Topic: Cafe Questions Thread

[White Nightmare]

Hey guys, I have searched and searched and have found bits and pieces of good information on here, However lots of it is scattered around or many of the links are down. I was wondering if people could contribute as much as they could regarding general cafe modifications. Common frame mods, Different control setups, different rear seat types, etc. I'm sure there are a lot of newbie's (like myself) that would love to have a lot of this information in one place. Let me know what you guys think.

-Chris

[mkramer1121]

A Cafe FAQ seems like a great idea.  Maybe get some tank bashing threads, seat building threads, suspension threads, rearset threads all in one place.   Personally, I have no idea how to set up a suspension.

[Short Round]

Cafe Bikes are our version of the "chopper".  Minimalistic functional beauties mixed with your own personality.  Its about what the bike says about you.  Use your imagination, think unique and let it show in your cafe.  Chris

[White Nightmare]

I know what a cafe consists of but I would like to know if there are any common frame mods. Does the frame stay stock ? Also, I have seen different rear brake control setups. I'm sure there are other people aside from me that are curious about this mods. If we could have all this information in one place that would be awesome. Hopefully people can contribute information regarding the mods that they have performed on there own cafes.

-Chris

[seaweb11]

grasshopper, when you can take the pebble.................

Just stick around a while young man. We can't write your term paper for you, but all the information is here to write it over time. 

Drop in once a day and do some reading and follow some recent bike builds in progress, ask specific questions of the builders as to why they are doing this or that . It won't take long before you find what suits you and your style of bike.

THERE IS NO SET of Cafe RULES,.........or common frame mods, or" the best" "cafe" brake set up.
$$$$$$$,  time,...... there are a lot of what ifs

Glad to see you here, I saw your 1st post and look forward to seeing what you do to it. Start your own build thread

[dustyc]

"Best" is a personal thing alot of the time.  Watch the bike of the month thread also for some of the cream.

I think it's doing your own thing that inspires innovation.  Check out what Bwaller did with a CB500.  It's not what I think of when I think "cafe", but I think it's a really innovative take on a 500. 

The fun is in finding your own likes and wants and incorporating them into your bike.  Then you'll likely end up with more than one bike.

[andy750]

I completely agree with previous posters here that there is no "recipe" for what is a cafe bike just as there wasnt for a "chopper" bike. YOU have to have some ideas yourself and the way to do this is research.....look at bikes/builds on this forum - as someone else said start with Bike of the Month thread and PM people, ask questions....

as you likely know...the cafe bike was born out of the 50`s and 60`s British bike scene when guys with Triumphs, BSAs and Nortons would remove stuff to make them faster and more racier, get some custom stuff made up (like rearsets and clipons) and pull the valve cover to install new springs or do some engine mods (yes they ALSO did engine mods!!!) to ride around London or in the countryside, racing from pub to pub at high speed...I met some of these guys in my time (Oxfordshire, London, Brighton)....they would laugh at the idea of a "formula" for a cafe bike.....

....now today you can do sooooo much with your SOHC bike - there are loads of parts that can fit or be made to fit - looks at Xtalons thread, Bwaller, Tintin, Seawebs, Gordons (Ibikes), Daniels (DME) and a host of others for some ideas...dosent need to cost a lot of money (though usually does) and things to consider are stainless steel brake lines, drilled rotors, clipons/drop bars/euro bars, bar-end mirrors, new carbs or just cleaned carbs will suffice!, rearsets, new seat made by yourself, racier tank?, new rear shocks for better suspension, new front suspension - progressive springs?, engine mods - porting? new cam? valve springs? new studs?, add some chrome/polished engine covers, rearsets etc etc etc........and of course good tires!!!

good luck!
Andy

[S-Dog]

I completely agree with previous posters here that there is no "recipe" for what is a cafe bike just as there wasnt for a "chopper" bike. YOU have to have some ideas yourself and the way to do this is research.....look at bikes/builds on this forum - as someone else said start with Bike of the Month thread and PM people, ask questions....

as you likely know...the cafe bike was born out of the 50`s and 60`s British bike scene when guys with Triumphs, BSAs and Nortons would remove stuff to make them faster and more racier, get some custom stuff made up (like rearsets and clipons) and pull the valve cover to install new springs or do some engine mods (yes they ALSO did engine mods!!!) to ride around London or in the countryside, racing from pub to pub at high speed...I met some of these guys in my time (Oxfordshire, London, Brighton)....they would laugh at the idea of a "formula" for a cafe bike.....

....now today you can do sooooo much with your SOHC bike - there are loads of parts that can fit or be made to fit - looks at Xtalons thread, Bwaller, Tintin, Seawebs, Gordons (Ibikes), Daniels (DME) and a host of others for some ideas...dosent need to cost a lot of money (though usually does) and things to consider are stainless steel brake lines, drilled rotors, clipons/drop bars/euro bars, bar-end mirrors, new carbs or just cleaned carbs will suffice!, rearsets, new seat made by yourself, racier tank?, new rear shocks for better suspension, new front suspension - progressive springs?, engine mods - porting? new cam? valve springs? new studs?, add some chrome/polished engine covers, rearsets etc etc etc........and of course good tires!!!

good luck!
Andy

Its funny that we had this same discussion at the brewery last night. 

Cafe to me is a minimalist approach to gain handling and speed and is a DIRECT expression of yourself.

[matchanu]

I know what a cafe consists of but I would like to know if there are any common frame mods. Does the frame stay stock ?

For the most part yes.

I removed the centerstand and brackets, passanger pegs and posts, chain gaurd and posts, etc..etc..

I just minimulized whatever I didn't need. You may want to bob the frame in the back a bit if you want that CR750 look, or relocated the rear seat hoop on the frame. It's really up to you.

You actually don't need to take off anything on the frame to have a really cool looking bike. A stock frame with a cafe style seat, clubman's, and a nice paint job is a good option as well.

It all depends on you skill, how much time and money you want to put into it as opposed to riding it.

And do not discount look vs. comfort and function. Clubmans look really cool, but are not nearly as comfortable as stock bars, or even drag bars. Just something to consider.

Also, I have seen different rear brake control setups.

I used a set of CBR rear sets and made my own bracket, they work great, but remember, for every little change you make on the stock set up, you need to change about 5 more things. The geometry was set up a certain way. Don't think you are simply going to put on a set of rear sets and be done with it. You still need to think about the brake linkage and clearence, shifter, etc..etc..etc...

[savannahcafe]

I have to agree with everyone else. Its really an expression of whats in you. People said a gold frame would be ugly, so in spite of them all, I painted it gold. Thats who I am. No one tells me I cant do that, it wont look good, or I should have........  I love every aspect of my bike and when someone tells me I should do this or that I just think, hmmmmm not so much. I think a great start is get rid of the original lighting. New bars and minimize. But thats me. No fenders or side covers. There is no right or wrong. If you have any specific questions about my bike, or how I did this or that, just shoot. I like being different. I don't want just another cafe bike.

[dustyc]

Oh and your taste will change over time and as you see other bikes.

[goon 1492]

grasshopper, when you can take the pebble.................

Just stick around a while young man. We can't write your term paper for you, but all the information is here to write it over time. 

Drop in once a day and do some reading and follow some recent bike builds in progress, ask specific questions of the builders as to why they are doing this or that . It won't take long before you find what suits you and your style of bike.

THERE IS NO SET of Cafe RULES,.........or common frame mods, or" the best" "cafe" brake set up.
$$$$$$$,  time,...... there are a lot of what ifs

Glad to see you here, I saw your 1st post and look forward to seeing what you do to it. Start your own build thread

+1 i sniffed around in here for a month before my first post, if you look it will come, pages and pages of it.  

[Jinxracing]

Oh and your taste will change over time and as you see other bikes.

That's for sure! It took a few months of me changing my mind about front ends, tanks, tailsections, etc before I started to settle down to what I wanted on my bike. Seeing other people's ideas here on the forum has really influenced my build.

Hang in there and soak it all up; your vision will start to clear after awhile. 

[Short Round]

Oh and your taste will change over time and as you see other bikes.

That's for sure! It took a few months of me changing my mind about front ends, tanks, tailsections, etc before I started to settle down to what I wanted on my bike. Seeing other people's ideas here on the forum has really influenced my build.

Hang in there and soak it all up; your vision will start to clear after awhile. 

I absolutely agree.  At first I liked my 550 stock, just had a blast riding it, as time went on I wanted something different, not a different bike just something "Me".  I began really liking the cafe look and how it showcased the frame and engine.  How you can use you imagination to hide this or that,under this or that, so when it was time to remove my engine for a topend rebuild, my mind was made up to cafe it.  I dont have to take the bike down to the frame to do it but I am.  I could have fixed the motor, reinstalled, and been on my way, but my taste changed.  Trust me some of my friends that ride are making every little joke they can about me putting all this $$$$ into a vintage 550, but then again they are satisfied riding newer bikes, bikes thast when mine is all finished are still more expensive. I thought my friend was going to have a fit when i told him that I was going to put rearsets on my 550 and I told him itsnot his bike nor would I ever rake out my bike like he has (trust me we have gotten into it many of time due to his bitter judgements), but that is who he is and my bike is who I am.  Anyways I'm rambeling.  Hop this hepls............Chris

[savannahcafe]

Heres what my bike looked like 3 months ago. The funny thing is I drove it to where you see it pictured. Didn't run when I got it so you can imagine how horrible it felt ripping it down to the frame. But its done now and I'm so pleased with it. It basically evolved to what it is now. Its not what I thought it would be but that is a good thing

[Fuzzball]

That came out looking very nice man,  way better picture than the one in your seat thread.

Oh and your taste will change over time and as you see other bikes.

A big +1 on that

[mikedialect]

I really enjoy seeing people's cafe bikes, but I'm not a cafe builder myself... All I ask is that you not chop up a really nice stock bike! And if you MUST please pm me and send the parts my way

[White Nightmare]

grasshopper, when you can take the pebble.................

Just stick around a while young man. We can't write your term paper for you, but all the information is here to write it over time. 

Drop in once a day and do some reading and follow some recent bike builds in progress, ask specific questions of the builders as to why they are doing this or that . It won't take long before you find what suits you and your style of bike.

THERE IS NO SET of Cafe RULES,.........or common frame mods, or" the best" "cafe" brake set up.
$$$$$$$,  time,...... there are a lot of what ifs

Glad to see you here, I saw your 1st post and look forward to seeing what you do to it. Start your own build thread

Thanks for the info man. I have looked through these forums a lot and have definitely seen some cool stuff. I know there isn't a recipe for this kind of thing but I'm just curious to see what kind of mods people are doing to they're cafes. I will definitely start a build thread when  I start gathering bits and pieces together.

"Best" is a personal thing alot of the time.  Watch the bike of the month thread also for some of the cream.

I think it's doing your own thing that inspires innovation.  Check out what Bwaller did with a CB500.  It's not what I think of when I think "cafe", but I think it's a really innovative take on a 500. 

The fun is in finding your own likes and wants and incorporating them into your bike.  Then you'll likely end up with more than one bike.

I'm definitely not asking what the best is. I would just like to see what people are doing to they're cafes. I have seen so many cool bikes on here that I'm also sure that I'll have a few more in the near future.

I completely agree with previous posters here that there is no "recipe" for what is a cafe bike just as there wasnt for a "chopper" bike. YOU have to have some ideas yourself and the way to do this is research.....look at bikes/builds on this forum - as someone else said start with Bike of the Month thread and PM people, ask questions....

as you likely know...the cafe bike was born out of the 50`s and 60`s British bike scene when guys with Triumphs, BSAs and Nortons would remove stuff to make them faster and more racier, get some custom stuff made up (like rearsets and clipons) and pull the valve cover to install new springs or do some engine mods (yes they ALSO did engine mods!!!) to ride around London or in the countryside, racing from pub to pub at high speed...I met some of these guys in my time (Oxfordshire, London, Brighton)....they would laugh at the idea of a "formula" for a cafe bike.....

....now today you can do sooooo much with your SOHC bike - there are loads of parts that can fit or be made to fit - looks at Xtalons thread, Bwaller, Tintin, Seawebs, Gordons (Ibikes), Daniels (DME) and a host of others for some ideas...dosent need to cost a lot of money (though usually does) and things to consider are stainless steel brake lines, drilled rotors, clipons/drop bars/euro bars, bar-end mirrors, new carbs or just cleaned carbs will suffice!, rearsets, new seat made by yourself, racier tank?, new rear shocks for better suspension, new front suspension - progressive springs?, engine mods - porting? new cam? valve springs? new studs?, add some chrome/polished engine covers, rearsets etc etc etc........and of course good tires!!!

good luck!
Andy

That's excellent info Andy. It definitely gives me a little more insight on what these bikes are all about.

I know what a cafe consists of but I would like to know if there are any common frame mods. Does the frame stay stock ?

For the most part yes.

I removed the centerstand and brackets, passanger pegs and posts, chain gaurd and posts, etc..etc..

I just minimulized whatever I didn't need. You may want to bob the frame in the back a bit if you want that CR750 look, or relocated the rear seat hoop on the frame. It's really up to you.

You actually don't need to take off anything on the frame to have a really cool looking bike. A stock frame with a cafe style seat, clubman's, and a nice paint job is a good option as well.

It all depends on you skill, how much time and money you want to put into it as opposed to riding it.

And do not discount look vs. comfort and function. Clubmans look really cool, but are not nearly as comfortable as stock bars, or even drag bars. Just something to consider.

Also, I have seen different rear brake control setups.

I used a set of CBR rear sets and made my own bracket, they work great, but remember, for every little change you make on the stock set up, you need to change about 5 more things. The geometry was set up a certain way. Don't think you are simply going to put on a set of rear sets and be done with it. You still need to think about the brake linkage and clearence, shifter, etc..etc..etc...

That's great info matchanu. If we could get the thread full of great stuff like this than that would be awesome. Other forum members interested in cafes could come to this thread to check out all sorts of info just like this.

