Topic: Looking for a job sucks...

[DammitDan]

Cover letters, tailored resumes, company research, thank-you notes, walk-in interviews, applications...

Ugh. 

Sometimes I envy you old established people 

[Terry in Australia]

Hey Dirty Dan, come out to Oz and I'll get you a job working with me mate, the pay's crap, and the conditions are poor, but no-one else wants it, so it's nice and secure, ha ha!

[DammitDan]

Ah, if only Australia had open immigration, Terry...

Oh, and ties.  I don't like ties. 

[Terry in Australia]

Ah, if only Australia had open immigration, Terry...

Oh, and ties.  I don't like ties. 

Mate, you'd have no problems coming here, and it'd be nice to have an immigrant who can speak english and actually likes Australia, unlike a lot of the middle-eastern and african immigrants who are streaming into Oz at the moment. They don't like us, they just want to live here................ 

Ties? Ha ha, I'm supposed to wear one when I go to a business meeting, but my (and my staff's) normal dress is company supplied steel capped work boots, jeans and "high visibility" tops. Bit silly really, because we're essentially office workers, but we visit warehouses with forklift trucks and other machinery, so we need to dress like the natives, I guess. Cheers, Terry.  

[BobbyR]

Dan,  What kind of work do you do and what kind of work are you looking for?

[DammitDan]

I just graduated Middle TN State with a BS in Recording Industry Production & Technology, minor in business administration.  Finished my internship at a recording studio in Nashville and found out that I don't wanna be a recording engineer.

I have a lot of experience with computers, having being a network administrator for a year, and I have experience with billing and office assistance as well.

So basically I just want to get a career started in something other than grocery store assistant manager or professional ice cream scooper.

I applied to all the banks in town today as a teller, but either no one is hiring, or they're only hiring part time (which I'll take if nothing else).  I'm still keeping my fingers crossed that something will show up in the music business in Nashville (publishing, digital editing, broadcast, copyright, labels, etc.).  My degree gave me a pretty broad basis of knowledge, it's just applying that knowledge to something useful in the real-world that's proving difficult.

[BobbyR]

Off the top of my head, I would check out Dice.com. One area that seems to get some play is e-learning which combines many of your skills. I am not sure if TN is a hot spot for that, but it costs nothing to check it out. With your background in music engineering and computers, Multimedia seems a fit. Also check out ASTD for e-learning jobs. Indeed.com is a mega job search engine. I changed careers a couple of years ago and I was over 50 which is a killer. Also check out IBM, they have a lot of Consulting positions around the Country. 

[Burke]

Good luck DD. It's hard out there right now.

My Fiance has been looking for a job for 5 months here in MI, and no luck. Her background is similar to yours (BA from CMU in Broadcast Arts and Graphic something, something). Interned all the way through school, then a Radio DJ for a few years out of College, then a APD. Then, boom, no job.

She's working on forming a Production Company (making Radio commercials, voice overs, and such), and she does alot of voice work and copy work from home. Maybe you could freelance doing that type of thing?

Also what turned against being an engineer?
I am a (recovering ) musician and have recorded many times in many places. I alway thought that being a Engineer would be a cool job.

[kghost]

Man that sucks...sorry to hear your having a hard time.

Are you committed to staying in Tennesse?

[mrblasty]

Ah, if only Australia had open immigration, Terry...

Oh, and ties.  I don't like ties. 

Mate, you'd have no problems coming here, and it'd be nice to have an immigrant who can speak english and actually likes Australia, unlike a lot of the middle-eastern and african immigrants who are streaming into Oz at the moment. They don't like us, they just want to live here................ 

Ties? Ha ha, I'm supposed to wear one when I go to a business meeting, but my (and my staff's) normal dress is company supplied steel capped work boots, jeans and "high visibility" tops. Bit silly really, because we're essentially office workers, but we visit warehouses with forklift trucks and other machinery, so we need to dress like the natives, I guess. Cheers, Terry.  

What is it that you do Terry, I've been trying to figure a way out of the states for some time now, My wife could get us out of here but that would require some effort on her part and that ain't gonna happen.  Not looking for a job, casting lines so to speak.

[BobbyR]

If you like Texas, you will like Australia. Australians are very much like Texans.

[mrblasty]

If you like Texas, you will like Australia. Australians are very much like Texans.

I'm not sure I could grow accustomed to walking around with wool stuck in my zipper.

[Uncle Ernie]

Then get a hair cut, for cryin out loud.


My last application was as a golf cart attendant.  I'm not kidding.
I'd set up a shoe shine stand, but everyone wears hiking boots around here.

[Terry in Australia]

Ah, if only Australia had open immigration, Terry...

Oh, and ties.  I don't like ties. 

Mate, you'd have no problems coming here, and it'd be nice to have an immigrant who can speak english and actually likes Australia, unlike a lot of the middle-eastern and african immigrants who are streaming into Oz at the moment. They don't like us, they just want to live here................ 

Ties? Ha ha, I'm supposed to wear one when I go to a business meeting, but my (and my staff's) normal dress is company supplied steel capped work boots, jeans and "high visibility" tops. Bit silly really, because we're essentially office workers, but we visit warehouses with forklift trucks and other machinery, so we need to dress like the natives, I guess. Cheers, Terry.  

What is it that you do Terry, I've been trying to figure a way out of the states for some time now, My wife could get us out of here but that would require some effort on her part and that ain't gonna happen.  Not looking for a job, casting lines so to speak.

G'Day Mr B, I'm a defence contractor mate, involved in the provision of "Garrison Services" on all of the defence sites in Victoria. (Army, Navy and Air Force) This includes firemen, storemen, drivers, cooks, stewards, gardeners, cleaners, security guards, and range staff.

The company I work for employs several hundred staff across the state, and I have input into hiring and occasionally firing, all of 60-odd logistics staff (storemen) employed across 6 sites.

I'm not waving the flag for Oz, and I know that the US is a great country, but if you like warm weather, cold beer and great bike roads, you could do a lot worse! Cheers, Terry.

[UnCrash]

I second Bobby's recommendation to look into eLearning.

It's what I do for a living and I really enjoy it.  Check out the eLearning Guild for more details and a job board.  The elearning guild is the premiere industry organization for elearning in the US.  

I'm speaking at the upcoming annual gathering conference and expo in April.  It's taking place in Orlando.

PM me if you are interested in any more details or would like some tips for breaking into the business.

Best of luck.

Job hunting is a frustrating experience.

[DammitDan]

I'm not 100% absolutely against moving, but all of my family lives here (sisters, parents, grandparents, aunts, uncles, cousins, all within a 150 mile radius)  I wanna stay close to my family.

I actually bought the macbook and Mbox 2 for lightweight commercial production and VO work, and even have a contact in a marketing PR company who can farm out work to me, but that kinda fell through after I figured out I don't know where to start (background music, where to find voice talent, etc.)  And professors unfortunately have been willing but unable to help me out, since that kinda work is really more in the radio field.

What turned me off engineer work was the fact that engineers are basically married to their work.  No time for friends, family, work is everything.  Until you're firmly established (after 15 years in the business), then if you turn down a job, they won't call you back the next time.  I already learned what a lonely life that is by living the lifestyle all during college (I managed a 3.6 GPA and worked close to 40 hours a week, but didn't make any really close friends or go out partying because I was always either working or studying).  I want to have a family some day, and as a recording engineer, that would be extremely difficult even if I did manage to find the balance.

I'll check out the eLearning and dice.com, I hadn't heard of them before.

[UnCrash]

At my current job I used to spend half of my time recording and sweeting Subject Matter Expert audio.  I have now trained an assistant who does all that work.

It's a niche and need within training departments that often don't know how to produce high quality audio for their training programs with their own internal experts.

[DammitDan]

You've certainly piqued my interest, UnCrash...  From my limited experience in mastering audio, I know that a little sweetening can go a long way.  People only notice when it doesn't sound good, right? 

I'm all about the niche job markets, I just don't know where I can start looking to offer my somewhat unorthodox services (or even if the people doing the job themselves know that there are those out there who can make it sound even better).

What would you suggest I search for?  If I understand it right, the position you work at with eLearning an online learning course implementing audio and video broadcasts, and behind the scenes one of your jobs is to tape industry professionals for the lessons and mix in narration?

[fuzzybutt]

i want to go work with terry, hell with the prospects for the white house i dont know as i want to be here anymore. i love my country but i fear my government. only downside i can see is i cant bring my guns lol.

[Terry in Australia]

i want to go work with terry, hell with the prospects for the white house i dont know as i want to be here anymore. i love my country but i fear my government. only downside i can see is i cant bring my guns lol.

Nah, you can bring your guns mate, while we don't have a "gotta have dem guns" culture here, handguns and hunting rifles are legal, you just have to have them registered and you have to have a license.

No military style weapons allowed any more after a couple of nasty mass killings a few years ago which is fair enough though, the kangaroos and razorbacks aren't armed, so a .222 or .308 are still more than enough for a fair fight, ha ha!

Oh, and if you really wanna be prez, we'll let you go back for a few years........... 

[DammitDan]

Ambassador Terry, the Great Communicator?

[Sam Green Racing]

Don't worry Dan, you've got youth on your side, somthing will turn up.

