Author Topic: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?  (Read 10428 times)

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bowhunter

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #25 on: August 11, 2005, 05:20:12 PM »
My personal opinion, for what it's worth, is that the 750 Four actually saved Harley from the scrap bin of history. I believe that Harley's parent company ,AMF, decided that there was no way that they wanted to put the money into the product that would have been required to counter the threat from a technologically superior and less expensive machine. Their way out was to sell the company to a management team, a team that actually understood cycles and cyclists. If the 750 had not come along when it did, AMF would have run the Harley brand into the ground within ten years because of their lack of quality control, and the fact that they didn't understand the cycling breed.

YMMV

Bowhunter

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #26 on: August 11, 2005, 06:53:11 PM »
As many of you have, I have ridden my share of harleys. I was always wondering why the made so little power yet so much noise. At the ripe old age of 29 I realize that I wsa missing the whole point.

The old ones in my opinion are cool. And if you tool on your old knuckle or pan...your most likely cool too. But the new ones are ... a fantasy. They are like the 6'4" loud mouth in a bar. Punch him in the mouth good just once and 99 out of 100 times he will go down... and stay down. They dont fight, a lot, if ever cause they are so big no one wants a piece of them.

My dad bought a honda cruiser, it has 1800cc. He has 2 Indians and 2 harleys. Totally immaculate. When mom left him he had to get them appraised for the divorce. $133,000.00 He wont get on then anymore. Not cause they are old or valuable but cause the Honda is so much better. All his friends laughed at him...untill he blew them right off the road! He said he bought it cause he was tired of just going from town to town and worried about breaking down. you all know the deal...call a buddy and hope he's home. Honda gave him a 100,000 mile warrenteeeee. Now more than a few of his friends have bought Hondas or Yamaha cruisers.

Its too big for me to handle (800lbs) but it does ride nice

Don

Offline kghost

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #27 on: August 11, 2005, 07:04:40 PM »
Its too big for me to handle (800lbs) but it does ride nice
Don

I guess your not that 6'4" guy at the bar huh?  :D

I have lost count of the Harleys I've seen at the shop with leaking primary covers.
Stranger in a strange land

Offline Chris Liston

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #28 on: August 11, 2005, 10:10:24 PM »
My personal thoughts.  My brother just bought for his 1st motorcycle a 2005 V-Rod.  I know its not your typical Harley but I have to say its an overpriced (17k with 5yr warranty through Military Sales) piece of dog sh!t.  The bike has approx 270 miles on it and has already been in for defects twice.  First with a faulty clutch hose; just broke and leaked everywhere.  And now not 10 miles after we picked it up from service a faulty cooling system that is leaking red anti-freeze all over the right side engine case.  I love my Honda; it handles 100x better than the V-Rod and is 30 yrs older.  Harleys regardless are just WAY over rated POS's.  I have a buddy of mine who at the drop of a hat will defend the 20k purchase of his Classic to know end.  Its too funny.  
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Offline Egil

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SV: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #29 on: August 12, 2005, 04:51:58 AM »
Good posting guys.

17 replies 52 views in 2 hrs.

Must be beer time in Norway as we have lost Egil. ;D

Sam

You foks started I nice string , I`m read all of it ,and yes I its bed time yesterday!

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Offline dusterdude

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #30 on: August 12, 2005, 06:48:30 AM »
ok ive lost track of who i was going to rebut,because there are so many honda lovers on this forum,go figure huh.my point is it doesnt matter about how technologically superiour any honda may be to a harley.in the long run the harley will be here longer and it will hold its value better than any other brand of bike built.
mark
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Offline Killer Canary

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #31 on: August 12, 2005, 07:06:17 AM »
So you seriously believe no Jap bike can out-last a hog?
If it's worth doing at all it's worth over-doing.
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Offline Raul CB750K1

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #32 on: August 12, 2005, 07:11:30 AM »
But the reason will not be because they are better built. If you buy a Rolex and a Timex watch the Rolex will probably outlast the timest. One of the reasons is that being way more expensive you will care much more for it. If both break, repairing the Rolex will be cost-effective as opposed to the Timex.

Raul

Offline Chris Liston

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #33 on: August 12, 2005, 07:15:21 AM »
ok ive lost track of who i was going to rebut,because there are so many honda lovers on this forum,go figure huh.my point is it doesnt matter about how technologically superiour any honda may be to a harley.in the long run the harley will be here longer and it will hold its value better than any other brand of bike built.

