Topic: No gas in the cylinders!

[TwoTired]

If you assembled the ignition points cam wrong on the mechanical advancer, your ignition timing will be 180 degrees out.

[cbass*gxc]

Sorry I didnt answer that early TT I didnt know what part that was.  I have not taken that piece apart.  I have not even removed the stator plate, just adjusted it.



By the way I have the gas tank sitting on a stand next to the motor, so that it does have gas coming to it when I am trying to start it.  I just spray the starter fluid in there when I try to start it the first time.

[Gordon]

By the way I have the gas tank sitting on a stand next to the motor, so that it does have gas coming to it when I am trying to start it.  I just spray the starter fluid in there when I try to start it the first time.

IMO, starting fluid is pretty useless.  If everything is set properly, the bike will fire up just fine without it.  If it will only start with the starting fluid, then something's still wrong and needs to be fixed.

[754]

Just started reading this thread..

 You are in too much of a hurry..

 Slow down, read a bit before you work. & go a bit slower.

 Simple thing about the vavles, too tight it can not run and that is only one problem, if you had to time cam more than once, you could be having trouble with every other step.

 Not trying to be too harsh, rather teach or help. Double check everything you do.. walk a way a few minutes if it is not clear..

 Double check everything you do (its just GOOD PRACTICE on any work) & it would have caught your cam problem..

 I would not use starter fluid, I dont think it helps your engine any.. I prefer raw gas in a squirter of some sort, but be very careful.. real easy to go wrong with it used the wrong way.and MUST be outside & NOT over asphalt..

 Good luck..

[Cvillechopper]

754 makes a good point.  I tried to insinuate this earlier with my comment about having done this before when I was in a hurry due to frustration.  It's been brought up before but I'll never miss a chance to bring up Pirsig.  His book Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance addresses this tenancy toward rushed work on machines.  If you haven't read it yet, do yourself a favor and go get a copy.  Good story, decent philosophical discussion, and a great writing style.   

[754]

If you didnt have time to do it right at first,
think how much harder it will be to find time to do it over!

Hate to say it but  after the cam is timed,  there is not anyn more than an hour or two actual work ahead if you are experienced.. now if something is broken that is extra, but finding that is less than 2hrs work..

[cbass*gxc]

First off let me say that cville you are the man!  I went at lunch at got all the tappets adjusted to the right measurements (they were all too tight)  and decided I would try to start it before I came back to work and what do you know it fired up!  I had to give it gas to keep it running but the SOB started right up!  I have read the manual on doing all the adjustments but I didnt realize that the tappet adjustment wouldnt let it run.  Anyways it is now running and sounds freaking amaZing. 

754 I do not take your comments as being harsh in the least.  I am one of those guys that hates when some thing takes too long and like to rush to get things done.  Its not that it is riding season and my bike wouldnt start its just me.  And you are right it is great practice seeing as I can get the whole top end of my motor off in an hour or so (got a parts bike and had the bike stripped down, motor out, and top end disassembled in 2 hours).  That is why I love this board is because of people like you, cville, TT, and everyone else.  You guys have done this over and over and know your #$%*. 

I have had someone else recommend that book as well.  may have to see if I can get in soon.

Anyways to everyone who has posted here THANK YOU VERY MUCH!  I wish you all lived closer and I would have you all over for some Homemade Chicken Parmesan and some good whiskey. 

My buddy who works on bikes is still coming by this evening to take a look and see how it all looks and maybe do a quick carb tune and see if we can get it running a bit better.

[mattcb350f]

Good to hear Jay!

I learned a bit from this thread as well, I didn't realize that the fours sparked twice; once on compression and again on exhaust. It makes sense now.

Now about the tappets. When they are adjusted too tight they actually hold the valve open a wee bit which lets all the compression out as well as wont allow proper vacuum to suck the fuel in. This is why it wouldn't start 

Glad to hear it runs, there's no feeling like hearing it run for the first time 

Now like 754 says, double check everything from here on in....

....measure twice and cut once 

 Matt.

[cbass*gxc]

Thank you matt.  You are right there is nothing like hearing it run for the first time especially since this is my first motor work I have ever done and my first bike.  Plus I think a couple of friends didnt think I could get it done but I guess I proved them wrong.  Anyways thank you and hopefully I will be posting pics of me riding very soon.

[mattcb350f]

Plus I think a couple of friends didnt think I could get it done but I guess I proved them wrong. 

  you to eh! Same thing when I did my first engine... They thought I was nuts to take it apart and try to do it myself.

