Author Topic: 1980 CB650c Rest-o by a crabby "old-timer" (Read 130214 times)

Frankenkit · « **Reply #725 on:** June 09, 2009, 08:26:02 PM »

So....
I was wondering about my accelerator pump, since I was needing 5-8 wrings and maybe holding my throttle open a smidge to get my bike started.

We bought a new pump diaphragm because that's the only rubber part in my whole bank that hasn't been replaced. So I'm unscrewing the screws that hold the pump cap on and I'm not noticing any... spring... pressure.

Yeah. I somehow put the carbs back together months ago without the spring in with the pump. How does that crap happen? Moreover, how was the bike running as well as it was without the accel pump? Freaky. So I have a new spring in there and the new little allen bolts holding the cap on so I can service things down there a little more easily.

that whole thing seems weird, though. I wouldn't think the bike would be as functional without the accelerator pump?

MickeyX · « **Reply #726 on:** June 09, 2009, 08:31:03 PM »

Well, that could explain why it felt like it was holding back...

I'm gonna assume that the bike will get a good thrashing tomorrow to test the theory.

Frankenkit · « **Reply #727 on:** June 09, 2009, 08:33:52 PM »

oh, of course.

Hush · « **Reply #728 on:** June 10, 2009, 03:56:29 AM »

Better to leave that spring out like you did rather than put it on the wrong side of the plunger like I did.

At least it worked for you, if not totally efficiently, amazing how many faults we find with these bikes and yet they are performing quite well.
The pump would have had some springiness from the rubber diaphram, the spring will just increase that pressure.
I can remember pushing the rod on my carb and getting squirted in the face from that strange wee square jet system.

Frankenkit · « **Reply #729 on:** June 12, 2009, 10:31:34 AM »

So I was wondering where my rotor and stator were... The guy got them on the 6th and he advertises 1-3 day turnaround time for just the rotors. (However, I'd expect longer since he takes the core, unwraps it, sand blasts it, cleans it up, rewinds/rewires) so I dropped him an email today. He expects them to ship Monday, so I should have them Thursday. I'm kinda excited because my dad will still be here in town and I think he'd be psyched to help me work on my motorcycle.

I don't anticipate this being insanely difficult, and since I've already taken these parts off Samson, I know what I'm doing and how it all needs to be wired, so I can really show off my stuff.

Dad'll be so proud.

Hush · « **Reply #730 on:** June 12, 2009, 05:37:12 PM »

Hey we're pretty proud of you too Kit, all your work has not gone unnoticed especially by the 650 team on here.

New parts coming yum yum it's just like Xmas again eh.

Frankenkit · « **Reply #731 on:** June 23, 2009, 05:52:37 PM »

Wow. So...

Parents visited, so aside from starting up the bike a couple of times just so they could hear her, nothing got done for the past couple of weeks.

at all.

To top it off I started my WoW habit again, because I have less to putz on on the bike, and that's a good thing.

This morning before work (on that 1500-2000 shift, mmmm!) I put on my new speedo/tach cables and re-routed the gas line without the inline fuel filter. Can't tell if it's easier to route with or without the filter because the weird friggin bend the line has to make with the 90* petcock sucks either way.

As soon as I determined I had correct tire pressure and no leaks, I figured I was ready to ride to work again.

Fun ride!
I can def. tell the difference with that spring in the accelerator pump. Much more zing, much less hesitation. Cables are great, too. No more taking the average of the needle swinging from 45-55. It sits rock-steady on 50.

I could swear I heard tapping somewhere and want someone to tell me that soft tapping noises coming from the engine are totally normal, just so I can relax.

I know. I'm paranoid. I just don't completely trust the quality of my former mechanic's work, and beside that I didn't really have any idea what I was doing. I'm glad it all works, and isn't spewing oil everywhere, though.

Maybe this weekend or the next, the new(rebuilt) stator/rotor/regulator/rectifier are going in. I have all new s/s allen head bolts to hold stuff together and some anti-seize to make sure it doesn't do anything it oughtn't.

tonight will be my first ride in the twilight-near dark so I guess I'll see if my headlight is aimed correctly.

Hush · « **Reply #732 on:** June 23, 2009, 08:05:35 PM »

I could swear I heard tapping somewhere and want someone to tell me that soft tapping noises coming from the engine are totally normal, just so I can relax.

Kit the time to worry with these old ladies is when you"DON'T" hear a funny tapping noise coming from the engine.

Frankenkit · « **Reply #733 on:** June 23, 2009, 09:04:02 PM »

heh.

well, then all things considered, I had a great ride home, too. The light held out- actually I had a lot of light, so the headlight will have to wait a little, I guess.

