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Author Topic: Why does my bike hate Rotella T?  (Read 1831 times)

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Offline Shenanigans

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Why does my bike hate Rotella T?
« on: July 18, 2008, 06:51:28 PM »
Dont worry this is not an oil war thread per se.

So I changed my oil in my 76 550k to Rotella T 15 40 and it has given me some strange tranny issues. First off it is now extremely difficult to to find neutral at a stop however it is easy find if I am rolling. The other issue is that if I am stopped in gear and pull the clutch in my kick starter will not engage and I am left with a limp kicker.  And I then have to roll the bike a bit to get into neutral to kick start it (which is fun in traffic). So is this a symptom of my oil being too thick?
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Offline my78k

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Re: Why does my bike hate Rotella T?
« Reply #1 on: July 18, 2008, 08:52:13 PM »
An oil thread by any other name is still....well you get my point!  ;)  :D

Dennis
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Offline Aaron J Williams

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Re: Why does my bike hate Rotella T?
« Reply #2 on: July 18, 2008, 09:21:41 PM »
How much free play do you have at the clutch lever? Your symptoms sound like dragging clutch to me. I'm running Mobil Delvac 1300 in mine and the only thing I notice is that I can sometimes find neutral between 4th and 5th gear. It has been doing that for years though, so probably not due to running truck oil. ;D
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Offline TwoTired

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Re: Why does my bike hate Rotella T?
« Reply #3 on: July 18, 2008, 10:11:40 PM »
Quote from: Shenanigans on July 18, 2008, 06:51:28 PM
So I changed my oil in my 76 550k to Rotella T 15 40 and it has given me some strange tranny issues. First off it is now extremely difficult to to find neutral at a stop however it is easy find if I am rolling.
Typical clutch drag issue.  Have you adjusted it properly?

Quote from: Shenanigans on July 18, 2008, 06:51:28 PM
The other issue is that if I am stopped in gear and pull the clutch in my kick starter will not engage and I am left with a limp kicker. 
To fix this, you must buy a different bike.  All the 550s need the clutch engaged for the kicker to work.  Has nothing to do with the oil.

Quote from: Shenanigans on July 18, 2008, 06:51:28 PM
And I then have to roll the bike a bit to get into neutral to kick start it (which is fun in traffic). So is this a symptom of my oil being too thick?

Can I refrain from mentioning the operator is too thick?

Oops....  ;D ;D ;D
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Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
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Offline Shenanigans

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Re: Why does my bike hate Rotella T?
« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2008, 12:46:30 AM »
Clutch was out of adjustment which makes sense with my neutral finding problems.


So wait, Is there something fundamentally different from the way a 750 and 550 transmission work? If the bike is not running and in first and I pull in the clutch and then kick it over its designed not to engage? What? That does not make sense  ??? ??? ??? I must be overlooking something painfully obvious or misunderstanding something ???

After messing with it some more it really seems like there is something going on with how the kick starter engages the engine. As while in gear with the bike not running, shouldn't kicking it lurch my bike forward? How can it not lurch it forward? (Assuming the clutch lever is out) It should cause the same result every time I do it under the same circumstances but its not.
A lot of the time and under different conditions (Neutral, in gear, in gear with the clutch lever pulled in) it will sometimes simply not "Catch" the engine and other times it will randomly. I think that it problem just happened to be noticed around the time I changed my oil so I assumed just maybe that it might have to do with it but it seems its a stand alone problem with just the kick starter...



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Offline Hush

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Re: Why does my bike hate Rotella T?
« Reply #5 on: July 19, 2008, 05:00:52 AM »
Not owning a 550 but wanting to understand this issue with the kickstarter, does this mean that the 550 will only allow you to kick it over in neutral?
Most of my other rides kick started in any gear as long as the clutch lever was pulled in.
Is this "not" the case with these 550's?

Oh yeah and the reason I'm soooo dense on this subject is that for some reason about 1979 old man Honda decided that his CB650's would be just fine with only an electric starter!? a fact  most of you will already know.
Now why was this seen as a good idea?
A flat battery leaves you crash starting and many times working on the bike a kicker would have been a real help! ???
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Offline bryanj

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Re: Why does my bike hate Rotella T?
« Reply #6 on: July 19, 2008, 06:10:32 AM »
On the 500/550 the kickstart works on the transmission downstream of the clutch so the clutch must be engaged (I.E a solid lump) to turn the crank, If you are in gear it also turns the wheel.
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Offline TwoTired

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Re: Why does my bike hate Rotella T?
« Reply #7 on: July 19, 2008, 10:19:49 AM »
Quote from: Hush on July 19, 2008, 05:00:52 AM
Not owning a 550 but wanting to understand this issue with the kickstarter, does this mean that the 550 will only allow you to kick it over in neutral?
yes, if you don't want the bike to lurch forward with the kicker.

Quote from: Hush on July 19, 2008, 05:00:52 AM
Most of my other rides kick started in any gear as long as the clutch lever was pulled in.
Is this "not" the case with these 550's?
"Not"

Quote from: Hush on July 19, 2008, 05:00:52 AM
Oh yeah and the reason I'm soooo dense on this subject is that for some reason about 1979 old man Honda decided that his CB650's would be just fine with only an electric starter!? a fact  most of you will already know.
Now why was this seen as a good idea?
Maybe because the Kick start confused too many owners as to its proper operation?   ;D
And, it was cheaper to eliminate it than make an extra note in the owners manual? 
The original SOHC4s copied the English bike styling and was intended to appeal to those looking for that style.  English bikes had kick starters. 
When the 650 came to fruition, the marketplace was changed.  Kick starters were "old".  "Modern" was electric start.

Quote from: Hush on July 19, 2008, 05:00:52 AM
A flat battery leaves you crash starting and many times working on the bike a kicker would have been a real help! ???
Yes, and you don't really need it "in gear" to accomplish that.  Both, bikes were delivered with electric start.  And this works whenever the clutch is pulled in, OR the bike is in neutral.
If you stall the bike in traffic, pull in the clutch and electric start it.  Then drive off.  If your electric start is broken.  Fix it.  With the 550, it is a backup device that allows you to get going again without push starting the bike.  It was never meant to be the primary way of making the engine start.  Honda only copied the english bike styling.  Not it's basic functionality...thank God.

You can still turn the crank with the bike on the center stand, in top gear, and moving the rear wheel, without a kick starter.

Cheers,
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Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
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Offline Shenanigans

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Re: Why does my bike hate Rotella T?
« Reply #8 on: July 19, 2008, 03:27:19 PM »
Is there any particular reason/advantage for the clutch being "downstream" of the starter?
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   This pretty much sums it up.   76' CB592 cafe. 69 750 project, 03 CBR954, 75 750 super sport.
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