for the democratic option, whereby we get to vote for the mods, not just have them given the power to push their own agenda's. Cheers, Terry.

Terry and the rest who are discussing this issue, take a look at the forum rules and tell me what it is you disagree with.  I'm happy to have this discussion and to allow all of you who are interested enough in the well being of these forums to register your opinions.  I'm splitting this off into another thread since this one has gone off in all sorts of directions.

[Glenn Stauffer]

And for those of you who haven't read them in a while, here they are:

SOHC/4 Forums Ground Rules

The SOHC/4 Forums were set up so that owners of Honda single overhead cam four cylinder motorcycles have a place to obtain answers to technical questions and share tips, tricks and general advice.  Over the years, the forums were expanded and reformatted to reflect the usage and wishes of the members.  In order to ensure the forum remains a welcome place, we've established a few simple rules.

1) What the moderators say goes.  The moderators of this forum were selected because they are level-headed individuals.  We reserve the right to apply these rules as we see fit.  Whilst we are open to discussion, please use Private Messaging (PM) for this. The actions of the moderators are final.

2) Post in the appropriate forum.  The tech forum is for technical topics.  The classifieds are for for-sale and wanted ads.  The feedback forum is where you can tell us what you like and what you don't like about the forums or the website.  The open forum is where you go to talk about anything else.  Taking the time to post in the right place saves us the time of moving your posts to the correct forum.

3) Please do not use offensive Avatars, if we deem them so, you will be asked to change them. If not changed appropriately, they will be deleted.

4) Overly Offensive posts will be deleted.  This means use of profanity, posting offensive images, or generally offensive content.

5) Posts that are inflammatory in nature will be deleted.  If you have a problem with the forums, contact the moderators; if you have a problem with a member, send them a PM.  If your reason for coming here is to provoke argument, you will be asked to leave.

6) If you post spam, you will be banned from the site.

7) If you are coming here to advertise your wares, do it in the classifieds only.  If you are a commercial concern and your advertising gets excessive, contact us about buying advertising space or expect that your ads will be removed and you will be asked to cease these activities.

8. Private Messages (PMs) are private between the two parties. If you paste one into a post it will be deleted and you will receive a warning.


It is our goal to make the Forums appealing to the broadest base of SOHC4 members.

[Rocking-M]

Glenn, my take is, it's your site and we're your guest.
You chose the moderators because you felt they were best for the job,
and they agreed to do it to the best of their ability. I have no qualms with
it and may even disagree on occasion but hey, we all disagree! 
Best, Robert

[mark]

As I have posted elsewhere, I have read the rules and do not have a problem with them.

As the boob thread was not particularly dial-up friendly, I only peeked a couple of times. really. honest.

I'm sure I could find boobs and other bits somewhere if I tried.

When I was of that tender age, Mom would leave the Playboy stash alone and throw away Dirt Bike when she found it.(Sex might ruin his life, but motorcycles will kill him for sure!)

I'm sure it would just make her day if I traded the 550 for one of these.........


Now, if you'll excuse me, I need to gather my gear and go racing!

Happy trails.

Mark

[Raul CB750K1]

I have been one month away and don't know exactly what is this all about, but I guess it comes down to the boob thread. When that thread started I thought it was funny, but soon it started to become into a naked girls portfolio. I have nothing against naked girls and like them like everybody else, but there is a place for everything. Honestly, when I saw that thread I thought this forum was not different anymore to the other millions bike forums around the internet.

Some time ago I opened a thread titled "Sex" and it went like "now that I get your attention, let's see how many hits I get". It was intended to be something kinda funny, but I remember some replies in the way "thanks God, I thought this was going to become like the other bikes forums". And they were right.

In my opinion, this forum has been great as it has been and it should go on like that. Moderators are necessary in all the forums, otherwise the forums quickly get out of control. I remember when Terry and I had that "one stone" going and I finally sent him a couple of playboy magazines. I posted some pics of the playmate but blurred the bosom and genitals, and some people complained. My answer was that this was a bike forum and it is good to have a laugh every now and then, but I can't force anybody to see something they don't want to see -even when I presume nobody will oppose- because they enter a bike forum for the bikes. And the reason that if I warn the thread content is a good waiver seems not valid to me; people should be free to browse the whole forum without having to worry where do they tread.


I could be wrong and the discussion has nothing to do with the boob thread, but in any case, here there are my two cents.


Raul

[mlinder]

Theres a couple good forums for jackassery.

http://www.genmay.com/

http://www.somethingawful.com/


I wouldn't lump sohc4.us in with either of those....

Just my opinion.

[clarkjh]

Glenn

This is your house and your rules.  I myself find that this forum is one of the best I've been to.  Some remind me of some old ladies house with covers on all the furniture, where you don't dare sneeze .  Others reminded me of the movie "Animal House" where it was just chaos .  Here is like a friends comfy home where when you visit, you can kick your boots off, have a cold one, and shoot the #$%*.  I don't think this house needs the "Adults only" back room.  I am here to help and give help to keep these old Hondas running.

