Topic: Just A Bit Of Info, I Thought Was Ironic "Dirt Bike Front Fender", High or Low?

[bill440cars]

        Back when my Dad and my Granddad modified motorcycles to run offroad, they mounted the front fender down close to the tire (to "shave" the mud off of the tire and keep it from building up. Then, next thing you know, Dirt Bikes and Enduros started showing up with the front fender mounted up high. Thought or comments?

[dustyc]

With plenty of room, mud should be able to fly.  With the fender tight, I could see it eventually loading to the point it might have problems.  I'd bet they did some tests.

[Uncle Ernie]

"Yew git a daid 'possum in up under ther you ain't going nowars fast."

Seems like I read that in a book about a guy trying to get back home after the Civil War as he was thinking about the low fender on his dirtbike to pass the time as he trudged through the woods.  Can't remember the name of the book, though.  Seems like it applies here.

[bill440cars]

With plenty of room, mud should be able to fly.  With the fender tight, I could see it eventually loading to the point it might have problems.  I'd bet they did some tests.

         May have something to do with the speed that they ran back then too. A number of offroad type events that I witnessed back then, weren't run all that fast. They were more of an endurance run, you might say. Kinda like the difference between what Chris (Darkrider) ran into on that Poker Run he talked about in another thread. It may well be that for faster events, the raised front fender is best. The close mounted front fender seemed to work for my Dad and the others back then. Just happened to think about it and thought it might be of interest as a bit of history.

[754]

Bill try it here in our 'Glenmore Clay"..!!

 In a week when you get some of it out, & the wheel starts to turn again, you will think different..


 I remember putting my CL 350 on its side and dragging it over 16 ft to get back on a firm road, and squOOOging down that road, with clay extrOOOding out all over the place... took forever to get it all out..

[bill440cars]

Bill try it here in our 'Glenmore Clay"..!!

 In a week when you get some of it out, & the wheel starts to turn again, you will think different..


 I remember putting my CL 350 on its side and dragging it over 16 ft to get back on a firm road, and squOOOging down that road, with clay extrOOOding out all over the place... took forever to get it all out..

         I hear what you are saying, about the clay. Don't know how it would compare. but we have clay here in Arkansas too. Have no idea if one is worse than the other or, if so which one it would be. What I do know and would like to say again (in case I didn't make it clear), is that they would put the front fender lower (just barely above the  tire and if they were to put a larger tire on there, they would have to raise the fender slightly to clear the tire) and the fender would actually slice the mud off of the tire in order to keep it from building up. Now, if they ran as fast back then, as they do now, it might not work very well.   

                               Later on, Bill

[Raul CB750K1]

The design team at BMW didn't know what to do with the front fender on the F650GS......







...that the decided to put a fender up and another one down.


The top one is clearly an exercise in style. People has a pre-conceived idea of an off-road bike with a high fender, so the designers had to put one to make the bike look off-road-ready. But it will ride most of its life on asphalt, therefore a low fender is necessary. That bike is very heavy for any serious off-road use, but it looks the part for any Ewan McGregor wannabee -still laughing with that Hitler video... 

[bill440cars]

The design team at BMW didn't know what to do with the front fender on the F650GS......







...that the decided to put a fender up and another one down.


The top one is clearly an exercise in style. People has a pre-conceived idea of an off-road bike with a high fender, so the designers had to put one to make the bike look off-road-ready. But it will ride most of its life on asphalt, therefore a low fender is necessary. That bike is very heavy for any serious off-road use, but it looks the part for any Ewan McGregor wannabee -still laughing with that Hitler video... 

        Yeah, I've often wondered about the "High & Low Fender" on the BMW. Kind of a strange concept. BMW has been around for quite some time now and could probably do nearly anything and still sell bikes.

        Don't guess anyone thought about raising th front fenders back in the time I was talking about (1950's). I think the first raised front fender I remember seeing was on a early 60's Jawa Motocross.

         

        Just an observation.

[DarkRider]

another thing thats gotta be taken into consideration with Dirt bikes is that over time the front tires gradually got larger...so instead of constantly reworking fender mounts to keep the fender low they just mounted it on the tree. Also along with the evolution of dirt bikes came along more specialized off road tires with larger knobbys on them..

[754]

BTW a lot of dual - purpose bikes in Germany never see much dirt use..

[bill440cars]

BTW a lot of dual - purpose bikes in Germany never see much dirt use..

           I wouldn't know about that, I imagine that there a number of them here in the U.S. that don't really see much, if any offroad time too. Kinda like a large number of 4 wheel drive vehicles (trucks, suvs, jeeps etc.) that are strictly nicely painted, polished and shiny (would cringe at the thought of leaving the pavement.

            This is all about something that I realized and thought I'd throw out there. 

            Also (probably doesn't make any difference, but) Jawas weren't made in Germany, but Czechoslovakia. Same probably applies but I just thought I'd clarify that.

[SEBNN]

Up high allows the mud/clay to fling away without buildup and keeps it out of the sticks for  the most part.  Being as dirtbikes evolved from streeetbikes it makes sense that they would continue with the original mounting location until someone thought to drill 3 holes in the bottom tree to bolt it up to.  Eventually someone needed function more than form and up it went (most likely it was "off it went" prior to up). 

I was going to get an enduro, till I found the dirtbike I wanted and said screw it, nobody wins with a compromise.  Therefore I have my dirtbike and an almost finished street bike .  One will see grave/sand roads at the worst and the other only sees pavement on the way out to the hills.

[bill440cars]

Were youe dads bikes upside down forks or right side up? if the fender moves with the suspension, as on a sohc4, it can be close. If it it is stationary and the suspension moves under it, it must be high to allow for compression of the forks.

        Sorry I didn't see this til now.   Back then, the forks were the same style as our SOHC Hondas (or right side up) and the fender went up and down with the wheel (but was mounted just barely above the wheel). I know that you are saying and I didn't see those high mounted fenders until the early 60's (I think).


 

[Sam Green Racing]

I think you are all missing something here, the positioning of the fender don't have anything to do with what type of forks you use.
The fender can be mounted high or low with any type of front fork you chose to use.
It all comes down to speed. A motocross bike don't want to be slowed by mud dragging under the front fender, whereas a trials bike that isn't built for speed has a low mounted one, it's not rocket science

Sam  -15

[Sam Green Racing]

fishy fishy

Sam -12 

[CharlieT]

Back in my day, *real men* didn't use no stinkin' fender at all on thar dirtbike, high or low. Ya just let the mud fly where it may...................oh, and ya learned to keep your mouth shut!

[Sam Green Racing]

Your avatar seems to say differently

Sam -11 

[CharlieT]

you, sir, are making the assumption that I was a *real man* back then and not just some snot nosed kid!

[bill440cars]

Back in my day, *real men* didn't use no stinkin' fender at all on thar dirtbike, high or low. Ya just let the mud fly where it may...................oh, and ya learned to keep your mouth shut!

Your avatar seems to say differently

Sam -11 

you, sir, are making the assumption that I was a *real man* back then and not just some snot nosed kid!

                                               

[Sam Green Racing]

you, sir, are making the assumption that I was a *real man* back then and not just some snot nosed kid!

 

Sam -10 

[CharlieT]

Ok, Sam, here's from my *real man* wannabe days: