Author Topic: Phaedrus: CB750 RestoMod - Update: 09/23/21 w/ new video  (Read 868216 times)

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Offline Brown Bomber

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/10/10- w/ new pics
« Reply #1450 on: October 10, 2010, 10:00:39 AM »
I like shiny stuff, easier to clean too. I say go for chrome ;)
Keep the Shiny side up!

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/10/10- w/ new pics
« Reply #1451 on: October 10, 2010, 11:26:58 AM »
Personally I wouldn't chrome over aluminum.  Have them polished and you can always touch them up with mothers or simichrome or the like.  In the mid 90s I worked for a HD dealership.  We used Brown's exclusively for chrome.  We used to send out batches of bare handlebar switch housings for chrome.  It was nerve wracking bolting those on.  You had to go slow and listen for the telltale "crack" of new chrome poping off the aluminum housings.  Needless to say, if they didn't crack when we first installed them then they sure would within the year as we got the bike back for service.  Ever since I am really nervous about chroming over aluminum.  It almost always starts to crack and peel somewhere.

BTW how does Browns chrome look these days?  I see they have opened up their business to retail customers.  The Brown's chrome in the 90s always had a goldish/yellow tint to it and you could only get it through a shop.  My 79 Bonneville has Brown's chromed fenders, handlebars, and just about everything else that was originally chrome.  It has held up really well over 10+ years.
Scott

Offline MCRider

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/10/10- w/ new pics
« Reply #1452 on: October 10, 2010, 12:48:04 PM »
Personally I wouldn't chrome over aluminum.  Have them polished and you can always touch them up with mothers or simichrome or the like.  In the mid 90s I worked for a HD dealership.  We used Brown's exclusively for chrome.  We used to send out batches of bare handlebar switch housings for chrome.  It was nerve wracking bolting those on.  You had to go slow and listen for the telltale "crack" of new chrome poping off the aluminum housings.  Needless to say, if they didn't crack when we first installed them then they sure would within the year as we got the bike back for service.  Ever since I am really nervous about chroming over aluminum.  It almost always starts to crack and peel somewhere.

BTW how does Browns chrome look these days?  I see they have opened up their business to retail customers.  The Brown's chrome in the 90s always had a goldish/yellow tint to it and you could only get it through a shop.  My 79 Bonneville has Brown's chromed fenders, handlebars, and just about everything else that was originally chrome.  It has held up really well over 10+ years.
Scott
Throughout my build, I've had a couple of batches done at Brown's. Some of my chrome is left over from Phaedrus I built in 1980. The swingarm I had redone along with the headlight brackets, which were aluminum BTW and of the clamping variety. I've always been wary of chrome on anything that had a clamping function, steel or aluminum. They guarantee it so i did it. Their job to turn it down if they don't think it will hold up.
Strange that at the same price for polishing or chrome, they are encouraging me to chrome it, saying "don't forget we chrome aluminum".  If they were scared of it and knowing I would be happy with polish, they have their opportunity to make the same money with less liability.?

Service was amazing. Compared to several attempts I've had at local plating shops that advertise great product, but they kept it for months and then it peeled. I can stand the peeliing if the turnaround is quick and they guarantee it which Brown's does.

And the look is deep mesmerizing chrome with no discernable tint that i can see.

Still, I know what you're saying about chroming aluminum, I've seen poor quality there usually on engine covers. Brown's says their multiple 7 layer process fixes that.

Hmmm

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1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

Offline Terry in Australia

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/10/10- w/ new pics
« Reply #1453 on: October 11, 2010, 04:21:36 AM »
Get it chromed Ron, hell, the parts you're getting done are easy enough to replace if it all turns to poop!

That yellow/gold tint thing is interesting, the PO of my Gold K2 said that he had all the allot covers on it nickel plated, and there is a distinct yellow/gold tint to it. Maybe that's what Brown's did "back in the day" with aluminum?

