Topic: 1978 suzuki gs 1000

[750K2]

hi all - a buddy of mine has a 78 suzuki gs1000 and it just sits there collecting dust.  i've tried finding an example of this bike on ebay to get some idea of the value but there's absolutely none to be had.  rather than asking ya'll for the value, i'm asking if anyone knows the rep of these bikes.  were they any good, or were they just too little, too late in a changing and competitive marketplace?  i'm new to motorcycling and while i do love my 750k, i've have learned that the kawasaki 1000 replaced it in terms of bad-ass street value.  how did the suzuki stand up?  i did locate a website for owners but really...it's nowhere near as good as this one!  and no, i won't be buying the bike..this is more of an exercise in rampant curiosity.   thanks!
frank

[Gordon]

cycletrader.com is also a good place to check for similar bike asking prices.   

[Terry in Australia]

The GS1000 was arguably the best mass-produced bike ever built in the 1970's mate, according to my "Great Bikes of The 70's" book.

You're right that the Kawasaki Z1 kicked the CB750 off the Superbike podium, and so rather than try to better it, Suzuki instead refined it, first with the GS750, then the amazing GS1000.

Suzuki unashamedly stole a lot of styling cues from Kawasaki, but they built the frame that Kawasaki couldn't, and so ended up with a bike that was as fast as the Z1000 in a straight line, but 10 times better in the twisties.

I've got several GS bikes, I just sold my GS1000G (shafty) and GS750, but I'd never sell my GS1000S "Wes Cooley replica", and I've got a couple more GS1000S parts bikes to ensure that it stays in one piece as long as I do, ha ha! TheGSResources.com is an excellent site, with more members than we have here, and a wealth of technical knowledge.

The GS1000 is almost "bullet proof" mechanically, so you probably won't need much to keep it on the road, but Suzuki still stocks a lot of stuff for them, and used parts are available on EBay. If you decide not to go with it, send it to me, I'll give it a good home, ha ha! Here's a pic of my GS1000S. Cheers, Terry.

 

[750K2]

thanks terry! you're obviously a man of many talents.  i'll let my buddy know he's got a classic sitting in his shed.  he honestly has no idea.   neither did the person he bought it from..for $400.00   btw, i spent some time down under and am still sorry i ever went back home!  someday i'll go back for good, though i've heard it's changed quite a bit.  i was mostly in queensland, way up, katherine, some wonderful hot springs near there, darwin, alice, fraser island and townsville/cairns obviously.   and i found out that bundy rum is just another name for kerosene!
frank

[Terry in Australia]

G'Day Frank, you're welcome mate, but don't blow too much smoke up your mate's arse, as magnificent as they are, they're not a "valuable" bike, although the "S" bikes are a bit more collectible.

I'm glad you liked Oz, I'm in Melbourne, but I've been all over this country when I was in the army, and I've spent a lot of time "up north", it's pretty much "wild west" country still, although they've dropped the speed limit from "No Speed Limit" to 80 MPH recently, which is a shame, The Stuart Highway was a great road to test you and your bike's limits without fear of license loss.........

Come on back mate, and bring that bike, there are plenty of roads which will test it's (very few) limitations!

[bgfootball67]

Love the 78 GS 1000, here is a pick of mine:



I traded this bike, plus some cash for her (blue 78 GS), she already had the mods done that I wanted:



I picked this 79 GS 1000 ($400, title ran rough) to chop a few months ago:



Price depends on location and availability, wait long enough and you will find good deals.  My wife is going to kill me, this weekend I picked up a 77 KZ1000 it was too cheap to pass up.  From my experience, ebay is getting too expensive, people are paying a mint for junk now a days.  I would stick to craigslist looking at large City's around your location.  Tell your buddy you will give him a bit over what he payed for the bike....  Let us know what happens, pics! 

[750K2]

hi guys - talked to my buddy this morning about his bike.  apparently he's also got a 750 that he paid 50 bucks for!  i did tell him that he's got a classic bike - or two - on his hands. it was the neighborly thing to do.  but he's got to go find the value on his own.  terry, if/when i get back to oz, i'm definately bringing my bike!  have to say, all that open country from darwin to broome is soooo tempting.  it's one of those empty spots in a map that just beg for a good long trip, just to see what's there!

