Author Topic: Phaedrus: CB750 RestoMod - Update: 09/23/21 w/ new video (Read 829138 times)

MCRider · « **on:** June 18, 2008, 06:18:45 pm »

I've hesitated starting this string. This project has been started and stopped a few times. I hope to get all the way through it now, with maybe a year target finish. I have some specific build themes to guide my design. So its not a cafe as is so popular now, but what I call a custom. Very high performance, but fully streetable for two people and sport touring. My other motorcycle is an FJR1300, so you can see my bias.

Phaedrus was its name from the first build way back in 1980, shortly after Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance came out. I put about 50,000 mile on it and parked it from a bad oil leak in 1995. So it's still Phaedrus.

I'm down to the frame and have had the first round of frame mods. Gusseting of the frame rails, removal of unnecessary tabs, brackets for steering damper to replace the clampon unit, and a rebuild of the swingarm pivot area as in a previous life I had butchered it installing an oversize pivot bolt system. The system worked, but with no replacement parts available I reverted back to the original. Saldana Racing Products cut out the frame bushings which constitute the pivot hole, fabbed and installed new ones to revert back to stock. I'll use the bronze bushings.

The final frame mods consist of bracketry two Fiamm horns. The purpose of this post. I've found a source for a horn relay kit. http://easternbeaver.com/Main/Products/Horn_Kits/horn_kits.html
While someone can do this on their own for sure, I don't feel like tackling it when a part like this is available.

As soon as my nephew shows me how to post pictures I will.

The chrome 836 project on this forum is particularly interesting. The removable frame rail kit was new to me, at least that design. Way back when before Phaedrus was Phaedrus, it was in racing mode. APE made a removable frame rail kit which I curently have installed and will show to ya'all. APE disavows any knowledge of it at this point, but I have a spare kit with their decals on it, so they can't escape. One would cut out the rails AND the triangulation directly above the rocker box. The replacements lay back in line with the stockers and a slip joint at each end would slide out to connect back to the stubs of the original rails, held with through bolts. Honest.
Ron

fuzzybutt · « **Reply #1 on:** June 18, 2008, 10:24:58 pm »

one of my favorite books. i have one of the frame kits from a member here on this forum. it keeps the triangulation as well.

MCRider · « **Reply #2 on:** June 18, 2008, 11:42:49 pm »

Quote from: fuzzybutt on June 18, 2008, 10:24:58 pm

one of my favorite books. I have one of the frame kits from a member here on this forum. it keeps the triangulation as well.

I learned later that Pirsig rode a CB77 305cc SuperHawk, so that may have been the more appropriate choice. (I have one of those now as well). But "Phaedrus" representing an alter ego, maybe my 750 is apt. Its a 72 (K2) I bought in 74 and we've really been through everything together. My wife and I met on a blind motorcycle date on it back in 1982.
Is that the same one (frame kit) in the "836 Tracy Chrome" project? I'd like to know about it and the maker for my next project.
Ron

bill440cars · « **Reply #3 on:** June 19, 2008, 07:29:53 am »

Don't think he's still making them, but Gordon (Ilbikes) Had some of those frame kits made. They were quite a decent setup too!

Looking forward to seeing what you are building, sounds like a different but interesting direction with that one!

MCRider · « **Reply #4 on:** June 19, 2008, 08:32:23 am »

Quote from: bill440cars on June 19, 2008, 07:29:53 am

Don't think he's still making them, but Gordon (Ilbikes) Had some of those frame kits made. They were quite a decent setup too! Looking forward to seeing what you are building, sounds like a different but interesting direction with that one!

That's fine just curious, I thought it was a good setup also. APE's literature on the kit I have back then said no loss of frame rigidity, but there had to be some, though I never noticed any. Back then dragracers would cut those bars out and race that way. They were always an edgy group.

One frame mod I charged to the machinist was to replace that triangle. he bolted a strap to the backbone, wrapped it down to the 2 removable tubes and bolted it. Then bolted a strap across the 2 tubes. Nicely done. I'll likely never test it with my riding style, but its a peace of mind thing.

Just got back from him, he built a bracket for my engine stand to hold the CB750 cases for top end assembly.