The only reason that Harley's hold their value is because for some reason HD has done a great marketing job at convincing people that HD's are better.  I'll pick a Jap bike over one anyday.  That being said I bet the Jap bike will need far less work in the life of the bike.  Can't say that about a Harley.
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Offline Killer Canary

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #34 on: August 12, 2005, 07:47:03 AM »
So you seriously believe no Jap bike can out-last a hog?
If it's worth doing at all it's worth over-doing.
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Offline dusterdude

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #35 on: August 12, 2005, 08:05:58 AM »
nope
mark
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1 1/2 gl1100 goldwings
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Deke Rivers

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #36 on: August 12, 2005, 08:23:24 AM »
 As the current owner and rider of several brands of bikes (Harley-Davidson, Honda, Kawasaki, Triumph, Yamaha), I don't get the pissing on other brands.  All my bikes are stored next to each other and they don't fight amoung themselves. LOL. Whay should we?

 However, when I hear and read on various forums about the "Harley elitist attitude", I believe that those folks are what I call "lifestylers".  They piss me off ,too and I own and ride an HD! They believe the HOG hype and give real HD owners/riders a bad name.


Quote
That being said I bet the Jap bike will need far less work in the life of the bike.  Can't say that about a Harley.


I can.  My '99 'Davidson has been just as reliable as two of my CB750 ('73 and '93) and my GL1000.  Harley-Davidson's factory support is great. The aftermarket is second to none.

Sure, even the GL1000 would walk the HD in a race. That's not the point for me.

Just enjoy your rides, dudes.  :)  

Offline gkw120649

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #37 on: August 12, 2005, 08:25:43 AM »
My 1977 CB750 K sat for five years.  I put a new battery in it, some fresh gas, hit the button and it caught on the third try.  When it was parked the bike ran until the bowls went dry.  They did leak some but it did run.

Greg in Chicago.  
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Offline dusterdude

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #38 on: August 12, 2005, 08:37:51 AM »
i will agree my honda didnt take a lot of work to get running again,other than them damn carburators and i enjoy riding it,but after owning my harley for 20 yrs,its not the same feeling when i ride the 750.then again maybe its not supposed to be.
mark
1972 k1 750
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1998 cbr600 f3

Offline TwoTired

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #39 on: August 12, 2005, 08:43:23 AM »
Anybody care to comment on a miles per dollar comparaison between a Harley and a Honda?

Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
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Offline Chris Liston

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #40 on: August 12, 2005, 09:08:06 AM »
As the current owner and rider of several brands of bikes (Harley-Davidson, Honda, Kawasaki, Triumph, Yamaha), I don't get the pissing on other brands.  All my bikes are stored next to each other and they don't fight amoung themselves. LOL. Whay should we?

 However, when I hear and read on various forums about the "Harley elitist attitude", I believe that those folks are what I call "lifestylers".  They piss me off ,too and I own and ride an HD! They believe the HOG hype and give real HD owners/riders a bad name.


Quote
That being said I bet the Jap bike will need far less work in the life of the bike.  Can't say that about a Harley.


I can.  My '99 'Davidson has been just as reliable as two of my CB750 ('73 and '93) and my GL1000.  Harley-Davidson's factory support is great. The aftermarket is second to none.

Sure, even the GL1000 would walk the HD in a race. That's not the point for me.

Just enjoy your rides, dudes.  :)  


Deke,  Your right on the Lifesyler Harley riders.  They do ruin it because they believe the hype.  I personally will ride any bike.  I don't really care what it is.  I've always had fun regardless of what I'm riding.  Thats the whole point of riding anyway.  If someone wants to spend 20K + on a bike let them, and let them feel good about it.  I'm alittle pissed at the fact that my brothers bike which cost 17k has been in the shop 3x and doesn't even have 300miles on it.  It could happen with anything but from talking to other Harley owners (some are good friends) it happens alot.  Oh well, ride hard and keep the rubber down.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2005, 09:36:59 AM by Chris Liston »
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Offline dusterdude

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #41 on: August 12, 2005, 09:13:06 AM »
chris.im not much on the new harleys either,then again im not too hung up on anything new.
mark
1972 k1 750
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Offline Steve F

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #42 on: August 12, 2005, 09:50:07 AM »
".....In the long run the harley will be here longer and it will hold its value better than any other brand of bike built."
My thought on this is that they hold their value because you can still use parts from a bike made 30 years ago on a brand new one.  Try that with any other brand of bike, and maybe the bolts will be the only interchangable part you'll find.  ::)

Offline Philly550K1

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #43 on: August 12, 2005, 09:51:46 AM »
Anybody care to comment on a miles per dollar comparaison between a Harley and a Honda?



do miles spent on trailers count?