[mlinder]

I find handling on the Gs's to be... lacking.

Haven't ridden the gs1000, but have ridden a 1100, a 750, and two 550's.

Did not enjoy the handling characteristics at all.

Terry was partly right about the kz650 we argued about a long time ago though. While still not as fast as my cb750 in the top end, it's handling is vastly superior.

But, I find the cb750 to be a better handler than any of the GS's I've ridden.

The GS's DO have nice powerplants, though.

[kirkn]

That's interesting re: the handling comments.

That was one of their claims to fame, back in the day, is that they were the best handlers of the UJMs of the time.  The '78 GS1000 is reputed to have eclipsed the CBX, the KZ and the Excess 11 in terms of handling.

Myself, I've never ridden a 1000 or 1100 GS.  I had a 82 GS750 (4-valver), but at the time, I lived in S. Florida where the roads are flat & straight as an arrow, so I never got a feel for how they handled.

Owned an XS11, too, but again, was in S. Fla, so I didn't experience how BAD they were reputed to handle.

Hmmm....

Kirk

[mlinder]

The gs1000 may handle better than a Z1 etc... I'm making my main comparison against the kz650... which is really a different beast altogether. Lighter and more agile, for sure.

[azuredesign]

I'm only familiar with the GS1100G, but these were big, heavy bikes, and by todays standards they are somewhat heavy feeling. From my experience with the 1100, If you're too fast, or don't set a good line into turns, you may find yourself sweating it a bit to lean the beast over more to make it through.

That's interesting re: the handling comments.

That was one of their claims to fame, back in the day, is that they were the best handlers of the UJMs of the time.  The '78 GS1000 is reputed to have eclipsed the CBX, the KZ and the Excess 11 in terms of handling.

Myself, I've never ridden a 1000 or 1100 GS.  I had a 82 GS750 (4-valver), but at the time, I lived in S. Florida where the roads are flat & straight as an arrow, so I never got a feel for how they handled.

Owned an XS11, too, but again, was in S. Fla, so I didn't experience how BAD they were reputed to handle.

Hmmm....

Kirk

[Terry in Australia]

Well it's always difficult to argue the merits of 30 year old bikes with guys who may have ridden the same model bikes in recent times, with 30 years of wear, old, under-inflated tires, worn out shocks etc, but back in the day, the GS series Suzuki's were considered to be the first bikes to come out of Japan that actually compared well to European bikes, as far as handling went.

Rather than expound my opinion further, here's an excerpt from Petersen's "Great Bikes of the 70's":



 

[bgfootball67]

Amen Terry!  These old birds are hard to compare to late model units, but late model units do not have half the character of the old iron ponies.....

[azuredesign]

I guess I shouldn't have opened my mouth, but my particular bike was very clean and well maintained. I would blame my own shortcomings before the bikes if I hadn't had a similar displacement and year BMW to compare it with. There's no way the BMW has anywhere near the torque and horsepower to give the same grin factor as the GS. On the other hand, the BMW did and still does handle rings around the GS. Just my .002 though.

Well it's always difficult to argue the merits of 30 year old bikes with guys who may have ridden the same model bikes in recent times, with 30 years of wear, old, under-inflated tires, worn out shocks etc, but back in the day, the GS series Suzuki's were considered to be the first bikes to come out of Japan that actually compared well to European bikes, as far as handling went.

Rather than expound my opinion further, here's an excerpt from Petersen's "Great Bikes of the 70's":



 

[Terry in Australia]

Yeah, it's certainly subjective, I've always had BMW's, I've owned an R69S, R60, R75, R100RS, K100RT and now a K1100LT, and great bikes as they all are, I prefer my GS bikes, but that's just me.

As far as BMW's handling rings around a GS bike goes though, that falls into the Walt Disney "Tall tales and true from our legendary Past" category.