After it ran well, guess who showed up with broken engines at my shop 

[Cvillechopper]

Good on ya, bud.  You'll inevitably have to go back through the valves after running it for a few and everything heating up, cooling down, rinse, repeat.  Any time you have to adjust the valves you've got the potential to need a carb synch as well depending on how far off they were.  Don't forget to put the airbox and filter on before you synch the carbs or you'll be kicking yourself some more.  Make sure you've checked the ignition timing again as well. 

Future rule of thumb for tune-up order:

Tensioner
Tappets
Timing (points)
Carb synch
Idle adjustments

All carb work should be done with everything but the gas tank installed as you are going to drive it.

Good luck and get some pics for us.

[cbass*gxc]

Ya I actually think I am going to run pods so I guess i better wait until I get those in to get the carbs tuned.  I wish they had something like that list in the repair manual or the FAQ's here.  That would have been very helpful. 

Now I just need a chain, front brake line, and clutch line and it will be done.

[Gordon]

Ya I actually think I am going to run pods so I guess i better wait until I get those in to get the carbs tuned. 

You must really like messing with the carbs!

If you've got your mind set on running pods, I'd suggest doing it the other way around.  Get everything running as perfectly as possible before beginning with installing the pods and changing up the jetting and needle positions to compensate for the increased air flow.  If you don't have it running perfectly before making any changes, then you won't know if your running problems are being caused by incorrect air/fuel mix or something that was already wrong before.

[cbass*gxc]

So can I get it tuned pretty good with no airbox and then get pods and tune or should I put the airbox on and then tune then get pods and re-tune?

That confusing enough for you?

[Cvillechopper]

Get it running with the airbox and filter first.  Then switch to pods and start making all sorts of adjustments.  You'll even find that the position of your legs can effect performance noticeably.  They do look cool though.

[cbass*gxc]

I may stick with the factory airbox but we will see.

[Gordon]

I may stick with the factory airbox but we will see.

Unless you really have your heart set on running pods, I think you'll be much happier with that decision. 

[Cvillechopper]

If you want pods for performance, not looks, just get a k&n or other high-flow filter and drill the airbox (search for the proper way to do it).  Either way, getting her tuned up stock is much easier than starting with a custom set-up.

[cbass*gxc]

I may just stick with the stock airbox with a k&n filter.  I will have to see if I have all the parts for it.  When I got the bike the airbox was in a box in pieces so hopefully it is all there.  Plus that would save me the money of buying new pod filters.

[mystic_1]

Congrats on getting the bike running.  I agree with the advice you're getting about starting with the stock induction system.  Get it dialed in like that first and put on some miles, and you'll be in a much better position to judge differences when you do change to pods.

mystic_1

[TwoTired]

This is a 550 we're talking about, right?

You took off the cam cover, right?

You put it back on without backing off the adjusters?  Are you certain the valves didn't get bent as you installed the cam cover?  Easy to do, especially if you're in a hurry.


There is absolutely no need to drill a CB550 air filter box.  Drilling the air plenum box defeats the filter, obviously.  The filter chamber gets plenty of air just by leaving the cover off the top of it.  This may help at RPMs above 9000.

I don't think K&N makes a filter for the stock 550 air box anymore.

If you want a race bike, use pods.  If you want a street bike, use the stock air box.

You'll need patience to put the stock air box back on.  Especially if you didn't take it off.

You'll also need patience to re-jet/adjust the carbs for the pods.

Cheers,

[cbass*gxc]

Ya I took it off but when I was putting it back on I took my time.  With 4 hands instead of 2 it makes it alot easier.

Actually I got the airbox back on with a little rigging and a few cuss words and now the bike seems to run without having to give it gas.  Just need to do a carb tune and hopefully it will be good to go.  The airbox was kind of a #$%* to get in there since I have to leave the seat on but its there.  With the airbox on I can hit the kick start once and she fires right up.  Just a few more pieces and she will be on the road.

I already have another 500 engine that I have torn down to see what is needed for a rebuild.  This one I am going to take my time with since I will have a bike to ride.  I want to have the whole thing sandblasted and repainted.  Luckily my girlfriends cousin works at a paint shop and he said he would do it for me in his spare time.  I had an offer from a guy on thechopperunderground.com that lives about an hour and a half from me who said he would teach me to weld and help me weld a hardtail.  So I think with this motor and frame I am going to make a custom bike with none of the trimmings.

Anyways thanks again for all the help and I think I am going to stick with the stock airbox for the time being.

I will post some pics and try to get some video of the bike running once its all complete. 

[754]

Feels good to fix it yourself EH?

Good for You...

[Cvillechopper]

Very Nice!!!