Topic: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?

[dusterdude]

deke,you`re right,i dont care what it was i would be pissed.

[kghost]

I don't really care what you ride, as long as you ride.

Like I said earlier tho, I really have to laugh at the harley mystic.

They (harleys) do tend to clog up the twisty roads quite a bit. I would rank them (and other cruisers) and goldwings as one step better than cars.

[Sam Green Racing]

It's that white dog again

[eldar]

I think my biggest gripe is that so many HD owners thing they need tons of chrome and loud pipes. When a motorcycle is louder than a fully loaded semi truck downshifting from 55, there is a problem. You can have a great sounding exhaust without being heard for 10 blocks.

[kghost]

It's that white dog again

I must missed the white dog. WTF?

[Egil]

It's that white dog again

I must missed the white dog. WTF?

What  do we lost ?

Egil
Norway

[Sam Green Racing]

Don't worry Egil, when the plane crashed a large white ghost dog came out of the trees and started to eat the rear wing of the plane.

[TwoTired]

Anybody care to comment on a miles per dollar comparison between a Harley and a Honda?

Okay, I'll start.

I got my 74 CB550 in 75 for $450, wrecked.  It had 1500 miles on it.  I put another $400 into it to make it driveable.  It now has 39K miles on it, still works and there were no further major repairs, just routine stuff like tuneups and tires.  The previous owner wrote his out-the-door cost from the dealer in the owners manual of $1880.

By my calculations, that's 44 miles per dollar for my purchase.  And, if I bought it new it would have been 21 miles per dollar.  That's just the cost so far, as it is not worn out yet.

A new Harley would have to go about 357,000 miles without major repairs to be cost competative with the 74 Honda purchased new, and 748,000 miles to compare with my investment in that 74 CB550.  Anybody have such history with their Harley?

I don't hate Harleys.  I always thought they might be fun, once quieted down a bit.
I have looked for basket case Harleys, just 'cause I like to fix machines and was curious about them.  But, they were about the same asking price as one in assembled form, despite their needing even more work than a "running" one.  I could never have gotten the miles per dollar value out of them like the CB550, I think.

[mutters]

 Can anyone explain to me the reason spare parts ( or accessories ) for a hardley cost such mega $$$$
 I need reviving every time I buy sumpfink for my commando, but there is a rarity value to consider there
 it's not like HDs are scarce .

[kghost]

Its the chrome or polish they slap on that drives up the cost 

[Uncle Ernie]

Cost per mile- Reminds me of a time I took someone for a ride in my TR3; "Who cares?!"

Spare parts and maintenance costs- the only things more expensive is maybe a Brough Superior or a Vincent. All Beemers are hella expensive for everythng- every year. You Brits have to piddle with old Beesas, Triumphs and especially Velos more than Harleys.

I think we're all mixing things up too much. First, there's 2 different kinds of Harley riders; the old school who rode motorcycles, not cruisers. They took care of their bikes just as car owners and British bike owners did and still do. MC snobs kept a reputation going that should have died out a long time ago. A stock Ultra Glide will go anywhere.
Just about when Brit stuff was getting long in the tooth and Harley was just managing to hang on, Hondas started appearing. This was still at a time when "Made In Japan" was a euphamism for "JUNK". This is another reputation that should have died long ago. Americans were still mad (racist) about "Japs" because of a fairly recent World War. For such a young country, we are so slow to change.  People saw Hondas and the like as another invasion that was taking MC sales away from "us", and spreading junk around.  Nobody noticed that Hondas were appealing to people who would never think about a Triumph or Harley. They saw a cute couple carry a band instrument with a tag line that you met the nicest clean white middle class suburban young good looking people on one of these equally cute and clean harmless thingies with a quiet little motor.
So now if you think that about Honda riders- go to Alices Restaurant and hang with the Jap bike boys in their colour-matched leathrs and aftermarket pipes. Tell me they're so quiet compared to a Harley. And most of the Harley riders now are clean white professional suburban guys with loud aftermarket pipes.

The comparisons are really useless, however because one rider likes to look at the scenery, and the other is more focused on the road. Generally. Two different types of bikes, two different types of riders.   I have to think this stuff comes up when it's summer and there's only re-runs on TV.