Oh, and don't throw that solid countershaft out mate, I've had it confirmed, it IS definitely K0, the "Experts" who said it was late K/F were w.r.o.n.g! Cheers, Terry. ;D
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Offline Ichiban 4

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/10/10- w/ new pics
« Reply #1454 on: October 14, 2010, 06:57:48 PM »
Just a comment here: but when I worked for Hoak Bros. Plating (in So. Calif. the mid 1960's)..you could get "goldish tinted" chrome..by either heating the electrolyte too high..or not cleaning out the plating tanks / renewing the electrolyte often enough.  In other words..it was not a preferred result..but more a reflection of not paying attention enough to the maintenance of the electrolyte and tanks temps / heaters.

At certain times we were working 3 shifts..24 hours a day..to keep up with the demand..so it's understandable that some things were allowed to slip a little.   It's also a big hassle to deal with all of the waste electrolyte..which is toxic..and cannot be simply dumped nowadays..like was done in the 60's.  Thank goodness!

Good chrome jobs are hard to come by nowadays..I feel..because of not only the skill / experience required..but because of all the EPA regulations.  Brown's is a treasure..that we all should appreciate..I believe.

Ron..BTW: was thinking that with all the stuff about anodizing being posted on these threads recently..that might be the way to go with some of this stuff..do you think??

Al / Ichi
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Past: '73 CB450(twin), '72 CB175, '68 CB350, '58 Ariel Square 4 (1000cc), '58 Matchless Typhoon (650cc single), Whizzer Motorbikes '48 -'55 (Pacemaker & Sportsman)..Vespa, Lambretta scooters..etc.

Offline MCRider

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/10/10- w/ new pics
« Reply #1455 on: October 14, 2010, 07:25:31 PM »
Get it chromed Ron, hell, the parts you're getting done are easy enough to replace if it all turns to poop!

That yellow/gold tint thing is interesting, the PO of my Gold K2 said that he had all the allot covers on it nickel plated, and there is a distinct yellow/gold tint to it. Maybe that's what Brown's did "back in the day" with aluminum?

Oh, and don't throw that solid countershaft out mate, I've had it confirmed, it IS definitely K0, the "Experts" who said it was late K/F were w.r.o.n.g! Cheers, Terry. ;D
Terry: I for one don't know. But would the K0 be machine for the wide bearing? Also, the set up I bot carried the later 50 tooth gear, rather than the earlier 56. Could have been changed i suppose, but seems a stretch from what i know of the (supposed) history. Nevertheless, you ain't gettin it!   ;) 

Al: Thanks for the info. Brown's advertises in the VJMC magazine, appealing to JAP restorers, and seem to really care.

Too late, its all gone to Brown's. I'm quaking, waiting on the estimate... Whatever it is...the die is cast!

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Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

Offline Terry in Australia

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/10/10- w/ new pics
« Reply #1456 on: October 15, 2010, 02:27:46 AM »
Ha ha, no wories Ron, you can keep it. I bought one on EBay in excellent condition with the gear and bearings, end plug etc, for 70 bucks, and I don't need a spare. Best of luck with your chrome! ;D
I was feeling sorry for myself because I couldn't afford new bike boots, until I met a man with no legs.

So I said, "Hey mate, you haven't got any bike boots you don't need, do you?"

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Offline Really?

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/10/10- w/ new pics
« Reply #1457 on: October 15, 2010, 09:14:01 AM »
Interested to see how the chroming turns out and the cost.  Curious though, what about the threads on some of those parts?  Do you have to tap them when you get them back or do they plug them up so none of the chrome get to them?

Yes, I still read this build thread even though I do not post to it often.  This is a truely great build thread and I have a lot of respect for you Ron.
« Last Edit: October 15, 2010, 09:15:37 AM by TipperT »
I don't have a motorcycle, sold it ('85 Yamaha Venture Royale).  Haven't had a CB750 for over 40 years.

The Wife's Bike - 750K5
The Kid's Bike - 750K3

Offline MCRider

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/10/10- w/ new pics
« Reply #1458 on: October 15, 2010, 09:28:02 AM »
They are masters at plugging and taping. Specifically, for exampple, it says in their catalog they take extra care with disc brake calipers to plug and mask everything. Course that's why they get the big $$.

Even then, I've tagged everypart that requires care. They're supposed to call before starting and have a consult to clear everything up. They did on the last batch i sent them, but there weren't as many problem areas then as with this batch.

Thanks for the kind words. Going slower than even first imagined. But it will be finished.
« Last Edit: October 15, 2010, 09:31:14 AM by MCRider »
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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/10/10- w/ new pics
« Reply #1459 on: October 17, 2010, 08:18:27 PM »
More headway this week. Parts shipped to Brown's. Listing these, tagging, wrapping packing, all takes time. received the HD cam chain tensioner from KOS/M# Racing/ Mark Mcgrew. Nice piece:

Trivia: The part was wrapped in a newspaper, the Madison Courier, Madison IN! M3 is in Minnesota.
The CL77 I'm babysitting has 2 flat tires. This makes it real hard to push out every Sunday to make room to work. I had ridden down to DT Cycles on Sat AM on a scouting session. So I bot a tube from him, would've gotten two but he only had the one.
So we pulled the front wheel for beginners.

That tire is hard as rock, way past expiration date. Used bits of a thin plastic kitchen cutting board as rim protectors. They worked surprisingly well, slip right in, stay put.

Also used the tire "breezer" for the first time in decades:

Discovered rubber rim strip had broken down and came out in bits. This bike has a hole in the rims 180deg from the valve stem where a "rim lock" is supposed to go. The rim locks have been left out of this bike which leaves a hole in the rim. That's where the hole in the tube was.
The threads of many spokes were sticking up above the nipples and while they hadn't punched thru the rim strip, we couldn't put it back together that way.

Probably 15 had to be ground down to be flush. This bike was assembled/restored by a Honda mechanic,  with a great reputation. Even so, keep this in mind. You just never know who will shortcut and when.
It was even more of a b--ch getting it back on. But with one wheel aired up its much more pushable. I'll tell the owner he needs new tires bad, but he won't be doing it till next spring.

Was notified the primary chains have been shipped. Got several parts to sell to restore the treasury.



« Last Edit: October 17, 2010, 08:23:37 PM by MCRider »
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1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

Offline HondaMan

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/10/10- w/ new pics
« Reply #1460 on: October 17, 2010, 09:24:14 PM »
Wow, those CL77 spokes are long! Is it a 19" front wheel? (That was the stock size for a CL77 after 1966.) It almost looks like 19" spokes in an 18" wheel.

I just finished a pair of DOHC Honda Fours (1980 genre, for two different customers) that came from a "reputable Honda mechanic" locally. Without going into detail...I think his reputation may not be a good one?  :-\

I'll be real interested in seeing those chromed front calipers: I always remember how great the K0 polished-up ones looked. Did Brown's do that beautiful swingarm I fixed up for you? That thing looked like a mirror!  :o
See SOHC4shop@gmail.com for info about the gadgets I make for these bikes.

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Offline MCRider

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/10/10- w/ new pics
« Reply #1461 on: October 18, 2010, 05:23:00 AM »
Wow, those CL77 spokes are long! Is it a 19" front wheel? (That was the stock size for a CL77 after 1966.) It almost looks like 19" spokes in an 18" wheel.

I just finished a pair of DOHC Honda Fours (1980 genre, for two different customers) that came from a "reputable Honda mechanic" locally. Without going into detail...I think his reputation may not be a good one?  :-\

I'll be real interested in seeing those chromed front calipers: I always remember how great the K0 polished-up ones looked. Did Brown's do that beautiful swingarm I fixed up for you? That thing looked like a mirror!  :o
Yes 19" front and rear. Don't know why with factory spokes they were so far off.

Yeah, mine were K0 polished. And since restoring the polish cost as much as chrome, I'll go with chrome this time. Yes it was Brown's for the swingarm. They are pricey, but the service can't be beat. My experience with service from local chrome shops was SO frustrating, I'd rather pay the premium and not worry.
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Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/10/10- w/ new pics
« Reply #1462 on: October 21, 2010, 10:57:18 AM »
Primary chains came in, very sexy.

Chrome quote came in... not so sexy... $1050.  About what i was expecting really, everything is itemized in their catalog, so I kinda knew.  Lots of small bits, but that's whats going to make a difference.

I don't know when this project took on the trappings of a show bike... I still intend to ride the wheels off of it.
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Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

Offline Really?

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/10/10- w/ new pics
« Reply #1463 on: October 21, 2010, 02:19:20 PM »
Please tell me there are more items being chromed other than what is in the image further up in this thread for that quote.
I don't have a motorcycle, sold it ('85 Yamaha Venture Royale).  Haven't had a CB750 for over 40 years.

The Wife's Bike - 750K5
The Kid's Bike - 750K3

Offline MCRider

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/10/10- w/ new pics
« Reply #1464 on: October 21, 2010, 03:45:59 PM »
Please tell me there are more items being chromed other than what is in the image further up in this thread for that quote.
Just one more the clutch lever.

I know its a sock in the stomach. For example, the levers are $38 each. The calipers are $117 each, The Caliper mounts are $74 each. And so on. Adds up. (Less 10% discount for Oct).

Worth it to some, not to others. After one gets the parts, the sting wears off and the chrome remains. Then it feels a lot better. I had my swingarm and headlight ears done. $240 and $75 each. Sting completely worn off.
Ride Safe:
Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

Offline mrbreeze

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/10/10- w/ new pics
« Reply #1465 on: October 21, 2010, 10:19:23 PM »
You rock Ron!!!!.....Your bike is gonna be the bomb!!!!! 8) 8) 8)
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Offline MCRider

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/10/10- w/ new pics
« Reply #1466 on: October 24, 2010, 05:00:17 PM »
No Pics tonight. Gotta pack up for a bidnes meeting. But we got our time in. Replaced bearings on trans shafts. reassembled final drive shaft, time flies.

Had to replace the tube in the rear of the CL77 we're babysitting. Real drag pushing it around with a flat tire. We did the front last week. Dang thing must have been original, hard as a rock. Took forever.  The rear is only a few years old, so it came off smoothly, no trouble with the spokes like on the front. Levered it back on and reinstalled.

Years ago I remember changing the tires on Phaedrus 1. I swore i would never do that again. Just getting old I guess. Glad to know I could still do it, with a flexible tire and better (longer) tire irons.

So, more next week.
Ride Safe:
Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

Offline Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/10/10- w/ new pics
« Reply #1467 on: October 24, 2010, 06:05:12 PM »
Make sure Ronnie Brown throws in a free T-shirt for that grand. I got one for quite a bit less  ;)
As of today 3/13/2012 my original owner 75 CB750F has made it through 3 wives, er EX-wives. Free at last.  ;-)

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/10/10- w/ new pics
« Reply #1468 on: October 24, 2010, 06:16:49 PM »
Make sure Ronnie Brown throws in a free T-shirt for that grand. I got one for quite a bit less  ;)
Yeah, I'm getting a Large Blue.   ;D
Ride Safe:
Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/10/10- w/ new pics
« Reply #1469 on: October 31, 2010, 05:50:28 PM »
No new pics. My build buddie Bruce had to take the day off for business seminar. I was gone all week on a business conference, so a little out of step. Ronnie Brown from Brown's called me and we discussed the chroming. From the time they had my official go ahead to the time they had it in the box on its way back was 4 days. Un heard of in the plating industry which is full of flakey operations, especially local. Expect to see the box Monday or Tuesday.