Good luck,

Sam.

[neil young]

get into an apprenticeship!
while my friends were paying for school.i was getting payed to learn a trade (plumbing)
now i make twice the cash they do.and side jobs are a real money maker.
good luck with whatever you choose.

[gerhed]

Dan,

You're actually lucky in away.
Last time I was looking I had to chop
25 years off my resume.
Nobody is interested in someone with 40 years of experience ! (in anything)

Good luck

gerhed

[Cvillechopper]

How are you updating your resume?  Do you have a service or are you working on it yourself.  It's sometimes better to have an outside party take a look and remove some of the subjectivity.  I know some people are a little reluctant to share personal info with people they don't really know but I'd be willing to take a look at your resume and offer any suggestions if you like.  Just thought I'd offer.

Good luck.  Something will turn up.

[DammitDan]

I'm doing all the resume and cover letter writing myself.  But I have no problems with people telling me I'm doing something wrong if they can tell me how to fix it...  I've showed my resume to at least a dozen people, including teachers, professionals, and family and they've all checked off on it.  But I know there's always room for improvement, so if anyone else want to look at it I'm not bashful 

The General version is the resume I give to the general job market (music business or otherwise)
The Tech version is the resume I hand out to tech job offers in the music field
The Full version is the resume with full work history, and I've been using that lately for the banks because of the cash handling experience

If you guys have any suggestions or comments, please let me know 

[BobbyR]

Dan,

You're actually lucky in away.
Last time I was looking I had to chop
25 years off my resume.
Nobody is interested in someone with 40 years of experience ! (in anything)

Good luck

gerhed

I hear ya. Unfortunately they have ways of figuring that stuff out and they do that. I have looked age bias in the face more than a a few times.

[74cb750]

Good luck finding work in your chosen field. Sometimes it is very difficult.

I am also looking for another job as this part-time stuff is crap.
Company says they offer Great benefits blah blah blah, BUT only
if you work 32 hours a week for 52 weeks. (I missed it by 1/2 hour week).
Huh, how did that happen? Been working 3 years and have managed to have 1 week vacation!

My son is going into engineering. Told him to form his own company after 5 years. The trick is to have other people work for you.

peace,
michel

[ProTeal55]

With being just laied off about two weeks ago I feel your pain Dan.
Sucks about being in sales, when the company is taking a dive the salesforce is the first
to be let go.

But as usual, Something will turn up...

[seaweb11]

I have been following this thread for a couple of days.  my Thoughts.

I have a friend who is in his early 50s with a PHD in criminology.  He spends his 1 hour a day on line sending his resume out..................yeah.....still looking for work  

Find some places you would like to work and do some research on them, knock on their door twice a week until they get tired of seeing you.  Amaze them with your knowledge of their business, offer to work for free for a week, "I did this once at 20 and I got the job".

I saw the resumes comming in during that week and I would have never stood a chance at that job except that I was already there doing it

. I have told this small success story to many younger people over the years and (NOT ONE OF THEM EVER DID IT).  It's work...........


Pester,pester,pester. They want keen employees who ever they are. They see hundreds of resumes every day........stand out from the crowd.

Failing that mentality......start your own business.

They're looking for gooey duck divers in Alaska   F7ck if I was single and 24, sounds like fun.

Moving.......Christ you are only 24. You can always move back when you have found your niche. Hell, I lived in Hollywood for a year going to stunt school, did I miss my family.............not so much. Did I move back....yes. These are your years to grow and expand, find your place in the world, don't stick to your town because it's comfortable.

The best learning happens when you are uncomfortable and out of range from others comments and financial reach.

P.S. I am an entrepreneur. I have not looked at a company hiring me since I was 25 . Be your own destiny is my motto.
My .02 cents

Good luck


Reserch, Research, research

Edited as I continue to write...........

 I hope you get what I'm saying, as I would to anyone your age...."with a feeling of a boot in your ass, some progressive job application ideas, and the warm fuzzys.

[mgmuellner]

Your resume's look good to me, I'd interview you. 

[UnCrash]

What would you suggest I search for?  If I understand it right, the position you work at with eLearning an online learning course implementing audio and video broadcasts, and behind the scenes one of your jobs is to tape industry professionals for the lessons and mix in narration?

eLearning Developer is often the term that is used.  You are often expected to have some knowledge of adult learning theory.  The basics of this can be had in about 30 minutes of web research.

Your assumptions about my job are correct.  The main tools I use are: 

• Articulate Studio ( Presenter, Engage & Quizmaker )  This is equivalent to Adobe's Presenter.
• Techsmith: Camtasia (Screen recording)
• Adobe: Photoshop, Premiere, Audition, Acrobat, Dreamweaver & Flash
• Microsoft: PowerPoint & Excel

One thought about your resume.  I don't use the format of resume that you provide as it is hard for it to stand out in a crowd.  I like to use a format that is based around accomplishments because it helps the HR staff who screens your resume have an understanding of what you bring to the table instead of how long you worked somewhere. 

If you don't have any accomplishments to list this format won't work.  I do know that this format helped me land my current job as I was told so my the HR recruiter. 

Additionally I always come in to a interview session with examples of my work (even website designs printed out) which I leave with them, AND letters of reference from past employers.  I always ask my previous employer, or a colleauge of high ranking to write a letter of recommendation for me.  I present them at the end of the interview and welcome the person interviewing me to contact any of these individuals for reference.  No one ever does this, and if they like you equally as well as another prospect, it creates a significant impression and could tip the scales in your favor.

Always make your resume one page if possible.  Let them know that references are available upon request.  Personally I wouldn't put them on a second page.  HR recruiters don't get to that stage mentally for a while, usually after any interviewing process starts.

I don't see anything on the eLearning Guild's website in your area, but here's a link to their job board ---> http://www.elearningguild.com/job_board/jobs/index.cfm?action=view&frompage=1&StartRow=1&MaxRows=40&listwhat=job&filterfield=Staff%20-%20e-Learning%20Development


Here's my resume for your reference.

[DammitDan]

Hey seaweb,

I actually am reading through the job-hunting book "What Color Is Your Parachute" right now, and it also suggests that what you said (getting out in the real world to introduce yourself to employers, whether they're hiring or not) is one the best ways, if not the best way, of finding a job.  And you're right, it takes a lot more work than a lot of people are willing to put into it.

I actually just (hopefully) picked up a short-term independent contract with an OSHA safety consulting company to do some Adobe InDesign graphics and formatting work.  Should last a few weeks, as unfortunately they don't have a permanent position open at the moment for me to work my way into.  But once again, it took me actually making the effort of calling and meeting with them to get as far as I have gotten.

And UnCrash, unfortunately I don't really have the corporate experience that you have to make an "accomplishments" resume.  The only accomplishments I have really contributed are the ones that came with the everyday job duties.  I've never been fired from a job...  that's an accomplishment, right?     But I do offer a personalized cover letter with every resume I send out which basically draws a line between my job experiences up with the work they're needing.  So I guess that's akin to an accomplishments page.  It says, "This is what I know, this is how you can use that knowledge, and here's my resume for proof."

The resume itself is one page, and references are kept on the second page.  I've heard and read conflicting reports about sending the references separately only when asked, but that seems cumbersome to the HR department and really what's the downside to providing both pages at once?

[DammitDan]

Oh, and unfortunately the "work free for a week" thing may not work so well nowadays...  Without compensation, the company can be help liable for infringing on the federal fair labor standards act.  The way I understand it, even in a volunteer position, there has to be SOME kind of compensation (whether it be university hour credits or monetary payment) unless all or the majority of the labor is volunteer.  Or something like that.

There have been some local recording studios pinched here lately that suffered huge fines because they kept interns (who wanted to work) sans pay after their internship with the schools ran out.

[Uncle Ernie]

Your story is the main reason i ended up not getting a job in my allegely chosen profession i went to school for. You're right- in many "careers" you will have no life outside of work.

The proper word for "work for free" is INTERNSHIP.  See if that works...

I heard of a guy who got his foot in the door by doing company research.  He sent a box to the company boss with a note inside that said,  "I understand you're hiring copywriters for $25,000 a year.  When do I start?"
Inside was a check made out to the bossman for $25K.

[DammitDan]

Found this on http://www.dol.gov/elaws/esa/flsa/docs/volunteers.asp

"Under the FLSA, employees may not volunteer services to for-profit private sector employers. On the other hand, in the vast majority of circumstances, individuals can volunteer services to public sector employers. When Congress amended the FLSA in 1985, it made clear that people are allowed to volunteer their services to public agencies and their community with but one exception - public sector employers may not allow their employees to volunteer, without compensation, additional time to do the same work for which they are employed. There is no prohibition on anyone employed in the private sector from volunteering in any capacity or line of work in the public sector."

Stupid government... 

[tsp37]

There is an outfit in Franklin called something like "48 Days to the Work You Love".  Dan Miller is the name that I associate with the bunch.  He used to show up on the Dave Ramsey show.  Although his technique requires a more aggressive personality than mine, I could understand the virtue to the approach.  Mailing resumes is a waste of time.  Resumes are a dime a dozen and you are competing with hordes of others who can hit the "send" button just as fast as you can.

If you want to hear more, drop me an e-mail.

Regards