I had a direct comparison, as at the same time as I bought my 1981 GS1000S, I'd owned my 1979 R100RS for several years and even though I'd spent 7000 bucks rebuilding the BMW's engine, transmission, clutch, front forks, (with new progressive springs) new rear shocks, (Koni's) new Bridgestone BT45 tires etc, compared to the bog stock Suzy with 50,000 miles on the clock, it was a dog.

I sold the R100RS and never regretted it, but I wouldn't sell the Suzy. Cheers, Terry.

[azuredesign]

Well Terry,

Sorry to butt heads with you. I really much prefer to have similar rather than opposing points of view, and I respect yours. I don't care much for your reference to Disney, but freely admit that my past isn't legendary. Your rebuttal does make me realize that there must be a significant handling difference between the litre/1100g model and the s model, Although I had a gs750 as well in the early 90's, I can't really recall what it cornered like, all I recall is that it had a much higher seat height than the 1100g, and ran hot.

Perhaps something of our difference in opinion can be made of the poor experience you relate with the r100. I've also had a couple of Beemers, and haven't been dissatisfied, although I've never had to put anywhere near that much dough into one.  I wonder if we ride the same types of routes, or it's just different strokes. Anyway, maybe this is an incentive for checking out another GS, now that I am better able to solve the charging woes I had with my last one, so that I can reevaluate. However, I need another bike like another job.

All best,
Ben

[mlinder]

I guess it really is subjective.

I find the GS's I ride to be just as ill handling as the cb750, with less feedback and a less forgiving nature, and unable to hold a line as well, while the kz650 is leaps and bounds beyond both.

GS's seem to have better brakes than the others though.

Dunno how different the gs1100 is from the gs1000, though, so maybe that's where I'm lacking the experience. Is the GS1000 significantly different form the 1100 and 750?

[azuredesign]

Thanks for writing, I'm glad somebody shares my point of view.

From what I remember the 750, 1000 and 1100 bikes are very much from the same design, the main difference being displacement. All were DOHC.  Some, like my 1100 had 2 valves per cylinder, while the more coveted had 4, which I think was called TSCC to differentiate a different combustion chamber design. My bike was a shaft drive, and somewhat cruiser styled, with a lower seat height, and I am fairly certain that the chain drive models were probably better handling. I recall that both my 1100 and 750 were  heavy bikes , especially as they were air cooled. I wouldn't be surprised to find the mass of the motor was carried higher than todays bikes which also might have made it more difficult to corner with, at least for me. I found mine tracked well, but was a handful on the tight narrow roads I like to ride on. I agree with your term "less forgiving". I loved the power, the front tire would lift off in first and second without trying.

[Terry in Australia]

Well Terry,

Sorry to butt heads with you. I really much prefer to have similar rather than opposing points of view, and I respect yours. I don't care much for your reference to Disney, but freely admit that my past isn't legendary. Your rebuttal does make me realize that there must be a significant handling difference between the litre/1100g model and the s model, Although I had a gs750 as well in the early 90's, I can't really recall what it cornered like, all I recall is that it had a much higher seat height than the 1100g, and ran hot.

Perhaps something of our difference in opinion can be made of the poor experience you relate with the r100. I've also had a couple of Beemers, and haven't been dissatisfied, although I've never had to put anywhere near that much dough into one.  I wonder if we ride the same types of routes, or it's just different strokes. Anyway, maybe this is an incentive for checking out another GS, now that I am better able to solve the charging woes I had with my last one, so that I can reevaluate. However, I need another bike like another job.

All best,
Ben

G'Day Ben, you're right mate, there's nothing wrong with having a difference of opinion (lets face it, the majority of posts will only ever be opnions) as long as we keep it friendly, (which some guys here have a problem with, hence I don't reply to Mark's posts any more) and the reference to Walt Disneys "Tall tales and true from our legendary past" is a reference to how over time, we either demonise, or cannonise, something, as our memories fade.

