Topic: CB 360 and the mystery clutch

[definition]

Hi Everyone!  I hope you will forgive that I have skipped many of the formalities of being a new member in favor of getting my question to you ASAP.  I'm sure we have all been in a position of frustration that has made us do some crazy things--  such as going from secret lurker to poster at some of your favorite message boards.  So, Hi.

So, I disconnected and rerouted my 360's clutch cable yesterday.  It was working perfectly fine before I did this, but the PO had routed it outside of the tree so it was being pushed against my speedometer more than I was comfortable with.  When I reconnected it and tried to adjust it, I found that clutch cable adjustment is just a skill I do not possess.  Here are the symptoms in list order as I encounter them.  Keep in mind that this is a loop that I've been through about 50 or 60 times by now, so it's not likely that the clutch cable is broken, like people keep suggesting to me 

1.  loosen lock nut on clutch adjuster, turn adjuster all the way to the right.  Doing this makes the lever loose.  I can pull it in very easily and it will slowly return out.  It is obviously not engaging the clutch at all, as it shouldn't be.  I think this is normal

2.  turn the adjuster to the left until I feel some resistance.  Pull the clutch lever half-way in.  When I do this, the clutch lever feels more normal.  It takes more hand power to pull the lever in and it is obviously disengaging the clutch plates.  I can more easily move the bike back and forth while in gear also, so we know that is working.

3.  lock the lock nut down.  pull the clutch lever all the way in.  Sometimes this works for a few pulls, but sometimes it fails right away.  The fail happens as I pull the lever all the way in--  there is a popping noise and the lever goes completely slack.  the lever no longer returns to normal position when I let go of it, it just sits there, floppy and useless.  The bike now moves around in gear pretty easily, like the clutch lever was pulled in.

4.  unlock the lock nut, move the adjuster to the right a couple of turns.  as soon as I start moving the adjuster to the right even a tiny bit, you can see the lever stiffen up and start to return to neutral position.

5.  repeat from step 1. changing the amount of tension in the adjuster screw every time to see if maybe that helps.


I have taken the side cover off and checked the clutch actuator assembly.  Everything looked OK in there from what I could tell.  I added some more grease to everything and oiled the spring that pulls against the cable.  I checked the bearings and they all spin in the holding plate OK and the big bearing in the center of the assembly that pushes against the rod is in place.

I am completely baffled by this!  I hope someone here has some advice.

[crazypj]

Are you moving the adjuster screw in the  middle of cover or the cable adjuster on the top?
 Screw the cable adjuster all the way in before you adjust the operating arm adjuster then adjust it for about 3mm at pivot end of lever
PJ

[definition]

I don't know much about the cable adjuster on the top, so I did the 5 steps above using the one in the middle of the case with the top cable adjuster in three positions:  all the way in, half-way out and almost fully out.  (out being the two adjusting nuts are about 1.5 inches apart, in being that they are touching and the threads for the cable housing are completely inside of the side cover body).



Do you mean to adjust screw labeled 6 in the above diagram (what I've been calling the clutch adjuster until now) to 3mm?  Would I do that by turning left until it gets tension and then back right 3mm?  If so, when I do that, there is not enough tension on the lever and nothing disengages when I pull the lever in.  It's no better of than if the screw were all the way to the right (step 1 in my loop of hell).

[crazypj]

Nope,  Screw cable adjuster all the way down into case.
adjuster screw 6 turned counter clockwise until it 'lightly seats' than back it off about 1/8th turn.(clockwise)
 Adjust cable screw until you have about 3mm at handlebar lever pivot or about 20mm at tip of lever.
 Ball bearing No 21 is in place?
PJ

[definition]

Yep, bearing 21 is in place.  I'm glad to know that the cable adjuster should be all the way down in the case, that's how I've had it for most of my troubleshooting so far.

I did the screw 6 counter-clockwise until slight resistance and then backed off a little and the lever is just too loose when I do that.  So I've been going past the point of "slight resistance" to "pretty decent resistance" and I've been fiddling with it in that area.

The cable stopper at the lever is set so that it's half-way out..  is that what you mean by "Adjust cable screw until you have about 3mm at handlebar lever pivot or about 20mm at tip of lever"?  Or, do you mean the cable adjuster at the top of the case?

so the steps would be:

1.  put cable adjuster at top of case all the way down
2.  adjust the screw 6 until it lightly seats, then back off 1/8th turn
3.  adjust cable adjuster at the top of the case outwards until the handlebars have 3mm slack in the cable?

Thanks again for answering my questions.  I love being able to talk about this stuff..  my wife thinks the whole ordeal is boring and zones out when I try to talk about motorcycles.

[crazypj]

You got it.
 You have to do 2 adjustments, one on mechanism and one on cable.
The cable is a stock length, the adjuster (#6) takes up slack between push piece and pushrod in the lifting mechanism,even if you don't have a cable fitted.
When adjusted properly you then have to adjust cable to the lifting mechanism (that's probably a more confusing explanation?)
 Judging from the amount of posts on clutches not working right your not alone with adjustment problems
PJ

[definition]

I think I got it!

I did a bit of what what you suggested, and that seems to have made the difference.  In addition, I also put a washer between the outer casing and the ramp piece (#7) to get it a little closer to the push rod.  Then, I adjusted #6 correctly and fiddled with the housing adjustments at the top of the case and at the lever until there was just enough slack so that when I pulled the lever all of the way in, it wouldn't pop off the ramps.

Then I took it for a test ride, and after a few blocks, it popped out again..  BUT, it did something it hadn't done before.  When I let off of the lever, I could feel the bearings slip back onto the ramps and get resistance back.  I knew I was close to having it when that happened, so I just turned the cable housing at the lever a little bit so there would be more slack in the cable and it's been perfect ever since.  Phew!  I wasn't looking forward to walking the bike back up the hill to my house, again.

And I think the reason it was so difficult to adjust is that my ramp piece is almost shot.  The ramps aren't hard angles at the top like I think they should be, there are very pronounced grooves at the top of the ramps where it looks like the bearings have worn the metal away making it easier for them to pop out of the ramps.  I wouldn't be surprised considering there was practically no grease in there at all when I first cracked it open.

So, that's my courageous story.  I thank this forum for its help, especially crazypj!  And I hope anyone else having this problem can search google and find this thread.

[crazypj]

They all look like that. The bearing is probably the wrong size if you needto space ot the inner mech. I'll try and get some pics for you.
 PJ