Just my 2 1/2 cents.

James

[333]

I agree with most here, your house, your rules.  I take exception to only one thing.

Where do you get off using a word like "Whilst"?  (rule #1".

[UnCrash]

   Personally,  I don't care about t&a on this site.

I don't think it degrades or improves it.  It's just not what I come here for.

I respect the rules and have been a part of forums where there were no rules, and no focus, and they did little for me.

The focus of this forum is keen, and when you want to goof off there's always the "Other Stuff" forum where gems like the shameless post boost thread can be found.

From my perspective it's all good to go.

Cheers

Ben

[xtalon]

Glenn, first and foremost I want to say you run a great site and just the fact that you are willing to discuss this issue proves why.  As others have said, this is your house and it should be your rules, but I applaud you for the fact that you are open minded enough to consider and/or discuss the rules for possibly the benefit of the whole.

I think the rules you have are fine; however, I'm not sure how things work in the background, so it's hard for me to say if anything can be improved.  Perhaps you can help clarify.  When a moderator is forced to make a decision, is that decision based solely on his/her own judgement or is it discussed with the other moderators in advance?  I only ask because moderators are humans too and we are a diverse lot, so all judgements may not be correct, but if these judgements are discussed by a larger diverse open minded group, then its more like a democracy than a dictatorship.  I stress open minded in the above sentence because if mods are just going to support their fellow mods because they are fellow mods, then it's pointless.

Rule #4 states:  Overly Offensive posts will be deleted.  This means use of profanity, posting offensive images, or generally offensive content.

With regards to the 'boob thread', the overly offensive posts were not deleted, the entire thread was deleted.  If the entire thread was offensive, then why was it allowed to go on for 50 pages?  It should have been nipped in the bud in the beginning.  I didn't start the thread, but I along with others contributed because it was fun and others seemed to enjoy it.  I personally felt it began to push what should be allowed, but to my knowledge no warning was ever given... at least publicly to the group as a whole.  We were never given a chance to fix the problem ourselves, which I felt we have a responsible group of members here that we could and would have done. Heck, we would probably have all agreed to quit posting and have the thread removed if it was suggested.

This isn't about the 'boob thread'.  It's about how it was handled.  If we were all having a heated oil discussion and I get out of line and there is the potential for others to get out of line, I would expect my post to be deleted and the others warned about what wouldn't be tolerated.  I wouldn't expect the whole thread to be deleted.

The only other thing that bothered me was locking the thread discussing the deletion of the 'boob thread'.  I know the rules state that 'mods are open for discussion, but please use PM'.  That makes perfect sense when the mod's decision relates to 1-2 individiuals, but when it relates to many individuals, it is hard to not have an discussion with all the effected members.  Granted I'm sure Heffay felt like he was standing in a public firing range and I apologize if anything I said contributed to that.  I think most of the discussion was in jest, but still with a point.  I have no problem with the 'boob thread' being shut down, I just felt it was handled wrong.

BUT, its your house and your rules and I AM just a visitor, but thanks for taking the time to listen.

--xTalon

[ekim98]

 I'm one of the newest noob's here and I'm 59 years young, if I want to see boob's and stuff I have the internet and a wife. I came here looking for talk, pictures and advice about bikes and so far that's what I've found. If it stays that way then I'll stay. Just my opinion

[Raul CB750K1]

I'm one of the newest noob's here and I'm 59 years young, if I want to see boob's and stuff I have the internet and a wife. I came here looking for talk, pictures and advice about bikes and so far that's what I've found. If it stays that way then I'll stay. Just my opinion

Amen.


This isn't suppoused to be a democracy. Even if moderators get together to discuss these matters, the outcome will never satisfy 100% of the members. The fact that a place is run by a person alone shouldn't be taken by a dictatorship - in the latter freedom of speech is forbidden while in this forum we are free to talk about anything. Glenn delegated the mod tasks to people I guess he has never met before, but probably judging they would have the same points of view than him. It's not fair to personally attack a mod for doing his job. Mods don't write the rules, and the fact that they haven't been overzealous in the past is no reason to attack them for following the rules. It is like a cop see you riding without your helmet when you should wear it and he lets you go, but at the third time he tickets you. Why should him warn you before? You know what the rules are, so you should be grateful instead that he looked other way in two occasions.


Raul

[neil young]

Glen you have one of the best sites around.i have learned more here about my 550 than any book could teach me.i used to have to pay some bike shop a ridiculous amount of money to repair my yamaha seca.the boob thread was started with the best of intentions as far as i could tell (just another way of having some fun)i myself enjoyed it  ::)i to posted a pic or two that i thought might be a little risky  .as for heffy i have never met him but im sure his intentions were for the benefit of all (in case there are some under age kids with motorcycles).now it is time to read some other threads and get my other bikes on the road for next year ;)keep up the good work.yours truly a sohc member for life

[edbikerii]

I hope I don't sound too much like a beaurocrat, but I have one suggestion:

Would it be possible to create a procedure to convene more than one moderator for a "joint opinion" when a particular user, or group of users, feel that a single moderator's decision was unfair or heavy-handed, or if a user feels that he has been unfairly singled out or banned from posting?  In most cases, the slap on the wrist from a mod is enough to get a truly unruly user in line, but there are other times when an individual might feel that he has been treated unfairly, censored, banned, etc.  I think of it like appealing to the Supreme Court.  It would also work both ways -- sometimes just having an outsider's opinion is enough to convince a user who is not being reasonable that he needs to back down.

