Topic: What it required to build the Hot Rod engine...

[sparty]

A few guys asked me to post this information.  I finally had time to type it up.

As you can see, nothing went untouched 

Top End Parts and Labor:
Megacycle 125-75 Cam
Megacycle Adj. Camshaft Sprocket
Kibblewhite Ti Valve spring retainers
Kibblewhite H-D racing valve spring springs and retainers
Kibblewhite bronze valve guides
EV8 Polished SS oversized intake valves 33.5mm
EV8 Polished SS exhaust valves 28mm
New OEM Honda Rocker Arms
New OEM Honda valve seals
Tsubaki H-D cam chain
M3 Racing can chain tensioner
APE H-D Top End Studs
JMR Stage 3 Head porting, polish, and mill
Serdi valve job
Head bead blasted
New OEM Honda intake manifolds + modified air fittings
New OEM Honda Intake manifold clamps
Balanced Alt. rotor and clutch basket
Cut & polish SS allen bolt head set

Bottom End Parts and Labor:
Wiesco 836cc Piston Kit
Falicon Knife Edge connecting rods with ARP premium bolts
New OEM Honda cam bearings
New OEM Rod bearings
Swain Tech piston coatings (TBC & PC-9)
APE H-D Bottom end bolt kit
JMR Cylinder decking (total squish .053)
New OEM Honda primary chain tensioner
JMR Bore and Hone cylinders (top cut .014 and recut o’ring c’bores)
APE lightened and balanced crankshaft (balanced for sustained operation to 14,000RPM)
Barnett H-D clutch springs
New OEM Honda clutch fibers and disks
FAST by GAST undercut transmission
New OEM Honda gaskets and oil seals, dowels, misc. parts
Bead blast cylinder head
Paint engine case
Polish all side covers and cam cover
New OEM Honda bolts for engine case
Rocker arm threaded adjusters
New OEM Honda cam guide

Fuel and Ignition Parts:
Keihin CR carbs 29mm
Dyna 2000 electronic ignition w/ 3 ohm coils
Dyna suppression wires
Denso Iridium plugs
K&N Oval air pods
K&N crankcase filter

The sum of all the above: 90+ HP and a big 

Art

[nickjtc]

Remind us what it looked like, please.

[sparty]

Remind us what it looked like, please.

From this:


To this:

[Really?]

That just goes to show what effect this place and these bikes have on ya, geez!   

[scondon]

 You forgot to list the "shovel", Sparty. The one used to keep the build fund fires well stoked with green. Some can only dream, but you....you did it. Thank you

[nickjtc]

I kneel in awe before the altar of a master.

[sparty]

You forgot to list the "shovel", Sparty. The one used to keep the build fund fires well stoked with green. Some can only dream, but you....you did it. Thank you

You know the world is ending in 2012 so you need to make those dreams come true.

I started a small side business 6 years ago to fund my dreams.  Now I am starting to gather parts for my next come true dream - the '32 Deuce roadster RAT ROD.  But it looks like it will not be finished until 2013.   Damn those Roush engines are expensive!

Art

[andy750]

And it looked as good in person Art! I can only wait until I see the running bike ;-)

Looking forward to the Hot Rod build!

cheers
Andy

[Industrial Cafe]

how much are those falicon rods, for a set?

[Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er]

Art,

It's been a somewhat boring and uneventful winter without you and Seaweb 

Have you thought about picking up a used Roush Nascar engine?

Do you have a final $/HP (dollar per HP) figure?

[WHALEMAN]

What is the brand and model of your shocks used in your build and do you like them? Dan

[sparty]

What is the brand and model of your shocks used in your build and do you like them? Dan

The shocks are YSS Z-366 TRL

They are a bit of overkill, but so is everything else on the bike. 

My wife nicknamed me "overkill" when we met 10 years ago, because she believes that anything that I fix, install, build, buy, modify, research, or just do is done to the extreme.  I however think that this is only one way to do things.

[sparty]

Art,

It's been a somewhat boring and uneventful winter without you and Seaweb 

Have you thought about picking up a used Roush Nascar engine?

Do you have a final $/HP (dollar per HP) figure?

I never considered picking up a used Roush Nascar engine, I may look into it.

Final $/HP figure = PRICELESS

[fuzzybutt]

You forgot to list the "shovel", Sparty. The one used to keep the build fund fires well stoked with green. Some can only dream, but you....you did it. Thank you

You know the world is ending in 2012 so you need to make those dreams come true.