[Sam Green Racing]

Very well put #90

[Egil]

 Ernie

Very well said 


Egil
Norway

[Raul CB750K1]

Uncle Ernie: in that Spain is the same as the US: there are only re-runs in TV. Can you believe this year they are airing "Growing Pains"? Unbelievable.

[Uncle Ernie]

This has been a great morning for laughs.
Raul, this reminds me of the first time I got hit by a car; I was laying there in a hospital bed watching Monty Python's Holy Grail movie. Tears were streaming down my face because the more I shook when I laughed, the more it hurt. I was in agony while laughing my butt off!
So sorry about "Growing Pains". This country has a bad habit of dumping waste in other countries. I hope our "reality" shows aren't floating your way...

[Raul CB750K1]

We've got everything, from "Family Matters" to "Bill Cosby" to the twin Olsen girls. "The Fresh Prince", you name it. Thanks God for Futurama and The Simpsons. The only thing I miss is "curb your enthusiasm" and "Mind of the married man". We already got "Sex and the City", "The Sopranos" etc. Even the spanish-made sitcoms just copy the tried-and-true formula of the american: cute-nice looking boy and girl, father and mather, and ugly-but-nice friends that get most of the laughs, so everybody in the family can identify with somebody.

[mick750F]

   Did somebody mention Futurama?

Mike

[TwoTired]

Cost per mile- Reminds me of a time I took someone for a ride in my TR3; "Who cares?!"

Well, it's clear that you don't, with your large well of funds to dip into.   But, those with lower incomes, do.  As well as those that don't buy into the "deeply in-debt" society.  And from the looks of things, the younger set does, to.  This could also be a hidden basis for the "in" trends.  The old coggers have their Harleys and/or nostalgia bikes.  The younger ones with less discretionary income choose the sport bikes.  What do you suppose will be the nostalgia bikes in 30 years?   Even on this list are people that ressurect these old bikes because they expect it will be cheaper that anything else.  They are the same ones that claim $5 for a brake caliper seal is more than they paid for the bike and is "robbery".  I haven't priced any Harley seals.  But, it wouldn't surprise me to find them even more expensive.

Anyway, costs were certainly a factor for me back in 75 when I got my first SOHC4.  'Twas a happy coincidence, I think.  Pretty sure I'd be significantly poorer had I gone the Harley route, or a TR3, for that matter. 

But, then humans are not rational animals, they are rationalizing animals.  Once it is decided to spend that big lump on some "treasure", all sorts of reasons are found to justify why that was just so important to do.  Enormous time and energy are then spent convincing those in your peer group why that expense was justified. And why they all should do the same, or least envy those that do.  Sometimes, the effort is more to convince the "treasure" owner, rather than the peers.  More of a self gratification effort, really.  I think we all look for self gratification.  Sometimes dismissing anothers' point view does just that. 

[Uncle Ernie]

Wellll, that was when you could buy a really nice TR3 for under $1K . -sigh- those were the days. Speaking of which, if you want to make some dough on car futures, put away a CRX or Civic with heavy tint and a hot engine. The muscle cars of the future.
God help me, but I'm way old enough to know better. I make $8 an hour, but we got a house early here so our mortgage is less than renting a studio, I don't have cable or satelite anything, no air conditioning, my subscriptions have dwindled, I bring my lunch to work, etc. For good Karma, I give $$ to a couple of charities and I won't try to save money on dog food or tires. Most of my peers have more bikes than I do (some of them older, too. The bikes I mean). I still get fevers over bikes I want. Wish we had a MC library where I could just check out a bike for 2 weeks like a book.
I don't worry about parts prices because I've owned Beemers all my adult life. Everything else pales in comparison.
Speaking of Harleys- here's a little secret; Sonny Barger grew up in Oakland, family somewhat limited on funds, also. The only reason he got into Harleys was because that's all that was available cheap at the time. He did all his own work out of desperation and that's why Hell's Angels mostly ride HD. He said that if things were different, Hells Angels might be riding Hondas or Triumphs.
Anyway- somebody buy my Guzzi so I can get on to wasting more money on my 400!