Heres what my bike looked like 3 months ago. The funny thing is I drove it to where you see it pictured. Didn't run when I got it so you can imagine how horrible it felt ripping it down to the frame. But its done now and I'm so pleased with it. It basically evolved to what it is now. Its not what I thought it would be but that is a good thing

You're bike turned out awesome savannahcafe. I'm really diggin the gold. I'm glad you didn't listen to other people and decided to go with what you thought would be right. It definitely paid off.



I just want to say thank you to everyone for they're input. If we keep this up I'm really confident that we can get this thread full of great information. Maybe sooner or later it can turn into a official FAQ thread. If members want to message me they're build links I can post them all up in the main thread message. That way people can check out different builds through this thread. Thanks again guys.

-Chris

[legendary]

Chris,
         great idea for a thread IMHO. I am a noob on this site and to SOHC.  I bought a CB750F a month ago... a bike in such bad shape that no one would think of doing anything other than thank me for resurrecting it. (I am not hacking up a restorable or rare bike.)

My plan is to make a Cafe out of it.....

Every evening I search the web for Cafe, CB750, Cafe racer etc. etc. and I am collecting a file of pics that I like.  I met some Triumph riders and some CB chopper guys at Bike nights and I am picking their brains for every bit of info I can gather.

You have to check out www.CB750cafe.com, www.caferacermotorcycle.com and take a look at this too:

http://www.customfighters.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=143

a site for custom bike fabrication...guys on there are doing a Cafe build contest.

If you know of any other cool sites share them....

Steve

[mercury66]

Waow - so much to absorb! (newbie here)

Not looking to do a cafe bike, but just to inject some 'me' in my project. My 400/4 is a real bitsa and has been customised at various points in its life so seems like a great opportunity to do something a little different, rather than a straight resto (vin number etc has been changed on import).

savannahcafe bike - love the sense of style and simplicity, so individual Gold frame is terrific, about the only thing I've got in the back of my mind is my 400/4 tank will be purple!

Ewan

[matchanu]

For you guys wanting to strat a Cafe build up.

Do yourselves a favor and try the drag bars first before buying a clubman or clip on handlebar set up.

The look is still really good, but it is a lot more comfortable.

I have clip ons on my bike, but my seat and tank are pushed back 4 inches. With the rear sets, it makes it a lot more comfortable, but not really all that comfortable.

You also need to learn how to ride with lower bars. Do NOT lock your elbows when you ride. You will see a lot of guys on sport bikes doing this. If you elbows are locked like this, all the weight is now on the palms of your hands, and you don't really have that much control of your bike. Practice on keeping your elbows bent and holding yourself up with your stomach and lower back muscles. Cafe racers gas tanks are designed with a high back so you can use the back of the tank as leverage to hold you up at the hips. It makes a huge difference in comfort when riding. A stock tank is very low and rounded, there really isn't anything to lean into so a lot of you weight is going to be held up by your arms. The higher the bars, the less strain on your arms to hold you upright.

You'll change you mind on your build a few dozen times before you narrow down exactly what you want during your build. Go cheap to start with untill you get a better idea of what you want, you'll save buckets of money this way.

Be creative on your build. Why spend the big bucks on that "Cafe tail light" when a perfectly good trailer dual filiment raound tail light is availible at a fraction of the cost.

Think about the symtrics. The size of your tank is going to dictate the size of your seat. Balence is everything. Test fit with a friends parts, or build a foam core mock up and test fit, stand back and look at it, look at the front angle, back angle, sleep on it and look again. What looked good in the first 5 minutes may bug the crap out of you in an hour.


Don't discount the "rattle can" paint job. For a cafe bike, it may be exactly what you are looking for. If you are going to go big with the paint job, strip it down to the frame and really consider the frame color as it works with the tank, side convers, seat and fender/s. A lighter color frame really gives it a racer look.

Good luck with your project, take lots of pictures and keep us all updated.

[Fuzzball]

Dittoes on the clubman bars. Been running all summer with superbike bars----they look OK and are comfy. I bought some clubmans a couple weeks ago and admittedly the look is just choice, but I couldn't deal with the riding position. Back to ebay they go.
That's my story.

Great tips BTW, matchanu...

[greenjeans]

Oh and your taste will change over time and as you see other bikes.

Amen.......  I have 2 projects going now and I can change my mind at least twice a day with different paint combos etc....  It's fun seeing all the different interpretations of the "cafe" style...

[mkramer1121]

For you guys wanting to strat a Cafe build up.

Do yourselves a favor and try the drag bars first before buying a clubman or clip on handlebar set up.

The look is still really good, but it is a lot more comfortable.

I have clip ons on my bike, but my seat and tank are pushed back 4 inches. With the rear sets, it makes it a lot more comfortable, but not really all that comfortable.

Or, pony up the money for adjustable clubmans where you can set the angle for comfort and you still get the look.  Also, clubmans w/o rearsets is just asking for chronic back pain in my opinion.

[Jim F]

here is my project that will never be finished

my Ko and my GS projects