The BMW R100RS was only recent history though, as I sold it in 2004, after owning it for 12 years. I did a lot of miles on it, but hated the "agricultural" gearbox, hand numbing vibration, thin seat, diving front forks, "shaft effect" picking up and dropping the rear of the bike when I got on and off the gas, pathetic electrics (alternator doesn't charge until the engine is doing 2000 RPM, even a new alternator rotor and stator and electronic regulator/rectifier couldn't stop the battery going flat on my daily commute, and riding with "lights on" was not an option) brake discs that wore out, crap ATE (Volkswagen) front calipers that make single puck CB750 items look good, oil leaks, access to the oil filter requiring the fairing lowers and crash bars be removed, etc etc. Most of that has been fixed with the K bikes, my current K1100LT is a wonderful thing, in comparison.

Now I've only ever ridden a GS1100G once, and even though I did have a GS750 and GS 1000G until recently, they were "projects" and so were sold off before I got too many opportunities to ride them. The GS1000S, at 514 pounds and 88 BHP was only 5 pounds heavier than the GS750, but had another 22 BHP, (mine is the "Big Port" version with closer to 100 BHP) so was a rocket, (40 pounds lighter than the Kawasaki KZ1000, and between 54 and 57 pounds lighter than the Honda CBX and Yamaha XS1100, respectively)) and would leave everything but the Honda CBX in it's wake, and while the porcine CBX wallowed around the bends, the Suzuki ran like it was on rails.

If you want to find out more about the GS bikes, go to TheGSResources.com site, it is dedicated to just the GS bikes, and is huge. There are some incredible bikes there, and many more real "experts" than we have here, or at least a lot more guys with racing cred, because since the introduction of the GS series Suzukis, they have been extremely successful on the track, and further drove home that nail that Kawasaki drove into the coffin of Honda's racing aspirations.

Oh, and yeah, Suzuki electrics are a pain, I've just installed a BMW power socket on my "Wes Cooley Replica" so I can use my BMW trickle charger to keep the battery topped up. Having said that, I still wouldn't trade it for any BMW (or Honda) that I can think of. Cheers, Terry.

[mlinder]

Thats funny, you don't reply to my posts because I'm unfriendly?
Only in the last 2 months have you shown any sign of civility whatsoever to most people here.

Kettle, meet pot.

I never had a BMW newer than 72. I was always surprised at how well the front drum brake worked and how well the charging sytem did.

Must have been quite a few changes between the slash fives and the later bikes.

Azure, ask Terry for me what he thought of the handling on his actual project 750 and 1000.

I was looking at the gs1100, 750 and 550 today, and one thing I noticed was that the steering stock seems to sit quite a bit higher than it's coounterparts from other companies of the time. Could be an optical illusion, though.

Maybe I'll help Marcus get the 1100 running properly in the next couple of weeks, and take it for a spin.

I just don't remember them being that good.

[azuredesign]

Hi Terry,

Thanks for the info on the GS resources site. I have looked at it once or twice to learn about the fix for the charging problem that plagued me in the past. Have you had any experience with your GS dogging it when the air temp gets hot?( above 27 or 28 C)  I still think the GS look great too!

My r100rs is an '82, and it shares the clunky transmission. Additionally, 300 miles and my derriere is done, the seat could be better for sure. I haven't had any charging issues, although I remember that there is a diode board and mounts that a lot of folks have replaced to help charging woes. I have Brembos, and although they're just single pucks, they work pretty well. I bought some organic pads to see if I could minimize rotor wear, but haven't done so yet. Hey, I've only had them a year now. I haven't been bothered by vibration, I've found it fairly smooth for a twin. One reason may be that I think the flywheel was lightened between your model and mine. The shaft effect is not present, possibly because of the lighter flywheel, although I do know what that is about from my R75 4 speed.
 The oil filter situation is a pain, although I don't currently run the fairing. I've seen where people have lugged the frame so that the section covering the oil cooler pump screws can be removed to access them more easily. I just change the 3 allen screws every time I change the filter. I agree totally, bad design. I think this is my 5th year of ownership, and I do have to replace the pan gasket. Additionally, I overtorqued one of the cylinders at the beginning of last season using a torque wrench I was unfamiliar with, then compounded the problem by retorquing correctly, so the base gasket on that side is blowing by a bit.