[Sam Green Racing]

Ernie,

What the heck do you do for $8 per hour ? you would find it almost imposible to live in the UK on that amount.
Don't you have a minimum wage over there ?
I think $8 is about £4.46 over here, and I think the minimum wage is around £4.85 and a few years ago when I was on minimum I found It very difficult to live and still enjoy my bikes/riding.
Good luck anyway to you Ern.

Sam.

[Brookesy]

Love bikes - Love 'em all.
Look to the left - Honda 750 DC "Spirit" - (Blue one in my sig. pic.) It's got "Future Classic" written all over it.
Everyone loves it and i get "Nice Harley" all the time - filling up at the Servo - Down town - anywhere.
I always clue them in by pointing to the honda badge - "Nice Honda" i tell 'em.
It's not fast - handles fine though. 750cc and it could do with more power.
I'm coming to terms with it's short-comings. It had 7,000km on it when i bought it in Feb. - now 12,000km.
The only problems i have had with it are
1. I have to keep filling the damn fuel tank.
2. I can't stop riding it 'cause i enjoy it so much (hence ... see #1)
3. My wife loves it and won't let me trade it on a VTX1800
4. Ground clearance - the paint keeps evaporating from the frame

There's more bull#$%* attached to bike brands now than ever before.
When i was looking for a new bike recently, the attitude at some dealers was amazing - i guess i didn't look like a had the money to buy what they were selling or i didn't fit their image. They didn't want to know me. Ducati dealers were the worst.
Go into a Honda dealer and they're friendly without trying to rape you for your money. (or, at least they're gentle)
For various reasons i've ridden Hondas most of my life. Had a few other brands, but mainly Hondas.
Harleys have a huge "Grin Factor" - when you get off at the end of a ride you can't help it. (My little Shadow has the same "Grin Factor")

Ride a CB1300 Honda and it hits the "Giggle Button" - it's a ball tearing monster - i love it.
(i know you don't get them in the States - man, you're missing out.)
You get off, your face hurts and your giggling like a school girl

I can remember the days... (nostalgic glance out the window...) in the 70's when i was a teenager.
The Patch Clubs rode old British bikes, Hondas K's, Kawasaki Z9's (Stone (The Movie), Sex Drugs Rock & Roll)
The world was a wonderful place and Harleys were basket cases waiting to happen.
The K's an Z's were the most desirable thing on the planet

Like i said, i love bikes, all of 'em
It's peoples attitude that gives me the the absolute, violent, screaming S#!ts.
I RIDE BECAUSE I LOVE TO RIDE - GO TO HELL IF YOU DON'T GET IT.

The brand name has less to do with it than where i go, and who i go there with.

[Uncle Ernie]

Sam, I thnk minimum wage here is around $5hr.  Don't know if I'm too lazy, not smart enough, too old, not hungry enough, D- all of the above.  The good Lord watches over children, fools and drunks. I must fit in there somewhere.





                                                                                                                       

[Sam Green Racing]

As long as you are happy and have your health Sir.

Sam

[TwoTired]

Speaking of Harleys- here's a little secret; Sonny Barger grew up in Oakland, family somewhat limited on funds, also. The only reason he got into Harleys was because that's all that was available cheap at the time. He did all his own work out of desperation and that's why Hell's Angels mostly ride HD. He said that if things were different, Hells Angels might be riding Hondas or Triumphs.

Well Sonny Barger also said, " Harleys are junk, technology wise. If I was not a Hells Angel I would probably be riding an ST1100, a BMW or a Triumph. But I am a Hells Angel so I ride a Harley, and the one good thing I can say about Harleys is they made me a good living; by being junk they need to be fixed all the time."

But, Harley's were cheap?   Hmm, I don't think Sonny was ever acused of being a law abiding citizen. Stolen goods are often available cheap.  And, the chop shop laws now on the books weren't in place then.  VIN numbers weren't mandatory then and scrutiny for any serial number authenticity was way more relaxed than it is today.  Also, drug dealers have a lot of discretionary income where the as written sales value becomes much less than the actual exchange value, if you know what I mean.

[Uncle Ernie]

Well, gee whiz... I wasn't going to get into all those details and upset the HD folks. However, before the days of ebay, alot of stuff could be found mouldering behind sheds or in the dumps. There are probably jillions of original Indian fenders buried deep in dumps.