I started a small side business 6 years ago to fund my dreams.  Now I am starting to gather parts for my next come true dream - the '32 Deuce roadster RAT ROD.  But it looks like it will not be finished until 2013.   Damn those Roush engines are expensive!

Art

c'mon art, it needs a flathead!
 seriously though, is the hotrod motor happy on pump gas?

[ekim98]

 Geez, I though you were really going to build something that runs great. Only a 30+ HP gain, like why even bother. I was happy just to get mine running good and your just taking all the thunder. Excellent job Sparty.

[paulages]

 Geez, I though you were really going to build something that runs great. Only a 30+ HP gain, like why even bother. I was happy just to get mine running good and your just taking all the thunder. Excellent job Sparty.

only +30HP? i got +35 out of the 718...   

[Spikeybike]

i think my favorite part of the hot rod , is the that you got the carpy gauge faces, ... but not the ones that say "cafe" on um ....        i didn't even know carpy did that until your bike



and yes ,  a Deuce needs a flathead , (or a Rocket)

[MRieck]

 Geez, I though you were really going to build something that runs great. Only a 30+ HP gain, like why even bother. I was happy just to get mine running good and your just taking all the thunder. Excellent job Sparty.

I'd say well over a 40HP gain as the stock 750 is lucky to have 50HP to the rear wheel on it's best day. Over an 80% increase in rear wheel HP with only a 14% increase in capacity....that's the important part.

[paulages]

 Geez, I though you were really going to build something that runs great. Only a 30+ HP gain, like why even bother. I was happy just to get mine running good and your just taking all the thunder. Excellent job Sparty.

I'd say well over a 40HP gain as the stock 750 is lucky to have 50HP to the rear wheel on it's best day. Over an 80% increase in rear wheel HP with only a 14% increase in capacity....that's the important part.

mike- i know you were the one i was actually teasing... believe me, i know that engine would spank mine up and down the block. 

[MRieck]

 Geez, I though you were really going to build something that runs great. Only a 30+ HP gain, like why even bother. I was happy just to get mine running good and your just taking all the thunder. Excellent job Sparty.

I'd say well over a 40HP gain as the stock 750 is lucky to have 50HP to the rear wheel on it's best day. Over an 80% increase in rear wheel HP with only a 14% increase in capacity....that's the important part.

mike- i know you were the one i was actually teasing... believe me, i know that engine would spank mine up and down the block. 

Sure Paul. Seeing how Art weighs about 155lbs he would beat me too.

[lordmoonpie]

C'mon Art - you got to give us a $/HP figure....if your wife likes extreme overkill maybe she'd take a shine to some of us 

[Jim F]

Well................you guys know the old saying?

Speed costs.................how fast do you want to go

He spent the money OK

This motor should just rip
wow

Big-Jim 

[sparty]

C'mon Art - you got to give us a $/HP figure....if your wife likes extreme overkill maybe she'd take a shine to some of us 

Okay, calculator is in hand, going though costs of just the engine build....  looks like $77.00 per HP.  Damn, now I see just how much money it took... still PRICELESS as few others have what I have.  Now, I am figuring the cost of the 32' Deuce Rat Rod $/HP.  Let's see... I would like a 500 HP engine so..... looks like about $90.00 per HP.  Heck the CB HOT ROD is a bargain.

[ekim98]

Even based on 65/67 hp at the crank a 30+ hp increase is nothing to sneeze at in my book. Plus the added reliabilty with the upgraded studs, chains,blanceing<sp? and the quicker reving abilty gives him one hell of an overall increase in performance across the board. I figure next year we might get a better idea just how much he can get from all the work that has been done. If he can afford the tires he will go thru. And yes I'm jealous.

[MRieck]

Even based on 65/67 hp at the crank a 30+ hp increase is nothing to sneeze at in my book. Plus the added reliabilty with the upgraded studs, chains,blanceing<sp? and the quicker reving abilty gives him one hell of an overall increase in performance across the board. I figure next year we might get a better idea just how much he can get from all the work that has been done. If he can afford the tires he will go thru. And yes I'm jealous.

Yep. He already put the bike in the 11's if I remember correctly and that was on a cold track and it was his first time doing it.

[sparty]

Even based on 65/67 hp at the crank a 30+ hp increase is nothing to sneeze at in my book. Plus the added reliabilty with the upgraded studs, chains,blanceing<sp? and the quicker reving abilty gives him one hell of an overall increase in performance across the board. I figure next year we might get a better idea just how much he can get from all the work that has been done. If he can afford the tires he will go thru. And yes I'm jealous.

