Topic: Yamiya 750 damper question...

[GroovieGhoulie]

I was browsing the Yamiya 750 website since I just bought a K0 and was perusing what parts are still available for "The Original".

They offer new DeCarbon-pattern rear shocks and springs, that appear to be of the same style and spec as on the original Sandcasts and K0s.

I KNOW they were crap dampers when new, but I am a stock purist and when the time comes to replace mine, which will happen eventually, I want to replace them with OEM-style units, partially since these things are worth more in stock condition and partially because I like the way it handles now.  IMO, K0s are too collectible to be hustling the corners, dragging the pegs, so the stock units are fine for me.

They're not cheap at all, but I like that they're still out there.  Any feedback on them?  Are they comparable to the OEM DeCarbon dampers?  Superior roadholding and handling is not at issue, being identical to the originals in performance and appearance is.

Link:

http://www.yamiya750e.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=35_93&products_id=426

[Bob Wessner]

Err, is that $215 per shock??

[GroovieGhoulie]

Err, is that $215 per shock??

It seems so, but it also seems to include the spring and spring cover.  $215 for the complete assembly, which, when you add the costs of springs and such, isn't ridiculous.  At least, to me it isn't; I mean, to get the correct rear shocks, which are only for the K0 and K1.

[dave400]

DSS also has them, probably CMSNL also.

[GroovieGhoulie]

DSS also has them, probably CMSNL also.

Currently DSS is the cheapest at 90 pounds each, which is about $180 each ($360 for the set) in the current roughly 2:1 exchange of the dollar to the pound.  However, all it says is "Rear Shock"; it doesn't indicate being the whole assembly.  I might e-mail them to see if it's the whole assembly, or just the damper.

CMSNL, well known for high prices, actually clocks in second at 276.50 Euro for a set of two.  This works out to about $400 for the set.

And Yamiya is the highest priced at $215 each for $430 each.

The availability is better than I thought.  Now I just need to find out if they are identical to the originals, or at least have better seals so they ACT the same, but the nitrogen doesn't leak out in a few years and the thin oil aerates. 

[dave400]

DSS has replica shocks probably made by the same people that the site in Japan is selling for 97 quid a pair.

[Raul CB750K1]

If your shocks are doing fine, why worrying about buying a new pair? If your shocks are shot and you are in the market for originality -including the "DeCarbon" stickers-, only the originals will make, and originality have a price. Otherwise there are quite a few "classic looking" shocks out there, with modern performance and vintage style. Hagon makes different shocks and you can install chrome covers in all of them.

http://www.hagon-shocks.co.uk/HagShocks.htm

[754]

dave 400

The shocks you pictred are silver tops, i believe early have black tops

[Johnie]

Good luck if you try to E them a question.  I E mailed them twice this month with a question about a seat they sell and never got a reply.  Must not want our USA money???

[Bob Wessner]

Good luck if you try to E them a question.  I E mailed them twice this month with a question about a seat they sell and never got a reply.  Must not want our USA money???

I encountered a similar problem, never heard from them.

[GroovieGhoulie]

If your shocks are doing fine, why worrying about buying a new pair? If your shocks are shot and you are in the market for originality -including the "DeCarbon" stickers-, only the originals will make, and originality have a price. Otherwise there are quite a few "classic looking" shocks out there, with modern performance and vintage style. Hagon makes different shocks and you can install chrome covers in all of them.

http://www.hagon-shocks.co.uk/HagShocks.htm

The thing is I don't know if they're fine because I never have ridden a showroom new '70s Honda.  Many folks here have said that even with low miles on them, the sheer age of these shocks mean that the seals are shot, the nitrogen has escaped and the internals have likely rusted until instead of damping oil, you have a pretty chrome shock filled with oily, rusty sludge that doesn't dampen anything and you effectively have a couple of pogo sticks on the rear end.

Hell, I'd bet the shocks on my daily-rider F1, which I just turned 900 miles on today, are shot, just from being 31-years old, and those shocks, (according to the mileage), are practically brand-new!

[andy750]

One of the things you have to realize with Yamiya is that they DONT have great English so if you want an answer make your question is really simple. And most to the things they list are for singles. Like $30 for a single blinker stem.....

Ive always had replies from them 

cheers
Andy

 

[MRieck]

If your shocks are doing fine, why worrying about buying a new pair? If your shocks are shot and you are in the market for originality -including the "DeCarbon" stickers-, only the originals will make, and originality have a price. Otherwise there are quite a few "classic looking" shocks out there, with modern performance and vintage style. Hagon makes different shocks and you can install chrome covers in all of them.

http://www.hagon-shocks.co.uk/HagShocks.htm

The thing is I don't know if they're fine because I never have ridden a showroom new '70s Honda.  Many folks here have said that even with low miles on them, the sheer age of these shocks mean that the seals are shot, the nitrogen has escaped and the internals have likely rusted until instead of damping oil, you have a pretty chrome shock filled with oily, rusty sludge that doesn't dampen anything and you effectively have a couple of pogo sticks on the rear end.

Hell, I'd bet the shocks on my daily-rider F1, which I just turned 900 miles on today, are shot, just from being 31-years old, and those shocks, (according to the mileage), are practically brand-new!

Unfortunately I have to agree with you. Suspension was an area where Honda squeezed a penny so hard they got change.

[GroovieGhoulie]

Suspension was an area where Honda squeezed a penny so hard they got change.

Why is that?  That confuses the hell out of me.  Handling is just as, if not MORE, important than power.

Any ideas on why Honda, (and indeed all the Japanese makes), went cheap back then on suspensions and were routinely out-handled by the European makes, (at least according to period tests)?  Did they not care about handling, or just not understand it?  Or were their standards for "good handling" different from the rest of the world?  It seems that the common complaint was "too much spring, not enough shock".  Why did they overspring and under-damp as a rule?

[MRieck]

Suspension was an area where Honda squeezed a penny so hard they got change.

Why is that?  That confuses the hell out of me.  Handling is just as, if not MORE, important than power.

Any ideas on why Honda, (and indeed all the Japanese makes), went cheap back then on suspensions and were routinely out-handled by the European makes, (at least according to period tests)?  Did they not care about handling, or just not understand it?  Or were their standards for "good handling" different from the rest of the world?  It seems that the common complaint was "too much spring, not enough shock".  Why did they overspring and under-damp as a rule?

The corporate accountants certainly had a say in the products and finishes that were ultimately used in production. If you want a reasonably priced product the performed well (engine wise), well....something had to give. To be fair shock technology was very, very low tech 35 years ago. Front end suspension was nothing fancier than a screen door closer. The rear shocks were often over sprung to handle the weight.....the valving was crude on both the compression and rebound side. If you weighed 200lbs or so and cranked up the preload you really found out what underdamped meant. They were like pogo sticks. I remember buying a set of Koni's in 1979. They had adjustable rebound damping (though a real pain to change) and progressive springs. What a difference. Then I realized my swingarms bushings were garbage. I've got an Ohlin's rear shock on my busa...adjustable high/low speed compression, rebound, ride height, and remote preload adjuster (very nice item). Sometimes so much complexity can work against a person too especially if they don't know what they are doing BUT think they do. There are a hundred ways to get it wrong but only 1 way to get it right.