 :D

Offline Chris Schneiter

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #44 on: August 12, 2005, 09:57:43 AM »
Raul got me thinking about what we're talking about with his coment about the BMW Ad. I'm involved in advertising...in my world, we call that mental inage you get of quality Branding. Branding is what makes you think of a Harley when you hear  a loud Muffler attached to a V twin. Harley has patented that sound. Branding is what makes you think of the Nicest People on a Honda.
Branding is who a company chooses to market to. In the Early 60s, Honda chose those nice people, and when you think of it, they really haven't strayed too much from that.
What Harley did when they bought back the company was brilliant. Harley had the reputation as an old fashioned company. Bikes with Character, ridden by characters. The rep got even worse when they were bought by a bowling company and they gained the rep of being ugly (I think the bowling fashion sense infested the bikes) and leaking oil.. The company needed a total makeover to survive. The Branding of Harley had slipped over the years and needed redirecting.
First, they fixed the mechanical problems (well some of them) and most importantly, identified who they wanted to sell them to. They knew that to make any money, their bikes were going to have to be more expensive because they were built in the US. They couldn't compete with Japanese pricing. So they created the impression of quality, enhanced with a strong dose of the "Made In USA" neo patriotism that was becoming popular at the time....it said, and I think a lot of Harley owners believe that it doesn't matter if it doesn't run perfectly, it's "Made In America", it's our only bike, and I'll stand behind it no matter what..."I'm Proud to be an American, even if my bike runs like Crap"..is the  motto..but it's worked, and now, there is an ilk of "Riders" (if you can call them that) who see a Harley as a status symbol...like a hot car or a yacht..it has nothing to do with how it rides or runs...It's funny, there is an interview with Sonny Barger, one of the founders of the Hells Angels in which he talks about how Harley has tried to distance itself from them...he said he's never bought a new Harley, and thinks he'll never have to because soon, all the Yuppies will go back to their Yachts and Sportscars or what ever is trendy, so there will be more lightly used Harleys available than he could ever use!
Honda, on the other hand, has positioned itself as a practical, well made economical machine, that will not get you dirty and stinky and will get you women that you can take home to Mom. Hondas have always run well and I think most Honda riders ride because they love to ride, and I know a whole lot of them like to ride really long distances...because they can!
Branding is really facinating. In My business (www.greenfrogphoto.com), we have worked long and hard to develop a reputation of quality, but we also started with an unforgetable personna..we use a little frog..and we spread it everywhere! It draws people back..it's kind of silly, but it's like one of those pop songs that you can't get out of your head.
One of our clients was Baker Drivetrain. Bert Baker was a Tranny designer for GM for 15 years. he decided that he didn't want to wear neckties anymore, so he designed a far superior Transmission than Harley ever did and markets it to the high end custom market. Notice, on the walls of every chopper show out there, in the background is a huge Baker Drive Train banner.
I've gone on too long...
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Offline dusterdude

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #45 on: August 12, 2005, 10:03:00 AM »
ces,i thought that was very insightful.thanks
mark
1972 k1 750
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Offline Chris Schneiter

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #46 on: August 12, 2005, 10:12:15 AM »
sorry folks, I tend to get longwinded...more thoughts on Miles VS. Dollars?
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Deke Rivers

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #47 on: August 12, 2005, 10:16:05 AM »
Quote
I'm alittle pissed at the fact that my brothers bike which cost 17k has been in the shop 3x and doesn't even have 300miles on it.

WOW! I'd be pissed, too. 300 miles and 3 trips to the shop?  >:(


Quote
I personally will ride any bike.  I don't really care what it is.  I've always had fun regardless of what I'm riding.  Thats the whole point of riding anyway.

Chris,

Agreed.  I like motorcycles. Plain and simple. Perhaps, that's why I own and ride such a variety of brands and styles. They ALL bring a smile to me when I ride them. :) 8)

Now, I just want to ride my "new" CB500K. So damn close to having it running again. Perhaps, this weekend, she'll be on the road! 8)

Offline Chris Schneiter

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Re: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #48 on: August 12, 2005, 10:55:24 AM »
This is one of the other strings..it's perfect!
Father/Daughter Bonding
« on: Today at 05:03:30 AM »   
------------------------------------------------------------------------
I have nice story about my 8-year old daughter Mariah for everyone.  Last night I was fiddling around in my garage when Mariah and her friend, also 8, came inside.  They were looking at my bike, a cb550, when I hear Mariah's friend say, "Well, MY Dad just bought a NEW Harley."  My daughter replied, "This is a Honda, not a Harley.  MY Dad don't buy junk."  I was so proud of her, I took her and my two sons in town for ice cream.  I also took Mariah's friend along, just to show her you meet the nicest people on a Honda.
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Offline Egil

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SV: Harley VS. Honda. Bike History anyone?
« Reply #49 on: August 12, 2005, 11:14:17 AM »
All of you  have a "1 car, 2 cars, 1 trailer a truck and possible  a  bike?

Or sombody  cant aford to have 1 expensiv car and have it is possible they have classic ore a newer bike , the bike are as a second car .

Sombody just get the bike  and stay whit it !

For sombody the bike are the  lifestyle!

Have I right on thise

"But you meet the nicest people on a Honda "

Egil
Norway
« Last Edit: August 12, 2005, 11:25:11 AM by Egil »
73 de La2vpa.
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