Bot Stebel "Magnum Blaster" Horns (not FIAMMs) from referral on FJR site. Good price for pair. http://www.hornsplusauto.com/ These along with the relay kit are supposed to be twice as loud as stock. That Nautilus mini Air Horn is twice as loud as the Magnums, but posed mounting problems to my feeble mind. Though I won't be for sure about mounting the Magnums till I get them in hand.

I'm attempting to do at least 5 hours per week, this blog is to keep me honest. Pictures next week.
Ron

cb650 bobber · « **Reply #5 on:** June 19, 2008, 08:42:48 am »

ZEN IS THE BEST BOOK EVER

MCRider · « **Reply #6 on:** June 19, 2008, 09:05:35 am »

Quote from: cb650 bobber on June 19, 2008, 08:42:48 am

ZEN IS THE BEST BOOK EVER

I use this in my email signature:

"And what is good, Phaedrus, and what is not good...
Need we ask anyone to tell us these things?"
Robert Pirsig

Meaning: we should know on our own.

MCRider · « **Reply #7 on:** June 19, 2008, 04:16:12 pm »

I'm trying to post a picture of me in 1971 on a K-1 cafe racer I (loosely) built. It was an early Action 4 836cc kit which was turned down CB350 pistons. A spaghetti Triple AAA pipe. Many here have seen the Tracey one piece body. My tank and seat were the spin off Tracy ensemble, 2 separate pieces. Dual CIBIE "airport" lights. Silver frame, home made ported head (guy worked for Yosh). etc.

Now that i know how to post pictures, I'll go take some of Phaedrus.

bzr · « **Reply #8 on:** June 19, 2008, 06:54:04 pm »

Damn, those are some insane pipes!

So where can I get a set?

MCRider · « **Reply #9 on:** June 19, 2008, 07:06:06 pm »

Quote from: bzr on June 19, 2008, 06:54:04 pm

Damn, those are some insane pipes!

So where can I get a set?

They truly were. One of if not the first 4 into 1 made for the 750. That set got stolen when the bike got stolen.

I found another a year or two later, but sold them along with everything else when i got married and sold all my parts to buy a house. Never seen them since.

They were 4 separate header pipes. The rage was "equal length" in the car world all headers were twisty to make them equal length. You had to thread them all together, feed them into the collector and mount them up to the head. Took some doing. I would kill to find another set. The obssession with equal length subsided but I still like the look.

For this Phaedrus project I found that the Marshall Deep Tones had some twisty to them. So I got a set. I can't find that they make them for the SOHC anymore.
Ron

bill440cars · « **Reply #10 on:** June 19, 2008, 08:42:16 pm »

That is one very cool bike!

I'm liking the whole bike. Thanks for posting and now I'm looking even more forward to seeing your current build.

MCRider · « **Reply #11 on:** June 20, 2008, 12:25:52 am »

Quote from: bill440cars on June 19, 2008, 08:42:16 pm

That is one very cool bike! I'm liking the whole bike. Thanks for posting and now I'm looking even more forward to seeing your current build.

Thanks! It was a lot of fun. Burned a lot of rubber. Now for the future: Here's the APE frame rail kit. The sleeves slip over the removable tubes first, then you place the tube in line with the stubs on the bike, slide the sleeves out over the stub, install the bolts. Also in the pic is a reinforced rocker box I had built by a machinist in Washington State who had goten hold of the template. For those unaware, if you use a big bump or extended high RPMs with HD valve springs, the cam supports would flex and lift off the head causing mysterious oil leaks and at worst, loss of oiling to one side or the other of the cam. It would seize that side in the stand and twist itself in half. Happened to me. I don't expect to ride like that again, but I want the parking lot WOW factor.

MCRider · « **Reply #12 on:** June 20, 2008, 12:44:03 am »

Here's the first round of frame mods. I had to restore the swingarm pivot to original. It had been drilled out (hogged out) to accept an oversize bolt. The machinist pointed out that the pivot area is actually a bushing welded into the frame at the factory. He cut it out, fabbed a new one and welded it back in. Also removed some really ugly rearset brackets that were welded on, can't even see where they were; These guys are just magic. Further mods: gusset above SA pivot, gusset where airbox tab used to be, bracket for steering damper, reset passenger pegs, (on orig Phaedrus they were clamped on the original trainagle at about that position so I said hey let's make it permanent); restored the backbone triangle with steel straps; you can see the period S&W chrome shocks I found new in a box at a swap meet; mods to come; horn mounts, fill and smooth all welds; oil cooler mount; click to enlarge (duh)

MCRider · « **Reply #13 on:** June 20, 2008, 12:54:23 am »

One final for now, going on overnighter with wifer on FJR/ Burgman.
Next week I'll learn how to use photobucket.

troppo · « **Reply #14 on:** June 20, 2008, 01:55:34 am »

There is definately some nice work in there already, cant wait to see more

andy750 · « **Reply #15 on:** June 20, 2008, 04:36:26 am »

Very impressive and looking forward to hearing/learning more.

Have a good trip!
cheers
Andy

Terry in Australia · « **Reply #16 on:** June 20, 2008, 05:41:38 am »

Well done mate, as much as I've always considered that Pirsig book a load of self indulgent ego stroking, I'm really enjoying this thread so far, I love all the 1970's era aftermarket stuff and I buy it whenever I see it to add to my K1. Keep going mate, and keep posting pics! Cheers, Terry.

MCRider · « **Reply #17 on:** June 20, 2008, 06:32:59 am »

Quote from: Terry in Australia on June 20, 2008, 05:41:38 am

Well done mate, as much as I've always considered that Pirsig book a load of self indulgent ego stroking, I'm really enjoying this thread so far, I love all the 1970's era aftermarket stuff and I buy it whenever I see it to add to my K1. Keep going mate, and keep posting pics! Cheers, Terry.

Yes I can see where you would think that, and that's OK, any response to a book is a good response. He was (is) a certifiable genius by those who certify such things, but he was (is) a certifiable nutjob too.

I've just adopted the Phaedrus thing as an alter ego. It makes for parking lot conversation also.

I just want to say that since returning to the board, I can't believe the amount of information here, and you are a major contributor. But the other standout names are ...standouts as well, and I have spent hours already scanning yours and others posts for ideas. Thanks!

Finally, is that a Marshall pipe on your bike? I bought mine a few years ago and its been in a box ever since. I'll need to drag it out and dryfit it to my frame to spot the oil cooler, horns and the muffler hanger. I hope it is as the wriggly pipes are reminiscent of my old Tripple A spaghetti pipe.

Thanks!

Terry in Australia · « **Reply #18 on:** June 20, 2008, 06:25:50 pm »

No worries mate, at the moment I'm reading "All quiet on the western front" which is considered the best war book ever written, and I'm inclined to agree, as a soldier myself I can relate to the thoughts and feelings of the German author, and it proves to me that we haven't moved very far forward since 1918.

That pipe was a lucky find at a swap meet last year, it was a NOS Japanese built pipe that was in a box marked with an American custom parts manufacturer, (can't remember the name) so there might be a few more in the US still? It's not a Marshall though, I've seen a couple of them and they're quite different. They do sound nice though, I wouldn't mind one. Cheers, Terry.

MCRider · « **Reply #19 on:** June 22, 2008, 05:32:22 pm »

Quote from: Terry in Australia on June 20, 2008, 06:25:50 pm

SNIP

That pipe was a lucky find at a swap meet last year, it was a NOS Japanese built pipe that was in a box marked with an American custom parts manufacturer, (can't remember the name) so there might be a few more in the US still? It's not a Marshall though, I've seen a couple of them and they're quite different. They do sound nice though, I wouldn't mind one. Cheers, Terry.

That's a story on that pipe! never seen one. I only saw my Marshall in a brief promo shot several years ago. My next project step is to dryfit everything (using a hollow motor) except the wheels, to mark the final spots for the muffler hanger, horns, oil cooler, and other bits. I'll have the Marshall on it then for a look see.

I want to say that several of the things I thought I was breaking ground on have already been done here. I found a post of a guy who redesigned the passenger peg triangle but for his rearsets. Also, found a post where someone selded on a tab for a permanent steering damper. his was left side, mine right. Now I wish mine was left side. No need to let go of throttle to adjust it. BTW My Damper is a period Dunstall with 7 click adjustment. I have a new one still in the box from 1978.

I am 99% on a gold metallic frame. But now I see the "world Famous" Carpy cafe racer has a gold frame. But I swear I'd decided on my color before he did.

Whats that old phrase, nothing new under the sun? Biblical even I think.

Terry in Australia · « **Reply #20 on:** June 23, 2008, 08:42:08 pm »

Sounds good mate, not keen on the gold frame though, I like to stick with black (albeit gloss black) because it can be used with any style, Chopper, Cafe Racer, etc, and doesn't "date" like gold or silver, I'm not really conservative, I just like what I like. (And I don't like any of Carpy's bikes, they look ok from 10 feet away, but are poorly engineered, IMHO)

The steering damper is a good idea, years ago I had a really neat "bolt on" alloy bracket that was quite common back in the 1970's, (It came from the USA) but I left it (and the damper) on a bike I sold, sadly. I'll weld a bracket on mine when I mount the damper I bought from Dan Fischer recently, in fact, now that I've almost positively decided to install the rebuilt K2 engine in the F2, I might prep the K2 frame with extra brackets welded on for the disc braked rear wheel and a steering damper bracket, then get it powder coated in preparation for transferring most of the other parts across from the F1. Cheers, Terry.

MCRider · « **Reply #21 on:** June 24, 2008, 11:50:02 am »

Quote from: Terry in Australia on June 23, 2008, 08:42:08 pm

Sounds good mate, not keen on the gold frame though, I like to stick with black (albeit gloss black) because it can be used with any style, Chopper, Cafe Racer, etc, and doesn't "date" like gold or silver, I'm not really conservative, I just like what I like. (And I don't like any of Carpy's bikes, they look ok from 10 feet away, but are poorly engineered, IMHO)

The steering damper is a good idea, years ago I had a really neat "bolt on" alloy bracket that was quite common back in the 1970's, (It came from the USA) but I left it (and the damper) on a bike I sold, sadly. I'll weld a bracket on mine when I mount the damper I bought from Dan Fischer recently, in fact, now that I've almost positively decided to install the rebuilt K2 engine in the F2, I might prep the K2 frame with extra brackets welded on for the disc braked rear wheel and a steering damper bracket, then get it powder coated in preparation for transferring most of the other parts across from the F1. Cheers, Terry.

"I just like what I like" I can understand that. In my case, I may not know if I like it or not. I've lived a bland life in a beige house. Painting one wall and wallpapering another has been a liberating experience. Maybe a gold frame also.

My original Dunstall damper bracket as supplied was a muffler clamp, albeit in chrome, with an "L" bracket. But it was and looked like a muffler bracket. A welded on flange is much cleaner.

Curious about your rear disc brake. Homemade conversion?

Got my wheel truing and balancing stand today. No wheel parts yet. Horns are on their way. I've devised a gusset for the front of the frame (each side) that will tie the removable frame tube joint to the downtube. The horns may mount on those. Right side may interfere with tach cable, TWT.

hat was the final loose end to gusseting the frame. I do like the swingarm pivot gusset on "Big Benley" but that's likely overkill on this project. I have a smaller gusset and likely a HondaMan set up swingarm. The two being an order of magnitutde better than the original.

Might do the "Big Benley" gusset on the next project.

MCRider · « **Reply #22 on:** June 29, 2008, 09:43:25 am »

Got my 5 hours in this week. MAy take forever, but I'm making progress. Mocked up without wheels to place final brackets for horns, oil cooler, exhaust hanger, etc.

Photo is Tank and Seat combo. Phaedrus wolfhead is gold leaf, seat is one-off Corbin Gunfighter and Lady with backrest.

MCRider · « **Reply #23 on:** June 29, 2008, 09:48:21 am »

Pipe is Marshall DeepTone. Uses original spigots, anyone have any, along with the finned collar clamps?

MCRider · « **Reply #24 on:** June 29, 2008, 09:51:00 am »

Bike is suspended from ceiling with stand on swingarm.

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Author Topic: Phaedrus: CB750 RestoMod - Update: 09/23/21 w/ new video (Read 829138 times)

fuzzybutt

troppo