Yep. He already put the bike in the 11's if I remember correctly and that was on a cold track and it was his first time doing it.

High 11's.  Poor start, track was good.  60 foot mark stunk.

[Retro Rocket]

Mine used to run mid 10 secs and was only 778cc, it had the early 31 keihin smoothbores and ran on methanol.....I am hoping to take this one out to 970cc with lower compression as it was sky high for the methanol. Should be fun...

Mick

[ekim98]

Even based on 65/67 hp at the crank a 30+ hp increase is nothing to sneeze at in my book. Plus the added reliabilty with the upgraded studs, chains,blanceing<sp? and the quicker reving abilty gives him one hell of an overall increase in performance across the board. I figure next year we might get a better idea just how much he can get from all the work that has been done. If he can afford the tires he will go thru. And yes I'm jealous.

Yep. He already put the bike in the 11's if I remember correctly and that was on a cold track and it was his first time doing it.

High 11's.  Poor start, track was good.  60 foot mark stunk.

I'm sure once you get a better feel for launching your times will drop. Mine is no where near the rocket you have but the bike still had more than I was willing to ring out of it. Drag racing is a learn art and each bike presents it own set of demons to be overcome. You will master the beast. 

[754]

Why the stock clutch? what was the reasoning?

[seaweb11]

Hey there Sparty, we really do need to meet and have a beer some day;D

[sparty]

Why the stock clutch? what was the reasoning?

H-D clutch springs with OEM stock fibers and disks have been shown to work better than aftermarket fibers.  Why I don't really know.

[MRieck]

Why the stock clutch? what was the reasoning?

H-D clutch springs with OEM stock fibers and disks have been shown to work better than aftermarket fibers.  Why I don't really know.

Extra plate clutch packs are too thick and are a PITA on the street. The fiber material on aftermarket pieces is not as good as OEM as it wears more quickly and releases itself into the oil. All the roadracers and dragracers I know use OEM plates OR plates made exactly like the OEM fibers (look on Gasts's website). I have installed Hyperplates (cyro aged aluminum "steel" plates) in roadracers and some street bikes BUT have had some problems with them in regard to thickness. The Barnett springs work very well with the OEM clutch. I've had this conversation with a lot of guys. Buzz at Dynoman (who has been dragracing these bikes since they came out) is on the same page as me concerning clutch packs.

[754]

So how long does the  Honda plates last when you come off the line at 8K and slip it for the first 30 feet?

[lordmoonpie]

All the roadracers and dragracers I know use OEM plates OR plates made exactly like the OEM fibers (look on Gasts's website).

Got to agree with you there Mike - I had a good conversation with Mark at M3 about this and he swears only OEM clutch plates can handle the race punishment of an M3 CR750 engine...

[MRieck]

So how long does the  Honda plates last when you come off the line at 8K and slip it for the first 30 feet?

I'd say they last as long as any fiber plate out there. Like I said in my previous post....all the old Honda, Suzuki and Kawasaki dragracers I've ever met use OEM or OEM type plates. That also includes modern stuff like busa's etc. How material comes off a set of Barnett plates and ends up chewing up the oil pump? Plus...like I said...the Barnett extra plate packs are too thick. I always found the engagement point wasn't that good (on or off) and they made finding neutral a real PITA on the street. I haven't had any clutch slip problems with OEM after installing the Barnett springs.
 I remember reading a story about Sims and Rohm building some big NA GSXR engine for a Motorcyclist bike shoot out. Long story short they lunched the engine at the dragstrip secondary burning out the clutch. They replaced the clutch pack BUT the Barnett clutch material had clogged the oil pump.

[JLeather]

What did you do about your oil pump?  Did you just inspect the old one and hope for the best?  Is anyone out there actually reconditioning oil pumps?

[754]

Are you talking Barnett Kevlar clutches, or the older style?

I doubt I have had a Kevlar one in my bike.

how much stuff in the oil are we talking, I change mine quite a bit, and inspect it and would see it.

I am thinking of trying an APE one, if I can afford to ship it.

I found a lot of guys racinglet out the cluch much faster than I do, more or less dumpong it. Usually the first thing I would do on a stock bike was change the springs with stock plates, and they never seemed to shift hard nor last very long.

[lordmoonpie]

Of course you can solve the oile pump problem by doing a dry clutch conversion...it just might be a big job