A float bowl got away from the plater I can just see it flying across the shop at high speed, and it broke. They found another from a parts place in CA and will replace it. I talked to the best amateur polisher one time about his methodolgy. He said wear eye and hand protection, from the heat of holding it firmly to the wheel, and when one gets away from you, and it will, get out of the way.

Spent my time trying to restore my shop/garage to efficient status. Week after week of domestic and rental property projects has cluttered it up terribly. Good news is, even after recent purchases, treasury is in good shape.

Should be able to get back in gear next Sunday, full speed. We've got a finish date of Memorial Day 2011. If we make a date, and put some pressure on, maybe we'll make it.

Rather than post irrelevant pictures, I'm going back out to touch up the cylinder paint and finish some cleanup. If we can get the engine together soon, I'll take the tins in for paint.
« Last Edit: October 31, 2010, 05:53:10 PM by MCRider »
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Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/31/10- w/o new pics
« Reply #1470 on: November 01, 2010, 05:51:12 PM »
Yup, parts from Brown's came in today. Liquid bling. Film at 11 (tomorrow.
Ride Safe:
Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/31/10- w/o new pics
« Reply #1471 on: November 04, 2010, 06:35:01 PM »
Chrome from Brown's. Wrapped like meat:

Before:

After:

Beyond the call of duty. These corners were 90deg sharp corners. I had started to radius them with a grinder, and not a good job. Brown's finished them off beautifully, NC:

Love that sidestand:

The end of the brake spindle, usually nasty bare metal. I asked Brown's if they could chrome just the end without fouling the splines where the brakepedal would slide over the chrome. They said yes.


Different subject: New HD Primary Chains from ClassicCycleCity:

Reassembled and installed the late style primary shaft, no chain oiler:


Changed the rear tube in the CL77, water in the tire?!  Weird


Ready for some serious work this weekend!
 
« Last Edit: November 04, 2010, 06:41:09 PM by MCRider »
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1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/31/10- w/o new pics
« Reply #1472 on: November 04, 2010, 06:39:02 PM »


Wow Ron, that chrome looks totally sweet! Like jewelry!! I can't wait to see Phaedrus all duded up & in person someday. (You will take it riding won't you?)  ;D
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You know, a long time ago being crazy meant something. Nowadays everybody's crazy.
Charles Manson

You've got to watch your back in the SSDB, this is where the clever guys get bored with bike talk and make poo jokes.
I like my women a little big. Natural. Now, they shave this and wax that. It's not right. I love natural women. Big women. This trend in women has to go. Bulomia, anorexia. That's just wrong. You know what will cure that? My special sticky buns. One lick of my sticky buns and your appetite will come right back. ~ RIP Mr. Borgnine  01/24/1917 - 07/08/2012  :'(

Offline Frankenkit

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 11/4/10- w/ new pics
« Reply #1473 on: November 04, 2010, 06:40:37 PM »
ohhhh woah.... beautiful, MC.
"Moderation in all things - especially moderation. Too much moderation is excessive. The occasional excess is all part of living the moderate life."
2012 CBR250R "Black Betty"
1980 CB650c- (sold) Delilah
1973 CL350- Lola?
Sweet, bubbly, Buddha - Say it ain't so!!!
Stuff for sale

Offline MCRider

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Re: Phaedrus II: CB750 "Super Standard" - Update 10/31/10- w/o new pics
« Reply #1474 on: November 04, 2010, 06:45:23 PM »


Wow Ron, that chrome looks totally sweet! Like jewelry!! I can't wait to see Phaedrus all duded up & in person someday. (You will take it riding won't you?)  ;D
Thanks! The plan is to ride the freakin wheels off of it. Multi-night touring, hard day rides and drag strip appearances. Hope you can go along!   ;D
Ride Safe:
Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."