No gas leaks, though, so that's awesome.

razor02097 · « **Reply #734 on:** June 24, 2009, 04:41:48 AM »

so you couldn't tell where the tapping was coming from? Some clutch noise is normal. Chattering isn't.

MickeyX · « **Reply #735 on:** June 27, 2009, 08:09:56 AM »

I'm thinking from how it sounds, it may be time to check the adjustment on the valves since they've had time to wear in a bit. Not a bad sound to me, just a slight tap at the very top.

We got the rotor and stator back but Kit's parents were in town so we had to put off getting them in until they left. Well, and until we had a day off together to tackle it.

We are planning on heading out here to take care of it today. She got the stator in the housing last night and put in the R/R as well. It takes 2 of us to do the rotor removal though. Kit should be taking pics of the parts to show you what a nice job that guy did on them. Just an amazing difference. $140 for both to be rebuilt. We'll let you know how they perform since I'm sure we'll be doing some testing of the system this week.

mystic_1 · « **Reply #736 on:** June 27, 2009, 08:53:23 AM »

Quote from: MickeyX on June 27, 2009, 08:09:56 AM

We got the rotor and stator back....

...Kit should be taking pics of the parts to show you what a nice job that guy did on them. Just an amazing difference. $140 for both to be rebuilt. We'll let you know how they perform since I'm sure we'll be doing some testing of the system this week.

Looking forward to the pics and test data, that really does seem like a very good deal.

mystic_1

MickeyX · « **Reply #737 on:** June 27, 2009, 12:26:45 PM »

Since she already put the stator in the cover and ran the wiring, we only had to pop off the old rotor and pop the new one on and bolt the stator cover back on. The R/R was already put in yesterday.

We did a quick crank up and at idle, she is putting out close to 13v. (the battery was a little low when we started) The voltage rose smoothly up the revs and topped out at 14.7v. We are going away for the rest of the weekend so we won't be able to do a full test until Sun nite or Mon morn. Kit got pics of the rotor/stator that we had rebuilt. She'll post them when we return. I'm hoping we don't have to replace the battery since this one has been getting abused with the bad charging, but we'll see if it holds charge over the next few weeks. We have a cycle camping week coming up and I don't want to worry whether it will start in the middle of nowhere.

Have a fun weekend everyone!!

Hush · « **Reply #738 on:** June 27, 2009, 04:22:22 PM »

Hi girls, about time we heard from you lot.

$140 is way cheap even at US dollar prices, those voltage readings sound as good as mine so I think you've done the cure.
My battery got hammered before I changed out the rotor, it even lost half it's water at some stage (boiled?) but it bounced back and now gives me no grief.
Enjoy your camping trip, photos will be mandatory, esp embarressing ones like first thing in the morning when you've drunk too much.

Frankenkit · « **Reply #739 on:** June 29, 2009, 10:26:56 AM »

OK, the moment we'd all been waiting for, PICS!
These are going to be kinda big, but I wanted people to be able to see detail.

Starting with the stator:

Didn't have a side-by-side of the new/old stators, but the old stator had stuff burning off of it, the varnish they dipped it in was all over the place and it generally looked like #$%*.
I cleaned all the connectors, packed all connections with dielectric grease go protect them.
Like I stated in Modest_Man's thread, (I think it was his?) my only gripe was actually with the stator in that the harness attached to it is a bit thicker than stock, heavier gauge wire than stock, which is great for power, but made it harder to route. Still, I think I got it all ok.
Put in new brushes, as well. No real visual difference on those, just that the springs are definitely stronger. Replaced all those nasty phillips' bolts with stainless steel allen bolts and anti-seized them all, too. They were a b!tch to get out the first time. (not that I intend to do this again, but you never know

)

Now we get to the 'new' rotor. This is a generous donation from Samson. (Eventually, Delilah's will be sent out for rebuild and go to him.) A complete terror and #$%* to get off, but it eventually popped free. The guy did a great job on it. Visually, it looks brand-new.

Pretty, non? Now let's look at a side-by-side comparison:

From a bit of a distance, the difference is already pretty drastic in that you can actually see the wiring through the coat of insulation, and everything just looks really clean and neat. All the solders, slip rings, winding... very neat and precise.
Here's a closer look, but Macro wasn't working for me so it's a little fuzzy:

From the top, a look at the sliprings, which were apparently resurfaced, as they had some gouges from the brushes:

and a pic of it installed:

Didn't get a pic of the regulator/rectifier, but it tops out at 14.7, which is the same as what Pinhead's tops out at.
The bike now puts out 13v at idle, and maxes at 14.7 starting at 2k rpms. I'll be testing it all today on my way to work and home again.

manjisann · « **Reply #740 on:** June 29, 2009, 10:37:17 AM »

Very nice looking! Definately let us know how it all performs, looks are one thing, but it's performance that matters!

Brandon

Pinhead · « **Reply #741 on:** June 29, 2009, 10:43:17 AM »

Are you using the Ford regulator or did you get a one-piece Honda R/R?

Frankenkit · « **Reply #742 on:** June 29, 2009, 10:45:44 AM »

The Fair Trip we have planned will go from Beaverton, OR to the Fair in Veneta, OR. 114 miles of rolling happiness. Ironically, it's 10-some miles shorter than taking I-5. We tried to take the exact route home FROM the fair yesterday that we would be riding, but we accidentally passed by 99W (territorial Hwy) and went on 99E, which put us on I-5. Still, it was soft, rolling highway with a great view of either side of the Willamette Valley on either side. Expansive fields of waving grass and grain crops, small towns and not too many cars. (why take the old highway when I-5 is so close?) It was funny and sad, we were making great time until we got dumped on I-5 which was at intermittent stand-stills at 4:30 in the afternoon ON A SUNDAY.

Here's a map. (no it doesn't go directly to our apartment, no I will never give out our street address, and no, not even if you bring beer.)

Frankenkit · « **Reply #743 on:** June 29, 2009, 10:48:48 AM »

It's a one-piece aftermarket from Tony Weeks. He builds them locally and I like giving local motorcycle guys money because he makes R/Rs for all kinds of vintage bikes, not just ours. He's a valuable asset to the community.

BTW, Pinhead, is that 14.7v max the same as yours? It seemed kinda high as the Honda one maxed out at 13.8, but I don't know that one extra volt would matter. I'm just not sure of the amperage it puts out and don't yet have a multimeter that can measure vehicle amperage.

Manjisann- oh I know about appearance vs. performance, but it already charges a helluvalot better than my old stuff, so we'll see how it works out.

Pinhead · « **Reply #744 on:** June 29, 2009, 12:05:22 PM »

Quote from: Kit on June 29, 2009, 10:48:48 AM

It's a one-piece aftermarket from Tony Weeks. He builds them locally and I like giving local motorcycle guys money because he makes R/Rs for all kinds of vintage bikes, not just ours. He's a valuable asset to the community. BTW, Pinhead, is that 14.7v max the same as yours? It seemed kinda high as the Honda one maxed out at 13.8, but I don't know that one extra volt would matter. I'm just not sure of the amperage it puts out and don't yet have a multimeter that can measure vehicle amperage.

Manjisann- oh I know about appearance vs. performance, but it already charges a helluvalot better than my old stuff, so we'll see how it works out.

I'm not exactly sure why different regs charge at different voltages; every working alternator that I've measured has been between 13.8 and 14.4v.

I seriously doubt it'll hurt the battery; I'm on the same cheap Walmart battery that I installed just before I hooked up the Ford regulator 3 years ago. The bike still cranks over as well as it did when I first installed the battery.

Hush · « **Reply #745 on:** June 29, 2009, 02:56:15 PM »

Hang on hang on I need a smoke.....parts porn, ahhhhhhhhhhhhhh.
OK I'm fine now, better keep that guys number handy Kit, I can see the 650 guys lining up for some of his handywork.
My charging system is sweet as now but if it fails me and the cost of getting them sent over is too much I might just put them in my luggage and renew my passport.

manjisann · « **Reply #746 on:** June 29, 2009, 04:00:57 PM »

Quote

My charging system is sweet as now but if it fails me and the cost of getting them sent over is too much I might just put them in my luggage and renew my passport.

Right next to the sheep???

Brandon

Frankenkit · « **Reply #747 on:** June 29, 2009, 06:10:43 PM »

Well, I rode to work, parked, let it sit a second and fired her up right away. Didn't start. Spun real fast, didn't start.
I pumped the throttle.
Didn't start.

I freaked out a little and looked at MickeyX.
She pointed at my kill switch. It was still killed.

Oh.

Flipped the switch on.

Fired up RIGHT AWAY!
HELL YEAH!
THAT'S WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT!!!

razor02097 · « **Reply #748 on:** June 29, 2009, 06:32:53 PM »

oops... that has happend to me on my 900. Accidently bumped the kill reaching for the choke.

Hush · « **Reply #749 on:** June 29, 2009, 06:56:36 PM »

Sharp eyes Mickey, saved Kit a whole lota heart-ache.

Kill switch has fooled me in the past too.

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Author Topic: 1980 CB650c Rest-o by a crabby "old-timer" (Read 130214 times)