I am hoping that my cb and Hayabusa will stay together for this season so I can do some overhauling and still have a ride. I would enjoy checking out a K bike, as I've never had the chance.

Let's continue to agree to periodically disagree, it's great to hear from you.
All best,
Ben

 x

G'Day Ben, you're right mate, there's nothing wrong with having a difference of opinion (lets face it, the majority of posts will only ever be opnions) as long as we keep it friendly, (which some guys here have a problem with, hence I don't reply to Mark's posts any more) and the reference to Walt Disneys "Tall tales and true from our legendary past" is a reference to how over time, we either demonise, or cannonise, something, as our memories fade.

The BMW R100RS was only recent history though, as I sold it in 2004, after owning it for 12 years. I did a lot of miles on it, but hated the "agricultural" gearbox, hand numbing vibration, thin seat, diving front forks, "shaft effect" picking up and dropping the rear of the bike when I got on and off the gas, pathetic electrics (alternator doesn't charge until the engine is doing 2000 RPM, even a new alternator rotor and stator and electronic regulator/rectifier couldn't stop the battery going flat on my daily commute, and riding with "lights on" was not an option) brake discs that wore out, crap ATE (Volkswagen) front calipers that make single puck CB750 items look good, oil leaks, access to the oil filter requiring the fairing lowers and crash bars be removed, etc etc. Most of that has been fixed with the K bikes, my current K1100LT is a wonderful thing, in comparison.

Now I've only ever ridden a GS1100G once, and even though I did have a GS750 and GS 1000G until recently, they were "projects" and so were sold off before I got too many opportunities to ride them. The GS1000S, at 514 pounds and 88 BHP was only 5 pounds heavier than the GS750, but had another 22 BHP, (mine is the "Big Port" version with closer to 100 BHP) so was a rocket, (40 pounds lighter than the Kawasaki KZ1000, and between 54 and 57 pounds lighter than the Honda CBX and Yamaha XS1100, respectively)) and would leave everything but the Honda CBX in it's wake, and while the porcine CBX wallowed around the bends, the Suzuki ran like it was on rails.

If you want to find out more about the GS bikes, go to TheGSResources.com site, it is dedicated to just the GS bikes, and is huge. There are some incredible bikes there, and many more real "experts" than we have here, or at least a lot more guys with racing cred, because since the introduction of the GS series Suzukis, they have been extremely successful on the track, and further drove home that nail that Kawasaki drove into the coffin of Honda's racing aspirations.

Oh, and yeah, Suzuki electrics are a pain, I've just installed a BMW power socket on my "Wes Cooley Replica" so I can use my BMW trickle charger to keep the battery topped up. Having said that, I still wouldn't trade it for any BMW (or Honda) that I can think of. Cheers, Terry.

[azuredesign]

Ah, I was feeling pretty good about working stuff out with Terry before seeing this post!

I'm no expert, but do enjoy writing about my highly subjective opinions and memories concerning bikes I have known and loved. I have a feeling that all three of us are alike in that respect, and I also think that, at least for me, my experiences are now longer than my memory. I really don't want to ruin the fun of communicating with guys that like the same stuff I do, by trying to figure out who's more right. I think that as bikes age the discrepancies between any two examples of the same bike increase. Before digital fabrication, this was true even when the bikes were brand new. I only know the bikes I've had experience with. It the bike bit me then the experience left an unpleasant memory, and vice versa. Hearing how other folks dealt with bikes I have some familiarity with is fascinating, that's why this board exists. I enjoy hearing what both of you mugs have to say. Thanks for letting me participate,
Ben

Thats funny, you don't reply to my posts because I'm unfriendly?
Only in the last 2 months have you shown any sign of civility whatsoever to most people here.

Kettle, meet pot.

I never had a BMW newer than 72. I was always surprised at how well the front drum brake worked and how well the charging sytem did.

Must have been quite a few changes between the slash fives and the later bikes.

Azure, ask Terry for me what he thought of the handling on his actual project 750 and 1000.