I complement you, Glenn, on running such an excellent forum, especially in light of the fact that you are asking the users for their thoughts on how to improve forum rules and procedures.  We all know that you don't have to ask for our feedback, as it is your site to run as you please.  I appreciate your desire to keep the users happy, and keep us coming back for more.

Thank you!

[750goes]

I'm happy with any reply or responses from any moderator on this forum. Their response means they are looking out for the SOHC sites' best interests in the long term.

Any short term problems or upset memebrs so be it, live with it or find another site.

(I was a regular visitor to the aforementioned thread)...is aforemetioned another word like whilst?


my $0.03 worth (aussie exchange rate)...

[Rocking-M]

Oh yea, i forgot to say, it's a great site and great folks on here!

[Steve F]

And for those of you who haven't read them in a while, here they are:

SOHC/4 Forums Ground Rules
1) What the moderators say goes........   Whilst we are open to discussion, please use Private Messaging (PM) for this. The actions of the moderators are final.

 

Glenn, here's what I found about "whilst"...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/While
  perfectly acceptable, although a little old fashioned?

[jsaab2748]

Think about what it'd be like if we all had to rely on the dealers for
everything we needed to know about our bikes. This place is priceless.
I commend the mods for the time and effort that must be required to
make this place happen. To me, they are more than fair, even if they do
on occasion have to make unpopular decisions. Keep it comin Glenn and the rest of you guys, and thank you. just my .02

[BobbyR]

Well the boob thread was not my idea. But, it was a challenge and I stepped up. I guess the idea grew from some holiday pictures I posted and while my bike was in pieces my Avatars had something more pleasing on them. People commented and Rsnip picked up and ran with it.
 
I go way back to the Greenspun days and both Forums saved my 78K from being parted out. I browse a lot of Forums looking for answers about my problem child truck. They all suck for the most part.

I will not apologize for any pictures I posted since I was careful and I respected the "offensive" part of the rules, no full nips or naughty bits is what I figured it meant.

 I gave Heffay a hard time and I think he deserved it for the way he handled it, so I went NY on him which is what we do in these parts. That will stop now.

There could be a Babes section, but the rules should be very clear and strictly enforced. There is beauty and there is Porn. Porn is pretty ugly on many levels.

Keep up the good work. This Forum will last as long as these bikes do. I wish we Americans would have kept "whist". 
   

[oldbiker]

If a picture of a bike happens to include a boob or two, so be it and I will enjoy it but I felt that the boob thread went far beyond reasonable standards. I was not at all sorry to see it removed.
Having said that, I am happy to accept whatever Glenn does with HIS site. For me it has always been just about perfect.

[johnny-from-bel]

The intent of the forum rules to keep this an nice and clean formum are fine.
As a European, I am sometimes 'shocked', please do not take this to hard, by the moralising aproach of the American moderators.

Insults and flaming are unaceptable. The rest, I think, could loosen up a bit.

[toycollector10]

Even though membership to the site must be at least 99 % male I like the fact that when I come here it's 99 % about bikes.

I've got T and A staring at me on billboards, buses, magazine covers, newspapers and all over the place so it's actually a bit refreshing to get away from it for 10 minutes.

Steak is great but I don't want it for every meal.

I haven't a clue what the boob thread was about, I never went there for some reason.

The site is great how it is, the mods seem to do a good job so I'm happy........

[Glenn Stauffer]

Glenn, my take is, it's your site and we're your guest.
You chose the moderators because you felt they were best for the job,
and they agreed to do it to the best of their ability. I have no qualms with
it and may even disagree on occasion but hey, we all disagree! 
Best, Robert

I appreciate everyone's comments.  It is good to check in now and again - especially after a bit of controversy - to see if the membership is happy. 

After all, this is less like my home in which you all are guests as my tavern in which you all are patrons.  If you all (or at least a healthy majority) aren't happy, the staff gets laid off, the rent doesn't get paid, and the 'For Sale' signs go up in the window and you find somewhere else to hang.  That won't be happening anytime soon or ever if I have any say in it.

[bowhunter]

Hey Glen,
I've been a member of this forum for over 2 years. I can't recall one instance when I felt any of the moderators were unfair to any of the posters. All cases of deletion that I am aware of were definately called for. In some cases, if I were the moderator, it would have happened much quicker! Keep up the good work, and keep this site to YOUR standards. Those that don't like it will leave. That's their loss, and our gain!

Bowhunter

[tbone]

I haven't been here all that long but I do enjoy this forum.

Informative and entertaining and virtually free of the B-S on many
of the others out there.

Keep up the good work!