I was looking at the gs1100, 750 and 550 today, and one thing I noticed was that the steering stock seems to sit quite a bit higher than it's coounterparts from other companies of the time. Could be an optical illusion, though.

Maybe I'll help Marcus get the 1100 running properly in the next couple of weeks, and take it for a spin.

I just don't remember them being that good.

[Terry in Australia]

No worries Ben, and I've still got a soft spot for boxers, believe it or not. I fitted the electronic regulator/rectifier that my Suzuki dealer was selling in 1999, and it was a lot better than the original, but lately my battery is not charging at all, so I think it's the rotor/stator.

Your Brembo's should be twin opposed pistons, and they work brilliantly. I replaced the whole front end on mine with brembo calipers and trick cast iron discs, and used a Suzuki GSXR1100 MC with braided lines and first time I used them in anger, I lifted the back wheel off the ground! Only better brakes I've used are the 4 piston Brembo's with ABS on my K1100LT, they're just magnificent, and you can switch the ABS off, which is a bonus too.
 
I was worried by the relatively small oil capacity on mine, so I machined a "sump extender" from 6061T6 after cutting a timber one out on my band saw, I dropped it an inch, for around another litre of oil. I think the vibration came about from the 12.5:1 Mahle pistons, as I'd ridden other R100's with less vibes than mine, but with the Motorsports cam, it'd do 135 MPH too, so it's all relevant, I guess. Cheers, Terry.  

[azuredesign]

Terry,

I've always wondered if the magnets on the flywheel degauss over time, causing the issue. I  went through a bunch of stators and rectifiers when I had mine, and never got it right. Did you also have any issue with the flywheel loosening up? When I first got mine and realized I had charging problems, I found the flywheel was loose on the crank end. I locktited it and it never loosened again, but I always wondered if that had something to do with my problem.

Very cool sump extender fabrication! I wish I was half that adept at metal fabrication.

The speedo on my '82 only goes to 85 mph(as did all cars and bikes made for the U.S. that year) I have no idea how fast I could go on that bike, maybe 115-120. I remember reading a thread on the Boxerworks site about how there were significant weight discrepancies between some r100 piston pairs causing excess vibration, although I think this was in reference to stock pairs.
Endoing on an airhead made me laugh, who would have thought it was possible!!
G'night mate!
Ben

[Terry in Australia]

G'Day again Ben, well the "loose" rotor is a possibility, I didn't ride it for awhile because I thought I'd done some damage to the crank after one "spirited" ride (90 MPH in second gear at 10K+ RPM) when I got a rattle on the alternator side that wouldn't go away. I left it for a month and fired it up again, and it'd gone away. Hmmmnnn, self repairing bearings? Doubtful.

This engine isn't the original, I fitted Yoshimura 1085 pistons and race cams in my original engine, and this is the stock "spare" engine out of another of my GS1000 bikes, but it had a stuffed valve so I installed my original engine's top end and oh, now it's just confusing, ha ha! I do have a set of NOS Wiseco 1170 "Pro Stock" 15:1 pistons (they don't make 'em anymore, apparently) and some "Ivan Tighe" cams to eventually go into my original engine, (I sold the Yoshi gear) some Mikuni RS flat slide carbs, etc etc, but this engine is otherwise so sweet, I'm in no rush to trade "easy riding" with "Jekyll and Hide", ha ha!

The thing with the R100RS I had, was it was great on fast sweepers, but got "tied up" in really tight stuff with the skinny long travel forks etc, but tuck down behind that beautiful fairing, and not only will you stay dry in a torrential downpour, but you'll stay "arrow straight", it's just that good. Conversely, the R90S fairing I had on mine for awhile just accentuated the speed wobbles, much like the horrible (but really attractive) Suzuki GS1000S handlebar fairing.

The sump extender was easy, I just bought a slab of 1 inch thick alloy plate, and traced the sump pan's shape on the outside, and used the sump gasket to trace the inside, cut it out with my big Bosch jig saw, and used a new gasket top and bottom, with one inch longer screws. I also had to move the top brace of the centre stand down an inch to clear everything, but it really wasn't that hard. Cheers, Terry.